New STA record attempt pending

[Monkey Matt]

A fantastic achievement but why did he choose to only make it an AIDA National record but claim a non AIDA World Record?
If Mifsud had followed the AIDA rules for a world record instead of a national record he could erase any doubts about his performance. As stated previously the main difference is the requirement for a doping test and judges of a different nationality to the athlete. I appreciate that this would add costs for the athlete and that due to errors by AIDA judges in the past he lost 500 euros well after the event.
I have no idea how well off AIDA is financially but I would suggest that they offer to waive the fee for the drugs test in order to extend an olive branch to Mifsud. This would leave no doubts about the athletes achievement once he has replicated it!

[Billextreme]

Originally Posted by trux

AFAIK, he was a competitive cyclist before (or maybe even still competes now)

...really!

Well, that could explain something... at least for us who know a little about the history in competitive cycling.

/B

[Kars]

I'm stunned by Stefan's surfacing, standing up right after such an increddible dive, wow! Verry good and clean looking performance.

In athlatics records and medals have been recalled in the past, so I don't have any problems recognising the athletes performance right after the judges' white cards. The doping control is still very usefull, and I would not want to be an athlete known world wide as a cheater, a pretty big stick to be hit with.

Big Congradulations Stephan Mifsud!!

Love, courage and water,

Kars

[jfjulian]

Originally Posted by Jorg

The surface protocol he had to day was already in place for a long time. The judge on site just made a mistake... I still have the video of this performance and you see Stephane after his amazing performance just standing there... no okay sign nothing. And that's already in place for a very long time.

jorg i was there for stephan 8mn24s record and have it on video.
what i wrote is just based on what I saw and video taped. it was funny not to say dramatic :-), two hours before the attemp stephane ask the international aida judges to look at his protocole to make sure he was doing the right thing since the rules changed a lot a that time,, he even did it in the water just to make sure...He did it twice in front of two well experienced judges, (without the ok signe) , both judges said on quote, "if you do exactly like this... we can say its perfect" Then he did his record and we all know what hapened next. aida international were upset about their judges not knowing their own rules ... what can you say to that... but blaimed it on stephane saying that any athletes must be aware of the rules prior their own judges... voila as we say here : c'est la vie... that's life.. take care

[laminar]

So when was the last time Stephane had a doping test?

I think we need to assume an athlete innocent before assuming he or she is guilty. Allegations of doping are quite damaging.
However, there also needs to be some evidence that shows an athlete is being open and transparent.

Bill, how successful do you think the WADA test for EPO will be for freedivers on site at a world record attempt?

[Haydn]

Hi Jorg,

You see the thing is he got a white card at such a high profile competition that had Aida judges. Thats why he should be free to make the claim. We all agree that Sam or Tom's performance in a training attempt is not sufficient. Thats the same for most sports. Competitors have to do it on the day for it to be official. Stephane did it on the day at an official high level comp.

Its when the performance is done as a genuine record attempt or in an International competetion, that it should count.

I am a fan of Aida, I just wish they would accept some responsibility in empowering the judges that were there. The really silly thing is that Guillaume could just as easily have been wearing an International Judges hat. Its called building bridges, extending the hand of friendship, resolving differences and making a difference.

If Aida wish to be recognised as THE official freediving body, its what athletes and disillusioned members require of them. Aida need to write it into their policy a way to sanction these competitions. Welcome Stephane and the handfull of others like him, the Italians, the disillusioned IAFD and the emerging Countries. Even CMAS who could relinquish apnea or be sanctioned. We could all cross borders and compete as guests in those other organisations competitions, that would make some great rivalry. We must recognise each others records and not pretend our world record holders are better than theirs when none of ours have done 10+ mins in a comp before.

[Goran Colak]

Plain and simple,

if there was no doping test, there was no record.

End of storry.

[Billextreme]

Haydn,

We have to use the same rules for everyone. You can only make AIDA WR in AIDA International WR attempts or in AIDA competition with WR status.

The judge may not be any of the following:
-same nationality or club as freediver,
-coach, manager, family member or girlfriend/boyfriend of freediver.
There must not be any conflict of interest i.e. no close friends or adversaries, no business partners, no sponsors and no media.

If these rules work for Herbert, Tom, Stig, Mandy, Martin, Carlos, Tanya and Natalia.. incl Guillaume and Luîc when he was around.. etc, they, for sure work for Mifsud as well.

/B

[OceanMan]

Originally Posted by Goran Colak

Plain and simple,

if there was no doping test, there was no record.

End of storry.

There is a doping test for national record as well. Mifsud did a doping test for his 213m dynamic and surely will for his 10'04''.

[Budho]

Very impressive performance by Stephane,...no doubt.
It is a pitty watching Stephane not to perform according to AIDA international standards only beause he had bad experiences with AIDA procedures long time ago. Rules got better and completely difeerent people are on board. The only constant is Stephane performing well. To me this can't be an official world record even if he would do a doping test.

I still remmember discusion on apnea diver list about his 8:24 static and I saw the video. Nice and strong performance. Judges were trying to persuade us that he did the OK sign and that it can't be seen because the camerman was inexperienced and he didn't catch it on a cammera. Even camerman wrote a post. But everybody could see on the video that he didn't do it. So, I cannot see him as an angel being abused.

To me AIDA at the time had a really strange system of verification of WR. I also saw a video dynamic performance which wasn't accepted as a world record after judges online saw a samba that nobody else could see. He wasn't the only victim of a bad system. The system is getting better and better with experiences we acumulate. It is the mether of being constructive and trying to help AIDA to grow and not tryng to discredit it every time possible.

Ales

[Goran Colak]

Originally Posted by OceanMan

There is a doping test for national record as well. Mifsud did a doping test for his 213m dynamic and surely will for his 10'04''.

Doping test must be done the same day, in the one hour after performance. No days or weeks after the performance, that's no joke, everything must be strict and tight. And yeah I know there is no doping test for national records, that's the point of this...

But there will allways be a gray area of doubt in apnea record events, nationals record expetialy.

[Haydn]

Billextreme said

"We have to use the same rules for everyone. You can only make AIDA WR in AIDA International WR attempts or in AIDA competition with WR status".

I say, WHY. Why cant a World Record performance be recognised in other arenas than an Aida WR attempt or Aida comp with WR status? and WHO SAYS SO. Its only Aida that says so.

Its the rules that cause exactly the problem. So an athlete that performs in those events becomes a World Record holder despite his time being less than another athelete doing a better time in a different organisations event.

Surely is has to be better for the title of World Record going to the person who does the best time, not the person who only managed to perform in front of the limited arenas you mentioned.

Lets hear from Bill Stromberg with ideas as to how Aida can incorporate these other performances into its rules.

All it takes is for Aida to write in a declaration to its rules that would encompass Stephane type performances. Its the performance that counts. And Aida aught to find a way to encompass these World Beating performances rather than continue the hype that only Aida athletes conforming to Aidas restrictive rules are worthy of the title World Record.

[Jorg]

Originally Posted by Haydn

You see the thing is he got a white card at such a high profile competition that had Aida judges. Thats why he should be free to make the claim. We all agree that Sam or Tom's performance in a training attempt is not sufficient. Thats the same for most sports. Competitors have to do it on the day for it to be official. Stephane did it on the day at an official high level comp.

Its when the performance is done as a genuine record attempt or in an International competetion, that it should count.

I am a fan of Aida, I just wish they would accept some responsibility in empowering the judges that were there. The really silly thing is that Guillaume could just as easily have been wearing an International Judges hat. Its called building bridges, extending the hand of friendship, resolving differences and making a difference.

The 10:04 was done in a separate record attempt and not in a competition. Just in some ones private backyard pool and only witnesses who were invited.

Oh and in the past, when AIDA was still the really dark force, don't forgot that the judges who f*cked up with mifsud 8:24 were punished! And especially after that event, everything went to the fast lane with big changes and everything, giving judges the complete right to call it a WR or not, waiting the doping test results of course.

[Jorg]

In the end it's so simple.. If you want an AIDA world record then invite AIDA, if you want a world record, invite TV. It's stephane its good right to call it a world record. But then again, he should not look strange if the freediving world is somewhat offended and questioning his world record.

And to close my argument; It's still a very very good performance and I applause him for his hard training!

[Haydn]

Yes, I've just seen that and it does add a different shade to his performance. Otherwise, my points remain the same. And you're right Aida have made great strides forward. My tuppence worth is to see a more inclusive set of rules to incorporate all performances in International Comps to recognise the winners even if the event is non Aida. Its just a question of re drafting their policy.