Arms position

[fabrice]

I'm doing CW with a monofin, and when descending used the standard position with arms above (well, below...) my head. Since I can't do hands free equalization, I need to move one of my arms to my nose and because of this I'm not very streamlined. So I tried to keep on arm by my side, and the other one to pinch my nose. I found this technique quite difficult, my velocity has been reduced and it looks like I need more strokes to cover the same depth.
has anyone already tried this ? Do I have to work on my technique or is it a lost cause ?

Thanks,

Fabrice

 

[SanSan]

Hey Fabrice,

I belive there's no way too swimm efficient whit a monofin with ur hands by ur sides. Maybe with stereo fins it could work but certanly not monofin. There sure will be some improvement over time in tecnique but... I would advise U to just learn hands free equalization. Thera where some recent topics on this. I also read about a nose clip that does the pinching thing for U.

 

[Rémi]

I think Sebastien Murat uses a mono with the arms along the body.
So I think you can, but the technique might be more difficult to master :duh
So good luck
Here is a picture from his web-site

 

[samdive]

lots of people keep their arms by their sides - the only tricky thing is steering is slightly more difficult. I keep mine by my side on ascent, on descent I have one on my nose and one straight down - for dynamic I change it around...

alun george and his gang mostly dive with their arms at their sides and all do impressive depths

s

 

[Alun]

SanSan, if you find arms-down inefficient then you just need to practice more. even with poor arms-down technique it's possible to dive very deep. you mentioned in another post that you dived to recently dived to 30m for the first time. i would keep experimenting with technique (including arms-down practice) until you reach at least 60m before you make any firm decision.

i think many people find arms-up easier initially and then just stick with it without trying anything new. they may try arms-down once or twice, find it harder and immediately reach the conclusion that it's less efficient without giving it a chance by practising the technique.

i dive with arms down because it's a much more relaxing and natural posture. my choice is not due to lack of flexibility, because i have extremely flexible shoulders. also i dive in cold water and usually wear thick wetsuits. holding your arms up when wearing a 7mm wetsuit uses a lot of O2. if you doubt this then try doing a static in that position (even without a wetsuit)...and compare with a relaxed posture.

 

[SanSan]

Hey Alun

Well maybe I was to hash but I still think that for a monofin the arms by side is less efficeint. Maybe I shouldn't write it because I only tried monofin a couple of times, but I experimented alot whit a friend of mine who is our the trainer of the local finswimm team...
As for my 30m I did this on my second CW training day and with stereo fins and, Yes, with my hands by my side . I use it because I like to push myself the frist meter wiht my hands and then leave them there. They don't bother me or anythng and I can do my equilizing without hands, what also I a mysterious story to me as nobody never told me how and why. I first heard about equilzing when I was 18 and making a scuba course. But I dove to 10m + without any pain and equlizing long befor that. I guess Im just lucky .
I also dove for a year with arms by side in the pool and then swiched over. I don't use "the ful extended arms" technique as I also thing that its more O2 consuming. I just hold them in front of me and try to relax. And last I wouldn't dare to say that hands by side is generally inefficient after watching the Tom Sieats video :duh .

About the suits, they can be realy a big problem, but try a suit taylored for freediving. The best suit as far as I know come with their sleeves turned some way around... And the statics... I could ask U the same thing: try doing a static without a suit with hands tight by Ur sides. And if u have a suit like mine it'l be only harder.

I guess I do have too litle experience but I have to write something. I too want to help. And I do write only the thins that I am sure of. If they are wrong im sorry , but I still thing that diving with a monofin with arms by side is less efficient, because form my experince ur head tilts a bit to much up and down as there are no hands to stabilaze ur leg movement. But I'll rather leave this to the experts.

 

[Alun]

finswimming team.... now i see how you've reached your conclusions.

remember that finswimming and freediving are two totally different things. yes, both groups use monofins, but the similarity ends there. finswimmers are interested in speed - nothing else. freedivers are essentially interested in maximising distance travelled per unit O2. these goals couldn't be more different!

 

[subaquaticus]

Since I can't do hands free equalization, I need to move one of my arms to my nose and because of this I'm not very streamlined. So I tried to keep on arm by my side, and the other one to pinch my nose. I found this technique quite difficult, my velocity has been reduced and it looks like I need more strokes to cover the same depth.
has anyone already tried this ? Do I have to work on my technique or is it a lost cause ?

Why don't you try a paradisia type nose-clip with goggles full of water, which would allow you to do Valsalva equalization with both arms above your head ?

 

[immerlustig]

last season bevan dewar was doing a series of deep dives (80-90m) with different arm positions and couldn't really say which one was better.

unless you are swimming very fast i think that arms down should be considered. bi-fin divers are generally slower than mono divers, so chances are they prefer the arms down position. also, if your diving style is based on relaxation, arms at the side might be of an advantage.

so far i always dived with bi-fins and i also prefer slower and more relaxed dives but i will use the mono this year and i want to spend some time trying to get used to the arms-up position. peter p. told me that if you train enough then you get used to it with equal relaxation (and he should know). that would be wicked, i guess.

cheers

roland

p.s. alun, 7 mm?? so that is the secret

 

[cdavis]

At least in my case, arms above the head has gotten easier. After about two years of practice, I'm quite relaxed with a position that is close to a competitive swimmers streamline, much more streamlined than when I started. The key was learning to hook the thumb over the outside of the palm of the other hand. That automaticly pulls the arms in close around the head and permits all the muscles in the shoulders and upper arms to be relaxed. Not sure it would work so well with a suit on.

 

[fabrice]

Why don't you try a paradisia type nose-clip with goggles full of water, which would allow you to do Valsalva equalization with both arms above your head ?

I have a paradisia nose-clip (a yellow one, sorry ), but since most of my diving is recreationnal diving I find it easier to use a mask and a snorkel.

Fabrice

 

[jome]

I start with hands over my head ("finswimming position")for the first 15m of the dive. I find it is easier to "detach" from the surface.

After I hit the freefall and make the last mouthfill, I bring one hand on the nose and let the other just go sort of limp with the rest of my body, close my eyes and just sink.

At the bottom, I grab the rope with one hand and pull once to get a good start upwards and make a couple of kicks with hands on the side, and then move them up to the "finswimming" position again.

Try different things and see what works for you. I don't find grabbing my nose in the initial descent that wasteful. Maybe I'm burning some O2 for that, but that's not limiting my dives so at this level it makes no difference...

 

[subaquaticus]

I have a paradisia nose-clip (a yellow one, sorry )

a question : when you dive with your yellow paradisia nose-clip, what kind of goggles do you wear ?

with little eyes ? with big eyes ? (Seal like..)

 

[fabrice]

I'm using my nose-clip only in the pool, for dyn and stat, with swimming goggles.

Fabrice

 

[subaquaticus]

I'm using my nose-clip only in the pool, for dyn and stat, with swimming goggles. Fabrice

You never tried your astounding nose-clip in CW ? Then it is a bit expensive for a swimming pool-only nose-clip...

 

[fabrice]

Well, fluid goggles are also very expensive. And I don't want to dive without a clear vision...

Fabrice

 

[subaquaticus]

Well, fluid goggles are also very expensive. And I don't want to dive without a clear vision... Fabrice

Did you try normal swimming goggles filled with water ? How was it ? Cannot you see a little what happens ?

 

[bruno]

Hello,


I attached a picture of myself swimming a long dynamic. You can see my neck and upper back is red, although I have the impression of being relaxed in my back. Is this a false impression or not, and what could be the reason for that? I mean, if a lot of blood is there, it can not deliver its oxygen to the brain. And what can I do improve

 

[pat fish]

1th secret: Lots of stretching - for a streamlined and still relaxed arms position you have to work on flexibility in your shoulders.
2th secret: a very specific stretching exercise for (monofin) swimming is hanging with your arms at a bar/door frame for several times a day (for example after each visit to the toilet)
3th secret: Lots of stretching over a long period of time (month/years+!) to really see results.

pat