A few thoughts on Hyperventilation and how to come to terms with the term.

[sanso]

Hey all,

I've been brooding over this for a while and would like to know your thoughts on the idea of a useful definition of freediving that allows us to avoid flame wars and that can be used as a bullshit-detector (e.g. purge breaths)

Here's the link, please tell me what you make of it.

https://wefreedive.com/blog/45-hyperventilation-a-useful-definition

 

[cdavis]

VERY good logic and write up. I especially like the:

"If you are at rest before a dive, how much do you need to breathe? - Well, not much, because you are not producing a lot of CO₂, right? So, adequate breathing before a freedive would be quite slow and shallow."

This nails the fundamentals behind the minimal breathup style, and in a way that gets your attention.

Thanks.

But you stopped just as things were getting interesting. Is there more to come?

Its pretty clear that a modest amount of hyperventilation in most divers is safe enough. Otherwise there would be a whole lot more BOs. The problem comes when trying to figure out where the diver is in the range between having so much c02 in the system that the dive is short and uncomfortable (for most divers) and doing so much hyperventilation that its dangerous. I finally decided that I just could not tell and figured out how to make a minimal breathup work for me(with some of those infamous purge breaths).

 

[sanso]

VERY good logic and write up. I especially like the:

...

But you stopped just as things were getting interesting. Is there more to come?

Its pretty clear that a modest amount of hyperventilation in most divers is safe enough. ... in the range between having so much c02 in the system that the dive is short and uncomfortable (for most divers) and doing so much hyperventilation that its dangerous. ... those infamous purge breaths).

I'm happy the article makes you want to think on! That's what I was hoping for!

There is, of course, always more to everything.

I'm wondering what you will come up with, if/when you take a look at the definition offered in the article and cross-examine it with the parts of your response I quoted above. - Of course I do have some thoughts on it, but I want to leave you relatively unbiased and only direct your attention, if you allow me. What I am hoping for is other people's thoughts and what they understand when reading this.

 

[Andrew Fogarty]

I have recently begun to explore the aspects of meditation which focus on breathing. I have been active and fit all my life and a spearo since my early teens. I am more acutely aware of the dangers of over breathing to increase dive duration than ever before and this thread is of great interest to me. As my out of water training comprises highly aerobic (cycling) and anaerobic (weights) exertion the inclusion of breath focus during training has in a short space of time improved lap splits on the bike. I'm sure an increase in PO2 is responsible because of more controlled deeper breaths and improved O2 uptake. I train to dive and for recovery, but often find my self breathing deeply and rapidly after surfacing which soon reduces to a relaxed even cycle before the next dive. My question is if you let your bodies regulatory system guide your actions are you in danger of over breathing given that some times the next dive (shallow) may occur after the deep breaths and before total relaxation.

 

[sanso]

.... My question is if you let your bodies regulatory system guide your actions are you in danger of over breathing given that some times the next dive (shallow) may occur after the deep breaths and before total relaxation.

If we consider that increased breathing is most commonly caused by increased CO₂ , then waiting for breathing to normalise (whatever that means) would imply that CO₂ has returned to a neutral level.... or possibly to a level below neutral. As long as your breathing is still accelerated without your doing and without outer influences (stress, shock, ...) your CO₂ level is probably elevated.

Dunno. have I missed anything?

 

[cdavis]

Generally speaking, forgetting about your breathing works pretty good. In practice, after surfacing, you will breath hard and fast at first, blowing off the c02 accumulated during the dive. Your breathing will then automatically decrease to a surprisingly low level of ventilation as you relax on the surface getting ready for the next dive.

Generally is a little tricky. When I began transforming to a minimal breathup strategy, I couldn't just forget my breathing. So many years of deep and slow and my default breathing rate was deep and slow, sometimes not so slow. I had to consciously focus on suppressing my breathing rate. Took a couple of years to break the habit. The take home is examine what you individually are doing.

Surface interval, simply enough time, is incredibly important. Too short an interval is a major factor in BOs. You may feel totally recovered, but you still need the time.

 

[cdavis]

"Hyperventilation is breathing that reduces the CO₂ level below a useful or safe level"

Since I'm pretty sure I know what you are talking about, that definition is right on target and I could not agree more. However, if I did not know, it would be way too subjective and unclear. What is "useful" What is "safe"?

The definition implies letting your body take care of it and determine your breathing rate. But what if your body is set "wrong", allowing way too much overbreathing? Mine used to be and I was completely unaware of it.

I think you are getting there. The idea is good, but needs to be more specific.

 

[Andrew Fogarty]

I feel more at ease with the this definition which describes the driver for unsafe practices," over breathing". I'm of for a dive tomorrow and will feel more relaxed if I do need to stretch a dive out to make a shot and secure a fish. Being comfortable that my CO2 levels were at a "metabolic equilibrium" on decent and my breath hold was 90% capacity blends many of the theory's and practices promoted on this site.
Cheer's for your Thread.