Dummies Guide to Rigging a Speargun

[Pastor]

6 Wraps of bungee? How thick is this stuff?

[blaiz]

Originally Posted by Pastor

6 Wraps of bungee? How thick is this stuff?

I think he said it was 3mm thick and they tested it up to 200lbs but chickened out after that

[miles]

Hiya

loading is a cinch even with 6 wraps cuz you double the bungee and wrap 3 times...another benefit is the distance you can pull out of it...it might be 6,9,12 ft but stretched its 12, 18, 24 or more depending on the bungee.

Settingsteel, what are the advantages to using this type of set-up? I've played around with bungees of various type and they all have some inherent problems. Abrasion resistance is one of them. I've seen 10kg mono fishing line cut a 12mm bungee like a hot knife going through butter. Both the spearo and the line fisherman had fish on and their lines crossed. The fisherman still landed his fish!!

Another problem i've found with bungees is that they stretch!! Seriously, a 8mm bungee stretches out to such a thin diameter, that my hands start cramping, trying to grip it. With 3mm bungee, it'll stretch out to VERY thin, making gripping it difficult.

My biggest concern how-ever is that you can't control your fish with the set-up mentioned above. Imagine shooting a yellowtail kingfish over a wreck or pinnacle or in the kelp beds. How are you going to be able to stop the fish from reefing or entagling you? The bungee then works in the fish's favour. Similarly, you shoot a grouper type fish in a cave. How do you stop him from swimming very deep into the cave and cutting the bungee?

I'd love to see your set-up though!! I'm obviously missing something here!! What type of hunting does this set-up work well for?

Regards
miles

[Mr. X]

Foxfish, I'm beginning to get the impression that the power of the Mamba is a liability as much as a benefit. The Mamba sounds like perfect gun to try the bungee spear-line -- a real long, strong one.

Originally Posted by settingsteel

loading is a cinch even with 6 wraps cuz you double the bungee and wrap 3 times...another benefit is the distance you can pull out of it...it might be 6,9,12 ft but stretched its 12, 18, 24 or more depending on the bungee.

6 wraps?!! A double wrap is unusual & not usually recommended over here. Presumably you're using one of your powerful multi-band woodies? Can't quite picture how you double the bungee but I dare say I could work it out.

I think I'll give it a try when I next replace my spear-line (the Omer spear-line is more scuffed up after two dives than the RAs was after two years). I'd like to get an extra foot or two of range on the 75.

BTW apnea sent me a Beuchat muzzle bungee & swivel clip with a replacement Omer mono stringer yesterday. Looks pretty cool, smaller & lighter than the RA (esp. the swivel clip) although the max. stretch is much more limited.

Some shots of my new muzzle bungees (click just once to expand - neat new feature):

[settingsteel]

Most of the fish we're shooting here in Miami/Keys are reef variety. The largest I've taken with this set up (that is bungee attached to shaft and gun) was a black about 30'ish pounds (38# to be exact). Like I had mentioned I now attach about 1 gun length of dyneema as a "leader", prior to this I use to use the entire length as 2-3mm bungie, truthfully I prefer the all bungee setup (loads faster), but price has gunned up (on the bungee) so I now add some dyneema...on the average while reef shooting 1 marine grade bungee lasted an entire summer plus, although the sleeve was frayed it still held up to all the fish we shot. I just made it a habit of changing it when it was overly frayed...it never "visually" reached the rubber.

I think in ever system (reel, floatline, and now the my bungee setup) their are pro's and con's, and the reality of "personal preference" which I think is the main driver. I shoot a fish in the reef and it bolts (rarely since most shots result in stoned fish) the bungee absorbs the initial run if he holes up its about the same scene that would have happened if you used a reel or FL...if you add to much pressure to soon their is a greater chance of tear out...thats why the conventional line & segment of rubber bungie originated.

The way I do it is I shoot a fish and if my lungs permit I'm on him before I head up and we go up t/g holding hands...if lungs are not up to it I swim up with gun in hand as The bungie stretches this of course creates a greater resistance (the same dynamics applied to a tuna in Miles tuna float/bungie set up) the fish gives a bit the bungee stretches abit...larilala...most always the stretch allows me to reach the surface (I switch my bungeeline according to my depth, as I mentioned previously...beyond 40' I switch to HBW or gun to float, but still use the shaft-bungee-gun attachement) Why do I like this set up? mainly because I don't have a bunch of line around the reef when a fish is shot as in a reel or FL. Remember the bungee is say 6' but stretched its 18' (lets say) so you have 6' of grief (potential tangling) but 18' of savior.
In the environment that we hunt in this system ABSOLUTELY kicks!!! Every spearo that tries it says "damn why didn't anyone else think of this before" IMHO controlling a fish is when you got him by the gills...the rest is the fight and a bungee really does aid in this aspect. When I am in deeper water I Either attach the gun to my FL or rig breakaway, but I still have the bungee set up directly from arrow to gun. Last year I shot 2 mahis with one shot both went ballistic bungee stretching in opposite ways at the same time, and to top it off the tip did not go clear thru the end fish...that particular fish died purdy fast since it had the tip lodged in its gills...the other fish fought quite some but both fish were bought up and released, into the ice box...the full line bungee set up works well FOR ME...I would never consider using anything other than this set up-period- thats how happy I am with the results to date...so I'll repeat if you guys have any doubt just get some marine bungee 1 double wrap and try it out...it'sal...then head on back and post your results...Again I'm not saying this is the best system, or shooting Shzit "mine is better than yours"....remember it all boils down to personal preference and style...I've been using it for years, I like it, it works for me, and most of the spearo's I've turned on to it have forever continued using it...why no one else has ever thought of this before (or posted on a public forum) beats me...but thinking about it I have for years been using this set up and now just by chance have referenced it.

I'll try to post some pix soon so you guys can see what this crazy cuban is raving 'bout

[miles]

NICE!!!

Fairly recently i've started using something similar.

We dive mostly in 20m (60') of water, drifting with the strong currents over reefs, pinnacles or wrecks, spearing yellowtail, either on the bottom or mid-water or around structure.

We started off with floatlines. Problem is that yellowtail swim in schools, so we normally have 3 divers in the water and the 4th keeps the boat close by. Tangling of floatlines was common, but the biggest downfall is that when a shark arrives and we have to get out in a hurry, your floatline ALWAYS seems to be attracted to the boats prop's!!

Next bet, reelguns. The 2.0mm dyneema was simly too thin and slippery to grip AND swim your fish away from an obstruction (reef/wreck/kelp). Bumped it up to 3.0mm and this worked fine. The downside is slow reloading, especially after spearing a fish and slow retrieval of line when a fish has made a long run. Sorting out the tangles just took too long.

We now use a 7m (20') bungee attached to the rear of the gun, with a small pull-under float at the other end. This allows you to spear a fish on or close to a wreck/reef and bully him off it. Should you run out of air, you then have the short 7m (20') bungee, which streches out to 14-15m (50'), to help you!! Been working very, very well!!

Unfortunately, yellowtail are always moving and its rare that the largest fish in the school will be closest to you. Thats why stone shots are very uncommon. Very often, you just surface and hear a gun go off and have to grab a mouthfull of air and get down there to spear a fish in the school. No time for proper breath-up, just gulp some air and dive!! With such limited air, coupled to the excitment, your bottom time is crap, which means many rushed and poorly placed shots!!

With yellowtail, our prime target species, give him an inch of line and he'll wrap you up in the closest obstruction, bending your spear and possibly cutting your shooting line or tearing off.

Please post a pic, as i'd be very keen to rig up one of my guns this way!! Always good to experiment!!

Regards
miles

[felipe felop]

this is a great thread,there is something that is underlying about it that strikes me though, its either floatline only,floatline/reel or breakaway/ bungee & also where & what your target species is,i guess most people will be using a float or a remote weighted float for safety reasons,griffs idea was great but i had a lot of tangles especially in eddies & swirling rolling water,what works for me is to tie a hangmans knot with a piece of paracord on the floatline at a set distance from the float presuming you know the depth, cos you recced your dive location & then added the required length on the floatline to a set depth so that your not overstepping your limits ,then tie another hangman knot on the other end of the paracord,wind your floatline round your thumb/forefinger & elbow then gather the looped ends & pass it through the loop of the hangman knot & pull it tight, that way your floatline be shorter less chance of prop tangle,itwill also pull out of the loop easily with a deeper dive & when the line is recovered the loop of the hangmans knot is still big enough to get your gloved thumb into to reinsert your floatline without having to make new loops to hold your floatline whilst in moving water.I will post a picture when i learn how to very shortly if this is confusing, it does work well but takes a bit of practice with a gloved hand but very simple if your not wearing gloves

[Mr. X]

Just a quick update on the 3mm bungee. I speared 2 mullet a couple of weeks ago using a double wrap with the second wrap made of 3mm bungee. It worked fine. I didn't need the extra range offered for the mullet but did for a bass shot (missed, difficult shot). I must admit, I landed the first (larger) mullet pretty darn quickly because the shot was more aft than normal and I didn't want to test the strength & resilience of the bungee on such a large, potentially fiesty fish so soon.

[rookie H2O]

i am new to the sport went out onice and got hooked... i have notice some guns the rig is tied to the back of the shaft and like mine ( ab biller) use sliding ring that start in the front of shaft and also diff. between mono & spear line

[blaiz]

Originally Posted by rookie H2O

i am new to the sport went out onice and got hooked... i have notice some guns the rig is tied to the back of the shaft and like mine ( ab biller) use sliding ring that start in the front of shaft and also diff. between mono & spear line

Not quite sure if this is a question or not but Ill answer it anyway The difference between mono and spear line (shooting line) is nothing. Mono is just a type of material used to make a shooting line. Some use SS cable, Some us a few wraps of bungee. Its all personal preference. I use two wraps of #250 mono with a short 1' bungee and then its connected to a reel.

The slide ring set up you speak of is common on ab billers and JBLs. They are ok but can be noisy. Most euro guns and some american guns have the shooting line connected to the back of the spear shaft. Makes for easier loading and quieter shots.

[settingsteel]

Originally Posted by Mr. X

Just a quick update on the 3mm bungee. I speared 2 mullet a couple of weeks ago using a double wrap with the second wrap made of 3mm bungee. It worked fine. I didn't need the extra range offered for the mullet but did for a bass shot (missed, difficult shot). I must admit, I landed the first (larger) mullet pretty darn quickly because the shot was more aft than normal and I didn't want to test the strength & resilience of the bungee on such a large, potentially fiesty fish so soon.

Awexome glad to hear you liked the bungee, in the miami sx all the fish you see there are all shot with that bungee/dyneema leader set up...one thing in particular is it loads quite fast, which is always a plus!

[rookie H2O]

thank you it was a question. my self i do like the wooden look of it. maybe next yr or so i am hoping for riffe 55in if i get a friend into blue water but we will see.. him and his bother are into the reef and never stay in a spot longer then 30min to 45min

[settingsteel]

Just an update on the bungee set up... I switched back to the full bungee minus the dyneema leader, seems to flow better and it holds up well enough that when it gets too fugly (frayed) to be replaced it has pretty much paid for itself...

[_myles_]

thanks man helped heaps!

[Mr. X]

Originally Posted by settingsteel

Just an update on the bungee set up... I switched back to the full bungee minus the dyneema leader, seems to flow better and it holds up well enough that when it gets too fugly (frayed) to be replaced it has pretty much paid for itself...

How do you attach the bungee to the spear - crimp a loop or use a thumb knot as a stopper?

Just got back from a week in S. Devon & the 3mm bungee is doing just find - although I lost one nice size mullet when I let it play on the elastic way too long. Pulled it right in twice while I tried to decide how best to deal with it (wasn't thinking straight, tired at the end of a long, choppy, poor vis. session). Last year the grit/sand in the S. Devon water jammed up my RA railgun -- this year its done the same to my Omer , although only since my return - it performed faultlessly on holiday.