Advanced monofins

[jome]

Hey,

I've been pondering about getting a new mono for a while. It seems "the thing" nowadays are these advanced wing monos. I'm not an expert in the history of monofins, but as far as I could gather, all are more or less clones of the Andronov monofin.

Now I've listed here a few options from different manufacturers. What I would like to know is if anyone has experience with each of these, or better yet, has had a chance to compare several of them?

I've tried the Leaderfins Flyer a couple of times, and I must say, the difference to my old mono is simply enormous. I'm not so convinced that at my speeds the wing is essential, but the footpockets are simply awesome. They support and "hug" my feet and I'm able to transfer power to the blade much better than with old style "floppy rubber" pockets. Based on that, I'm currently leaning towards that, or the Hyper. The Hyper is a floating monofin, so it's propably really good for DYN, but I would like one that does both DYN and CW reasonably well (I do realize I cannot have a blade that is the best in both, but I cannot afford 2 monos). How about the Andronov, waterway glide fin? Are there other clones?

So does anyone have experience taking Hyper and other floating types deep? I would be really interested to know how they handle. How severe is the loss in buoyancy? Does the fin suffer damage from the pressure? (floats collapse etc)

So, let's get a discussion going. I'm sure there are others struggling with the same questions...

Leaderfins hyper:
http://www.leaderfins.com/cgi-bin/fo...&tm=1134040853

Leaderfins flyer:
http://www.leaderfins.com/cgi-bin/fo...&tm=1134040853

Waterway glide fin:
http://www.waterway.dk/fmfinner.htm

Andronov:
http://polyorg.de/product_info.php?l...42dd85df1ff5b6

Gipper:
http://polyorg.de/product_info.php?p...268da09132e4a0

[Alun]

good thread. i'm interested to hear what people have to say too. i'm not sure what to think about these fins. some people have done some great performances with them (eg Natalia and Alex) but what puts me off is just the apparent size and weight of them. i have quite a high stroke frequency and i'm not sure if this type of fin would be good for me. then again maybe i should consider changing my fin and changing my technique to suit the fin.. the problem is that there are so many fins out there and if you choose the wrong one then it can be a pretty expensive mistake!

[Kars]

I'm also very interested in other people's opinions.

Currently I use a waterway model 1, Long distance. I like the fin's action, but I miss the angle I think. I've tried I think a leadersfins hyper. Felicia from Sweden spontaniously offered me to try hers, though a tight fit on my big feet it feld really nice and efficient. I like to do a slow gliding stroke.
I usually adapt my stroke to whatever hangs on feet in order to be within the most efficient regeon wich the fin is build for. Stiffer fins are ment for fasting swimming, need more power to have them bent and be efficient. Soft fins reach far quicker the efficien region, but if you go past that you'll see your effort is not tranferred into propulsion. Fin folding, wobbeling etc.

Thank you for this interesting topic,

Kars

[SanSan]

Exactly what I was asking myself . I decided to switch from stereo to mono and so I'm right on buying one.

I tryed out the finnswimming flyer a few times and it floated. Don't know if the freediving flyer floats dough. I realy liked the finn but im too inexperienced with monos to say where the difference was. I am using a friend WW type 1 now and have to say there is a difference but dont ask me where .

About the WW Glide i heard they are not as good as Leader fins. The qualitiy of the rubber and the production are not so good. That what I heard from our finnswimmers.

I'm 99% sure I'll buy the flyer. They also got a christmas discount for the "not-entirely" handmade fins.

[jome]

Ok, so it seems there's a lot of interest for this topic, but not much actual experiences

I guess the "gipper" and waterway are out then. So that leaves us with andronov, flyer or hyper. The only thing I'm even considering Flyer over Hyper is the flotation. I'm sceptical how good it is for deep diving. These things are really heavy and if they lose buoyancy in deep, I could imagine that leading to problems.

Does someone know for a fact what fin for example Natalia and Alex use for deep diving? Stig had a similar looking fin in Renens, does he use it for CW? Same with Ruyzo...I know these guys don't write here much, but maybe someone who knows them has some inside info?

For me it would be proof enough if for example Natalia and Alex were using the Hyper for deep diving

[immerlustig]

i don't have much to add here, just that the quality of the russian fins is seemingly far superior to all the rest (from what i gather). alex molchanov and natalie acheenkov both use andronov's fins for 1-3 years. they train a lot and their fins don't show any wear or tear, really. some scratches on the blade from turns. that's pretty much it. i'm not impessed by the manufacturing quality (especially the rubber parts) of ww, specialfin, etc at all.

another issue with the big wings is how much buoyancy they lose. peter p can probably make some statements here. he used that ww model with the massive wing on some deep dives.

cheers,

roland

[trullalla]

hi,

alex and natalie a. don't have an andronov, but a cheaper version of it (400 US at the moment). natalia m. has an andronov, which is a custom made mono you can buy with a 1000 US. they look very similar to each other, but the difference in price suggests there should be a difference in performance.
i ordered the cheaper version for me, but it's going to take a while. i tried natalie a. fin, and i like very much the way the foot pocket fits. it's very confortable, but at the same time it doesn't allow the foot to move around. as for the weight of it, yes, it's quite heavy, and it's very positive in the first meters on the descent. i took it to 20 mt and let it go, and it was still a little bit positive there (i would guess it's totally neutral between 25/30mt). i didn't do any deep dive with it, so i don't know how heavy it would feel at depth. but i don't think it's getting so heavy really. what bothers me more is the extra buoyancy in the first 10/15 mt.
the foot pocket material seems to last a long time, natalie and alex have theirs for around 2 years, and they don't look bad at all, considering they use their monos a lot. all sebak and specialfins i've seen before look much worse after few months of use.

i don't know the mane of the manufacturer of the cheap "andronov"; natalia ordered it for me, but for who is interested i think i can get the email address, or you can mail directly to natalia and ask her.

hope that helps.

linda

[Alun]

i didn't realise they were quite that buoyant. Linda - i would be interested to hear what you think about the fin after you've tried it for some deep dives. maybe you could post your opinion on this thread.

another thing i've noticed is that the footpocket on these fins seem further away from the blade than on normal fins. is this true or just an illusion? if this is true then i could see this making a big difference to its dynamics.

i will try to describe a type of fin i would like to try... a fin like waterway (but soft) with a very hard and tight footpocket (only for single deep dives) but designed to be straight and in line with the body, either through an angled blade or maybe a more lightweight 'hyper/glide/flyer' style footpocket. and with no aerofoil wing. is there such a fin around?

[Alun]

i'd quite like to try this fin:
http://www.leaderfins.com/cgi-bin/fo...tm=1134150464#

would the angle be a weak point though?

[X-Fins]

Hi everybody, one comment. The Flyer monofin has an special version for Constant Weight. The main characteristic it's the imposiibilty to be compressed. It's made with special rubber different than the finsswimmers use. As i know it's the only one monofin in the market designed specially for use in depth. No compression mantain your feet fixed perfect while you dive deep.

http://www.leaderfins.com/cgi-bin/fo...&tm=1134150905

For Alun: "another thing i've noticed is that the footpocket on these fins seem further away from the blade than on normal fins. is this true or just an illusion? " isn't an illusion it's true...thats allow you to transfer more power to the blade

Best regards, Luis

[SanSan]

I also heard that Andronov monofins are the best, but its realy hard to get one. As far as I know he only does them himself and not just for everybody but only a selected few. And yes the prices are definitley 700eur and up. So I dont think the one posted on the link before is a real Andronov but just a copy.

Of all the footpockets I tried i liked the flyer best. Its quite soft but realy tight. The feeling is great if u want to swim only one distance but my feet started to hurt like hell after a few laps. But then again im not used to monofins... yet . Still i dobut i could use that fin for training, but it was a finswiming fin for short distances.

[trullalla]

alun, it will take a while before i get my fin... probably not before the spring. it was supposed to be ready before the end of the year, but it didn't work out, so i have to wait.
well, i'm off to thailand for 3 months very soon anyways, so it doesn't make so much of a difference.
as for the distance between footpocket and blade, now that you say it, yes, i would say that it's true. but what difference that would make i don't know.

[jome]

I was lucky enough to participate on a mono technique course with Peter Pedersen (which I highly recommend) and asked him about his mono.

He said he used waterway wing 1 or something like that last season. According to him, it was ok for CW, but would not propably work for all styles of diving...

He's got an andronov (or similar) mono now, but has only tried it in a pool, so he couldn't say how it works for CW. So basically, the same problem as the rest of us are thinking

Well, I think it's really hard to go wrong with the Hyper or Flyer. Andronov would be nice, but I'm not sure I want to go through the trouble of trying to get one...With copies, you never know what you get...At least leaderfins is somewhat a known brand...And the fins I have tried were lightyears a head of for example anything special fins has to offer...

[jome]

In the start of the course Peter announced that he was a "tough bastard", so look what we made the poor guy do

Accidentally, Timo Kinnunen also made a new world record in "unashamed static in 0 degree water", about 5 cm...(rated-r)

http://fdtf.1g.fi/kuvat/monokurssi2005/pete1.JPG/full
http://fdtf.1g.fi/kuvat/monokurssi20..._1976.JPG/full
http://fdtf.1g.fi/kuvat/monokurssi2005/pete2.JPG/full
http://fdtf.1g.fi/kuvat/monokurssi20..._1974.JPG/full

[Absolute]

Good thread.

I wish I would have seen this before I ordered specalfins carbon monofin. But then again, if I had, I probably would be even more torn from decisions on monofins and not have one on the way like I do now.

But since I am still an advancing newbie (not just a newbie anymore) I still have the excuse of learing the hard way. As long as this fin can get me to -50m before self destructing then I'll be happpy

Cheers,
Jay