Airbalete or Cyrano Evo HF?

[BristolDave]

Hi all, I don't post on here too often due to lack of available water time and consequent constructive input. However, the forum has been a font of knowledge so maybe someone can guide me here (?)
I currently have a Beuchat 85 Carbone which is a nice gun however, as an engineer I'm finding the idea of a pneumatic quite attractive and I'm hoping that any responses here will be without 'anti pneumatic bias'.
I see no reason why today they should be (relatively) any less reliable than a rubber gun or less accurate. They appear to be not particularly complex, and seem to need moderate common sense care.
So, I've been looking at the marked here in the UK and it appears that there are two (pos three) contenders worthy of consideration, which are;
Omer Airbalete.
Mares Cyrano Evo HF.
and pos the Sporasub One Air.
As I see it for general maintenance (seals etc) I'd like good suppliers back up which, puts the Mares to the front here but, the Evo is not yet available and I'd be interested in knowing views on Mares guns (my scuba experience of them has been good) especially the Evo if anyone has seen it/used it.
The Omer Airbalete looks promising and is aesthetically stunning but, I'm a little concerned regards quality not helped by the Sporasub One issues on other threads here.
Do they (Omer/Sporasub) share the same trigger mech which seems to have spear location/line release issues? The Airbalete seems highly rated, so I'm assuming it must be different to the 'One' which recieves alot of negativity.
The only two genuine issues I can see that are common with all pneumatics is noise and power loss. Are these guns noisey to the point of spooking fish? and exactly how much actual power is lost at a realistic depth (10mts tops/ 2bar).
Appologies for so many questions from a relative newbie to the forum. Though I'd like to hear the opinions as to which gun, from experienced pneumatic using spearos.
Finally it'll be used in Dorset/Devon/Cornwall and as for length thinking of 100cm as I figure I can power down and for me will be a comfortable length. PS I'm aware that is 'total' gun length.
Thanks in advance.
Cheers
Dave

 

[tromic]

Hi all, I don't post on here too often due to lack of available water time and consequent constructive input. However, the forum has been a font of knowledge so maybe someone can guide me here (?)
I currently have a Beuchat 85 Carbone which is a nice gun however, as an engineer I'm finding the idea of a pneumatic quite attractive and I'm hoping that any responses here will be without 'anti pneumatic bias'.
I see no reason why today they should be (relatively) any less reliable than a rubber gun or less accurate. They appear to be not particularly complex, and seem to need moderate common sense care.
So, I've been looking at the marked here in the UK and it appears that there are two (pos three) contenders worthy of consideration, which are;
Omer Airbalete.
Mares Cyrano Evo HF.
and pos the Sporasub One Air.
As I see it for general maintenance (seals etc) I'd like good suppliers back up which, puts the Mares to the front here but, the Evo is not yet available and I'd be interested in knowing views on Mares guns (my scuba experience of them has been good) especially the Evo if anyone has seen it/used it.
The Omer Airbalete looks promising and is aesthetically stunning but, I'm a little concerned regards quality not helped by the Sporasub One issues on other threads here.
Do they (Omer/Sporasub) share the same trigger mech which seems to have spear location/line release issues? The Airbalete seems highly rated, so I'm assuming it must be different to the 'One' which recieves alot of negativity.
The only two genuine issues I can see that are common with all pneumatics is noise and power loss. Are these guns noisey to the point of spooking fish? and exactly how much actual power is lost at a realistic depth (10mts tops/ 2bar).
Appologies for so many questions from a relative newbie to the forum. Though I'd like to hear the opinions as to which gun, from experienced pneumatic using spearos.
Finally it'll be used in Dorset/Devon/Cornwall and as for length thinking of 100cm as I figure I can power down and for me will be a comfortable length. PS I'm aware that is 'total' gun length.
Thanks in advance.
Cheers
Dave

Noice is less with vacuum barrel kit, not higher than with band guns.

Regarding power lost:
http://forums.deeperblue.com/pneuma...uum-barrels-aka-dry-barrels-3.html#post788275

I would like to try new Cyrano Evo HF, although all three guns are OK.

 

[BristolDave]

Noice is less with vacuum barrel kit, not higher than with band guns.

Regarding power lost:
http://forums.deeperblue.com/pneuma...uum-barrels-aka-dry-barrels-3.html#post788275

I would like to try new Cyrano Evo HF, although all three guns are OK.

Thanks Tromic for taking time to get back.
Do you or are you going to be doing a kit for the Evo hf?
If yes how would I go about ordering one?
Think it might make sense too wait for the hf to be available before reaching a decision. Unless anyone has a definitive view on the Omer/ Sporasub.

 

[tromic]

Let us see how that new gun performs as it is, first. Later Marko (zmajmr) could make a kit. You can send him PM.

 

[foxfish]

Hi Dave, I have airguns that are over 30 years old & still working very well, one gun is over 20 years old & has never had a single seal changed only a few top up pumps of air every year!
I would always recommend a dry barrel kit on any airgun, with a kit fitted the guns are very quiet & smooth to fire, little recoil & so much nicer that a high recoil tube-band gun!
Personally in my eyes the Omer Airbalete is by far the best option as the handle & trigger are set in line with the barrel.
I dont know of any particular reliability issues & there are lots of positive comments on the forum.
The main complaints about air guns come from... difficulty in loading & difficult to hit anything ... not reliability or power!

 

[tromic]

I would agree with foxfish. Maybe Airbalete would be the best choice, because of the trigger position, but I would take the longer, or the longest gun, and transform it to vacuum barrel. I think microslider shipped with the gun is too much heavy. But it aslo makes loading effort easier, and is more hydrodinamic than other sliders.

 

[BristolDave]

This is the kind of advice I was hoping for.
The OMER has been near the top of the list, I'm just confused as some of the issues with the Sporasub relate to the trigger mech/line release yet it appears to be the same mech on the Airbalete which appears to have no issues?
Would the 100cm Airbalete be a good length based on preffering a slightly longer gun?
I know aesthetics alone are not a good basis of a gun but, it does appear to be well thought out especially the barrel to handle height.Am I right in thinking that it works on a lower pressure than the Cyrano, which I assume should make loading easier?
Accuracy is one area of concern, (having used a band gun), Is it a case of getting used to the gun or are they (Airbalete particulary) inaccurate by nature? Would have thought that a force acting directly on the rear of the shaft and an enclosed barrel would create a more accurate shot (?) as opposed to a band acting at an elevated angle and a rail.
Anyone own or have experience of the Airbalete who could chime in?
Ref the slider I could prob get something turned up in work to replace it.
One final point, if I go for the Airbalete which is the best dry barrel kit and do I need to carry out any other mods?


Thanks again gents, really appreciated.

 

[tromic]

You can not use Omer micro slider with Tomba700 kit so that problem would be solved. Cyrano is 11 mm, Airbalete is 11.2 mm barrel so loading effort should be about the same. But Airbalete 100 is in performance similar to Cyrano 850. Piston travel distance is shorter because the handle is behind.

 

[foxfish]

Dave all of tromics Tomba dry barrel kits are very good design & quality.
A 100cm airgun is potentially a hugely powerful weapon for English waters, I think they do an 880?
Air guns are just as accurate as band guns, it is just adapting to the difference but the Airbalete is one step ahead with the handle design...try the search button look for Don Paul's post too.

 

[popgun pete]

I was not going to chime in as I own neither of them, but if you want a power regulator to avoid smashing your speartip on an irresistible close-up shot with a fish staring at you while hovering in front of a large rock then buy the "Cyrano Evo", either the "HF" or the round tank version. The "Airbalete" power regulator is operated at the muzzle, so not a quick change option, plus it is an energy waster. The "Cyrano Evo" has reportedly a bigger transfer port in the power regulator internal bulkhead, so the high power shot should be better than the previous "Cyrano". Ultimately the gun has to suit you, so it is best to take a look at and handle them both, but there may be a wait on the new Mares gun. Having not had any problems with aiming a pneumatic I don't really see the need for the rearward extended handle on the "Airbalete" or the "One Air", it makes the gun longer than it needs to be, but again that has to suit you. Mares have been making guns a lot longer than Omer, plus there should be no bugs as Mares don't sell guns before they are ready, unlike Omer! That said, the "Airbalete" has been around long enough for any bugs to have been eliminated by now.

 

[Jegwan]

I will copy Peter with regards to the power regulator. As I recall it, is the possible reduction in power on the Airbalete around 15%. I suppose it will be around 50% on the Cyrano Evo HF. So it really depends on your needs and preference.
You could (as this is your first pneumatic) chose one of the cheaper models so you can get some experience in what you like and need.
If you end up liking the pneumatics you can either get another model that suits your needs or upgrade the one you have with a dry barrel kit.
You can (if you like the idea) get a Mares Pneumatic in what ever size you like delivered at your home for about 100 GBP here:
http://shop.topboats.com/tienda/submarinismo/fusiles/fusiles-neumaticos/fusil-neumatico-mares-sten-11
Jegwan

 

[BristolDave]

Pete, I think you have touched here on my quality concerns with OMER, and as I said earlier Mares is well supported in the UK (also never had issues with their scuba kit).
As for the power reg. It's only something that becomes a problem due to the flexible nature of the pneumatics design i.e you don't have one on a band gun so the conundrum is not their! However as it is seems a little daft to apply it by hydro-flow restriction at the muzzle.
So, as for the Cyrano. In effect 100cm should have a higher volume of air than Airbalete (?) not sure exactly how much realistic impact that will have. Better potential aiming against potentially more power.
Jegwan, I've had a Mares Sten years ago but never really used it in anger so, I'm not totally green with Pneumatics.
Have contacted 'Topboats' who tell me Evo HF will be in stock in 5 days (?????).
Dave

 

[Jegwan]

Oh, sorry for that, I thought it was a"first try". 5 days - That sounds good.

 

[BristolDave]

Not holding my breath on the '5 days'!!!
Pros and cons to both. Suppose dry barrels already available for Airbalete wheres as Evo HF is an unknown quantity.
These two guns interest me as they seem 'next generation' so to speak.
Would love to see both in the flesh but not very likely in Bristol (or probably whole of UK)

 

[BristolDave]

I will copy Peter with regards to the power regulator. As I recall it, is the possible reduction in power on the Airbalete around 15%. I suppose it will be around 50% on the Cyrano Evo HF. So it really depends on your needs and preference.
You could (as this is your first pneumatic) chose one of the cheaper models so you can get some experience in what you like and need.
If you end up liking the pneumatics you can either get another model that suits your needs or upgrade the one you have with a dry barrel kit.
You can (if you like the idea) get a Mares Pneumatic in what ever size you like delivered at your home for about 100 GBP here:
http://shop.topboats.com/tienda/submarinismo/fusiles/fusiles-neumaticos/fusil-neumatico-mares-sten-11
Jegwan

Jegwan, have you any experience of dealing with 'topboats' ? Spotted their site recently but are they credible/trustworthy?

 

[Jegwan]

Jegwan, have you any experience of dealing with 'topboats' ? Spotted their site recently but are they credible/trustworthy?

Yes I have. I have dealed with them once recently. No problem. The package arrived here in Denmark (with DHL) 4 working days after I made the order on their website.

 

[Jegwan]

Not holding my breath on the '5 days'!!!
Pros and cons to both. Suppose dry barrels already available for Airbalete wheres as Evo HF is an unknown quantity.
These two guns interest me as they seem 'next generation' so to speak.
Would love to see both in the flesh but not very likely in Bristol (or probably whole of UK)

Yes. let's see about the 5 days.
I agree that these guns - at least from a design and aesthetic perspective - are a step further then the classic models. I must admit that I was expecting a little more development of the technical part of the new guns. Some dry barrel models besides the One Air would be great!

 

[BristolDave]

Agree. It does make you think that if dry barrels are so good, why are manufacturers in general not adopting them? Cost? possibly but, we are talking top end pneumatics here.
Which takes me full circle back to the Sporasub One!!!!!!!!!

 

[popgun pete]

Dry or vacuum barrels have the potential for unreliability, this has been discussed elsewhere on other threads, so for now most mainstream manufacturers have stayed away.

 

[foxfish]

Hey Dave, have you considered a front fixed spear often referred to as a free spear because it dose not carry a slider?