Beginners monofin?

[arehelgesen]

Yeah, i haven`t tried other fins yet, but I´m going to ask some of the other guys next practice.

I wrote to Elios and said something like that I was new to the sport, that I needed a suit for a Norwegian climate, and I asked if they could give me different price and quality offers. Just after I sent the e-mail, I saw that they had a fill-in-form adressing this purpose, so I sent one of those as well I´m really exited.

I can imagine your exited about your new suit! I read in some of your earlier threads that you usually go for quality just below top notch, is that what you have done this time as well, and maybe recommend for me to do also?

[sanso]

Originally Posted by arehelgesen

...
... earlier threads that you usually go for quality just below top notch, is that what you have done this time as well, and maybe recommend for me to do also?

This time was a bit different, because I want a suit that I can use for teaching (rugged, easy to put on and off, takes a beating) as well as for depth (smooth skin, doesn't compress that much), while temperature isn't that much of an issue, as I got it for diving in the red sea.
You can see it must be a compromise and as such will always be below top notch.

I hope I found a design that will work:
It's a reversible 3mm Heiwa medium density suit with smooth skin on one side and a nylon lining on the other. The lining will be on the outside during teaching and makes the suit less likely to tear, while I can turn it inside out for depth and/or competitions and have all the slipperiness of a smoothskin. I'm hoping to find an added bonus in the inner lining here because there will be more water in the suit, cooling me down and thus maybe(!!) improving the dive reflex. But that is wishful thinking. I'll post details, as soon as I've tried it.

For You I can only recommend the suit I got. I'm diving between 4°C and 25°C (with a thermocline at -10m) and am very happy with the 5/6mm design and the Heiwa neoprene. For a first suit, I also recommend the coating on the open cell material. It makes getting into and taking off the suit much easier and You're less likely to tear it apart the first time You try it on.

[arehelgesen]

Thanks for very good advices Sanso, it´s much better hearing it directly from someone who actually is a consumer, than someone sponsored by a brand. I will look into the inner coatings, I hope Elios answer soon!

[sanso]

Originally Posted by arehelgesen

Thanks for very good advices Sanso, it´s much better hearing it directly from someone who actually is a consumer, than someone sponsored by a brand. I will look into the inner coatings, I hope Elios answer soon!

The people at elios are great. You can certainly trust their advice, mate. They have lots of experience and a reputation to lose.
I guess it always makes sense to double-check, but if in doubt, go with what they say. - They'll probably write back that some of Your measurements are wrong. And likely they will be right. some of them have ESP, You know.

[Fondueset]

I agree - you can trust them. And you don't need a top of the line suit - my dive buddy uses a 5 mil titanium in/nylon suit out all winter.

They are freaky with the measurements; it's like they KNOW....

[arehelgesen]

Thanks mates! I´ll remember your advices. It might so happen that I should come up with some more questions some other time!

[BatRay]

Elios will probably give you a huge range of suits to choose from, so read through each one carefully and ask questions if needed. They sent me 15 wetsuit options based on my inquiry

[samdive]

Elios are great - and I agree with the others, HEIWA is the best neoprene to go for. It's more than stretchy enough and survives well. My suits get a lot of use (abuse!) and I've found that Heiwa suits last a couple of years whereas Yamamoto start to go baggy after just a few months.

Another important thing is the shape of the suit. I'd go for high waist trousers and a hooded top with beaver tail, no zips. For maximum warmth, go with open cell inside or black coating if you want it slightly easier to get on. Mine are all smooth skin outside as I found that the nylon suits, although they last longer, are not as warm on the surface as the nylon holds water. I use a 5ml suit for just about everything and put a Fourth Element thermocline vest under it in the winter. I had a 7ml for a while but hated the thickness of it and found it too restrictive. I sometimes use a 3ml in the Red Sea but to be honest you can use a 5ml most places.

make sure you get measured properly, don't try and do it yourself. A dressmaker is a good person to ask!

with the monofins - my Dolphin fins both have neoprene lined footpockets which does make them more comfortable. It is true that the fins can hurt for a while but after a few weeks of training with it, you'll stop noticing that. I have small feet but really high arches and that was painful for a very brief period when I first started freediving but it doesn't take long to get through that. Just bear with it, it's worth it.

good luck

Sam

[arehelgesen]

Thanks Sam! That was really useful information. I just received an e-mail from elios containing 14 different suits specified to the characteristics I had described Right now I´m even more confused, but I´ll use your advices thoroughly!

They also recommended me a high waist trousers. I´ts really difficult to choose from all the options...

When they write that some of the suits are delicate and easy to tear, should I avoid buying them? and is it much difference with a suit you need soap to get into than one you don´t when it comes to diving qualities?

Do I need knee pads?

What are the detriments to having an open cell on the inside/outside?

a lot of questions again...Thanks for bothering!

[samdive]

open cell inside is GOOD because it's very warm and bad because it makes the suit harder to put on. If you're diving in the cold, it's worth having. You just have to get used to taking some warm water and soap with you to put the suit on with

All good freedive suits that I know of are delicate and easy to tear - you have to treat them with respect and keep a supply of neoprene glue. If you do rip them, they are easy to fix.

No you don't need knee pads - the only time I've ever had knee pads on a suit was for teaching scuba when you spend a lot of time kneeling on the bottom with students. I can't see why a freediver would need them.

I tell all my students to buy a suit with smoothskin on the outside and open cell on the inside if they are looking to train for competitive freediving. If they are more likely to be snorkelling, spearfishing and messing around near rocks and beaches, then open cell inside and nylon outside would be better.

hope that helps

Sam

[sanso]

Open cell neoprene on the skin is the warmest You can get. It's only used on the inside. The black coating is a coating on the open cells that makes it easier to put on.
For a first suit I recommend some lining on the outside, even if that will wick away some of the heat, which smooth skin doesn't. The reason is that it's plain sturdier with a lining.
I had kneepads on my first suit, but I found I don't need them. So unless You want to crawl on Your knees much, chances are You can save the 10€.
Don't forget to get socks and gloves (the 3-fingered ones), as You'll hardly get a better bang for the buck than those from elios.

[Fondueset]

For conditions with cold air temperatures smoothskin outside makes a huge difference. As mentioned my winter suit has a smooth out top and nylon out bottoms - this works really well for me since I often dive near rocky breakwalls covered with sharp mussels and it is mostly your back that is out of the water during surface intervals. You can really feel the difference when the air is cold.

whats tricky about smoothskin out is you really need to work carefully on how you put it on and take it off. Use plenty of lube and take it easy. They are not completely fragile but you don't want to over stress the seams.

I would skip the kneepads and just get nylon bottoms. I have kneepads on my 6 mil bottoms and they are kind of stiff. Elios may use something different on smoothskin though - so its worth asking.

[arehelgesen]

hmmm...Its hard to choose smooth skin on the outside or not. But Fondueset`s suggestion about different bottom and top was good. Maybe I´ll go for that. And I´m going to skip kneepads, since all of you don´t think it´s necessary. and I´ll remember to order socks and gloves as wellThanks again!

[Steinar]

Hi Are

My 6mm Elios Suit keeps me warm for an hour in 4 c. It is a bit bulky but beeing warm is most important. Smoothskin might ad a few meters on your performance when tecnique is perfect. Some scientist argue that smothskin can increase your mojo

This is the description from elios:

Suit 6mm open cell inside / Nylon elastic black outside neoprene
Heiwa Price Euro 167,00 It's the best-seller for apnea suit, very
warmth, very very elastic, aderent to the body and good also for deep
divings, but for get into must use always talkum or water-soap.

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Steinar