Getting too old for this...

[josedesucre]

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"And who on Earth would spin propaganda, as you put it, of this sort? And why ?"

Paul: sorry, but I'll have to ask: do you know anything about what you are talking about?
You came out with some statements about infant mortality and why international health statistics could be misleading, but ... you did not sourced that statement, you did not documented it in any way, and then you accused Greendiver of not having put forward "a single documented fact"!
In my previous post I tried to be more subtle but obviously you didn't get it. The fact is that international health statistics are the final product of years of hard work by experts of many countries, and must be deemed reliable unless anyone come with hard evidence to prove the contrary. The methodology have been discussed in many conferences and finally agreed to and put in practice with the help of the best experts on the field, working for the WHO and governments health departments all over the world. I covered some of those conferences, as a journalist. WHO have offices or delegations in every country or territory of the world, training people, helping fight diseases, and yes collecting the data that helps focus their efforts. If anything, the only concern would be that governments could try to "cook" the data to try to show better results in terms of life expectancy, not worst. But that is not likely because in today's world there are many NGOs that are watching, not to mention the press. In any case, the statistics clearly diferentiate about the causes of death, ages, etc. So your allegations about infant mortality that allegedly could "skew" the statistics are simply wrong.
And BTW, the fact that people around the Mediterranean live healthier and longer lives have been the object of innumerable studies and profusely documented in the press. I don't see how you can possible dispute that.

[Paul Kotik]

Look, this doesn't interest me. The definition and calculation of the arithmetic mean is non-controversial. That distributions differ with respect to arithmetic mean, variance, skewness, and kurtosis is non-controversial.

The statement "the mean life expectancy in Country A is greater than the mean life expectancy is Country B" does not mean the same thing as "people in Country A live longer than they do in Country B". The latter proposition doesn't mean any particular thing at all.

Comparison of the means of distributions is meaningful only with respect to the variances of the distributions, and then only under assumptions about comparable skewness and kurtosis, for example, that both distributions are normal (Gaussian) distributions.

That definitions of 'live birth' vary from jurisdiction to jurisdiction is non-controversial.

This is all so very old and boring. It was old and boring when I was a doctoral student in the social sciences 30 years ago, and it's boring now.

If it makes you happy to think that people in Spain live longer - be my guest. It's a meaningless proposition. Live long, yourself - and prosper.

The notion that WHO is any sort of reliable source of data is hilarious, though. Thanks for the chuckle.

I see by your investment of time and your vehemence that this matter has some sort of emotional content for you. Be at peace, amigo. By the way, I heard on the radio today that the world's oldest person died yesterday. He was a resident of Puerto Rico. Is that in Spain? Sounds like it.

[icarus pacific]

Originally Posted by Paul Kotik

Look, this doesn't interest me.

Nor me, all that much. So could we please just leave this thread to it's original intent?!

Gracias.

[Fondueset]

I think the Daoists are best at this, though only the very old ones.

Paul, I have visited your website and can find no problem. Carry on.




"There is nothing that is not made more humourous by adding a duck.."

[josedesucre]

Sorry Sven, but this is actually one of the activities that allow us oldies to keep our tired neurons from deteriorating even more rapidly
====================
Paul, you certainly put in evidence your doctoral knowledge about statistics, but at the same time showed an attitude that can only be described as patronizing (with a tinge of petulancy?), by dismissing the work of the WHO. I have been an international correspondent for 36 years and never met anyone that considers "hilarious" the work they do. On the contrary, I know that there is many serious, dedicated individuals that work very hard there trying to protect and improve the health of some of the more at risk people on earth.
BTW, I am not from Spain or even the Mediterranean area, and I don't live there, although I know the area well and enjoy every visit. Cheers.

[icarus pacific]

I understand, but this oldie's nuerons are here to enjoy the dialogue about diving. I harbor no ill will to either of your demonstrations of articulage however pedantic, (See, I know big words too ) but let's keep this thread about the subject. Either of you learned types want to discuss this, open another thread. Elsewhere.

Again, gracias.

[Fondueset]

Sure enough democracy is no way to run a BBS but I'll cast my vote regardless. Personally I'm diggin' the flow here - particularly because we're all mature enough not to erupt. As a metaphor an often overlooked characteristic of rivers is rapids. Seems a shame to take the boat out just when things are getting interesting.

[ocean_314]

You guys are hysterical thanks for the laugh. My wife is one of them more proment Epidemiologists in the US. Please get the proper knowledege and get back to the subject of this thread.
I am turning 49 in April. I freedive in the water of Northern California. I do not use a tube i strap my ab iron catch bag and a stringer to an extra weight belt with no weights. My average time in the water is between 2.5 to 3 hours before i run out of engery. I will do between 20 to 30 dives from the surface to 20-30ft of water. On an average day i will get 15 to 20 fish and a limit of abalone(3). I use a polespear but i am rigging a holster up for a phneumatic speargun i bought, so i can get the big fish i see.
Its all diet and exercise. I eat a almost non fat diet, lots of veges no frying of anything no processed meat.I shoot a deer every year and thats our red meat. l lift heavy weights a couple of times a week and walk 2 miles in a river with a good current steelhead fishing in the winter. My wife and i belong to a tango dance club and many times i will go dancing the night before or after diving, its high energy and really fun.
Am i in great shape, hell yes ! i just dove for crabs yesterday with a compresser and air hose. We feasted!

[island_sands]

i ran/walked/jogged about 12km yesterday, biked 7km - and then went and had my thighs pummelled again

The six meals a day is going well, I am never hungry and also feel that my appetite is decreasing somewhat. It has been about 10 days - feeling fitter and getting fitter but notice no change in the body

[Cornholio]

FWIW, I'll soon be 37 and try to take an 'all things in moderation' approach to life. I cycle to work when I can, but still use the car when it suits me. I try to eat the healthier things, but we enjoy the occasional carry-out. I try not to get drunk, but am a big fan of real ale. You get the idea.

I'll come back to this post when I'm 70 and let you all know how it has worked out

Mrs C and I would love to live in Spain (or, dare I say it, Portugal). The lifestyle really is far more agreeable than that here in the UK. Mum recently moved to a remote hamlet in France and her health has improved dramatically.

[greendiver]

OK guys!!, No more of this!!, I just think that the mediterenean diet is a very healthy one, THAT´S ALL!!

PS. you can find this anywhere on the internet, I did not invent this!!

[Fondueset]

Ocean - are you holstering a loaded pneumatic!! You realize most ugly speargun accidents happen with those little buggers.
That's about my endurance in 50F water - though I can go all day if I have a snack and the sun is out. Assuming a 6 mil suit. This time of year here I'm good for 2 hours or so with air in the 20sF and water 36F as long as I've got something interesting going. I'll start shivering mildly on the surface but still have quite a bit of time left before it starts to impact my bottom times. When I find myself shivering during breath-holds it's pretty much time to go in.

Sands, I want you to know how painful it is for me to refrain from saying anything about your thighs and pummelling.

[ocean_314]

I forgot to tell you about a 75 year old i go out fishing in the ocean with once in a while. We launch his Zodaic off the beach.
He and his brother go to Mexico every year diving and spearfishing. He also Noodles for flathead catfish every year. This guy has his onw compresser fills his own tanks at home. He is tough as nails and can probally out dive most of the people in N. Calif.
He gets lots and lots of exercise all his life that and a healthy diet are the key.