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cold cold water suits
- Thread starterholdown
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Thread Status: Hello
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If you're strictly looking for a freedive suit, a good 7 mil open cell suit will allow you enough time to see what there is to see for a couple hours. I use a 7 mil Picasso Commercial and it gets me through, though doing the ice thing is more along Jon's forte. I start hitting ice or much below 40F I start dragging the Unisuit from the closet and calling for more hot water.
Wellllll , here in North Dakota our winter temps can run from 35 - -42F.. 
I've worn just my 5mil open/closed cell Elios under the ice several times for up to 1/2 hour or more and been fine, freediving under the ice for me means not so deep and not so long so neoprene compression doesn't become a factor really. When using the 5mil for scuba where compression and longer times at depth becomes a factor I'll throw another 3mil layer over it. I don't have much natural insulation, about 0, so you have to consider that too. That's pretty good for a 5mil suit I'd say. Having virtually NO water exchange helps. Remember too, the thicker the suit and the addition of linings makes them more difficult to put on because the don't stretch as much.. but also remember.. when it's below freezing outside it's no fun lubing up an unlined suit.. even if you use boiling water it's freezing by the time your trying to slide into it.
Fred
I've worn just my 5mil open/closed cell Elios under the ice several times for up to 1/2 hour or more and been fine, freediving under the ice for me means not so deep and not so long so neoprene compression doesn't become a factor really. When using the 5mil for scuba where compression and longer times at depth becomes a factor I'll throw another 3mil layer over it. I don't have much natural insulation, about 0, so you have to consider that too. That's pretty good for a 5mil suit I'd say. Having virtually NO water exchange helps. Remember too, the thicker the suit and the addition of linings makes them more difficult to put on because the don't stretch as much.. but also remember.. when it's below freezing outside it's no fun lubing up an unlined suit.. even if you use boiling water it's freezing by the time your trying to slide into it.Fred
If it's very cold you can also add a neoprene vest under your jacket and newprene "bermuda shorts" on your trousers. Bermuda is good cause it seals the easiest way-in for water, that is the bottom space between jacket and trousers. An example of what I'm talking about:
Spearfishing and Freediving Equipment - Wetsuits - Ocean Mimetic Vest & Bermuda - Technosport Inc.
Spearfishing and Freediving Equipment - Wetsuits - Ocean Mimetic Vest & Bermuda - Technosport Inc.
We use elios 5 or 6 mil here - been diving in 15F air temps and -8F windchills - water is just this side of solid. I like a smoothskin top to help with cold air/wind - wicking away the heat but I dove last winter in my 5 mil nylon out suit with good results - my dive buddy uses a 5 mil elios nylon out. Mine is 6 mill - smooth top/nylon out bottoms. We're generally in at least 90 minutes. Shot from yesterday.
If you get an elios suit - have them make you some three finger mitts and socks - they are awesome and you won't find cheaper or better. They'll also do vests and shorts at very reasonable rates.
If you get an elios suit - have them make you some three finger mitts and socks - they are awesome and you won't find cheaper or better. They'll also do vests and shorts at very reasonable rates.
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I think 5mm open cell is the ultimate solution, keeps You warm enough under ice and You can use it in the summer (especially below termocline) too. It's also soft and stretchy.
7mm would be probably too hot in warm part of the year.
I don't know yet how much it compress but will find out soon. I am going to use it for SCUBA in Bonne Terre mines soon (58F water 60-70ft depth)
Foundeset, that's another great picture of Yours!
Enybody used 5mm open cell in Florida? I am going there in march and I think I may be little too hot.
7mm would be probably too hot in warm part of the year.
I don't know yet how much it compress but will find out soon. I am going to use it for SCUBA in Bonne Terre mines soon (58F water 60-70ft depth)
Foundeset, that's another great picture of Yours!
Enybody used 5mm open cell in Florida? I am going there in march and I think I may be little too hot.
Thanks, my buddy took that one.
I was getting nauseous from overheating in 73f water in my 5 mil. I agree 5 mil is a great across-the-board solution. I got my six mil after diving all day in 48F water - getting in and out of boats etc.
I was getting nauseous from overheating in 73f water in my 5 mil. I agree 5 mil is a great across-the-board solution. I got my six mil after diving all day in 48F water - getting in and out of boats etc.
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Sure, Fondy, a great pic: massimo rispetto.
My water in the Thyrrenian Sea is slightly above 15°C these days (warmest winter I remember), and I'm using 5mm open cell + 2mm undervest. I wonder with terror what a poor bugger like me should wear under your icey Michigan.
My water in the Thyrrenian Sea is slightly above 15°C these days (warmest winter I remember), and I'm using 5mm open cell + 2mm undervest. I wonder with terror what a poor bugger like me should wear under your icey Michigan.
I've done plenty of dives in an off-the-rack 5mm opencell/nylon suit and was fine. I use my 6mm opencell/smoothskin for ice diving because I have it and it keeps me warm, but for anything else I go back to my 5mm because it's easier to move in and requires less weight.
Having the opencell/smoothskin suit is great for winter diving when the wind is blowing but they are not as strong as a nylon out suit and tear much more easily- so becareful if your going to use your's for scuba diving Peter. I ripped the top on my pants at this last ice dive, but was still warm enough to spend plenty of time in the water- I glued it up over night and was ready to dive the next day. The smoothskin dries out pretty fast if there is any kind of a wond blowing.
If you go with a custom suit no more than a 6mm should be fine. I think that Gene was pleasantly surprised how warm his 5mm kept him during the ice dive.
The more important thing is keeping your hands and feet warm. I use some 5mm 3-finger mitts from elios that are silver lined/nylon and my hands stay pretty warm. If it get's really cold and I need to stay in for a super long time I also own some DUI dry gloves that I can wear with a wetsuit- they have the drysuit seal attached to the glove. These are very bulky but the warmest things out there. I prefer the elios mitts as it's easier to work my camera in these 3-finger mitts than the, much, bulkier dry gloves.
For my feet I am, now, wearing some 5mm Spetton Gold lined/nylon socks that seem to work better than the Elios socks I've owned in the past. I also used to own a pair of 5mm Esclapez opencell/nylon socks that were my favorites until I wore them out. Along the way I've used 5mm OMER socks with ankle seals on them, 5mm Cressi socks with silver lining, and 5mm elios socks- some with opencell on the inside and some with nylon on the inside. All were nice but these Spettons are my current favorite.
Ice masks will also help to keep your face warm for those extended trips into ice water conditions.
I hope that others are getting out and diving because all that I have done the past three days is shovel snow.:head Today's has been the worst because it was too much for my snowblower and I had to shovel in the rain for a while?! My snow banks are now taller than my wife and my neighbors and I had to shovel out the City Snow plow 3 times so far today! I just watched my neighbor hire a guy to clean out his drive way with a Bobcat front-end loader. I was VERY jealous.
Maybe I'll be able to dive next weekend.
Jon
Having the opencell/smoothskin suit is great for winter diving when the wind is blowing but they are not as strong as a nylon out suit and tear much more easily- so becareful if your going to use your's for scuba diving Peter. I ripped the top on my pants at this last ice dive, but was still warm enough to spend plenty of time in the water- I glued it up over night and was ready to dive the next day. The smoothskin dries out pretty fast if there is any kind of a wond blowing.
If you go with a custom suit no more than a 6mm should be fine. I think that Gene was pleasantly surprised how warm his 5mm kept him during the ice dive.
The more important thing is keeping your hands and feet warm. I use some 5mm 3-finger mitts from elios that are silver lined/nylon and my hands stay pretty warm. If it get's really cold and I need to stay in for a super long time I also own some DUI dry gloves that I can wear with a wetsuit- they have the drysuit seal attached to the glove. These are very bulky but the warmest things out there. I prefer the elios mitts as it's easier to work my camera in these 3-finger mitts than the, much, bulkier dry gloves.
For my feet I am, now, wearing some 5mm Spetton Gold lined/nylon socks that seem to work better than the Elios socks I've owned in the past. I also used to own a pair of 5mm Esclapez opencell/nylon socks that were my favorites until I wore them out. Along the way I've used 5mm OMER socks with ankle seals on them, 5mm Cressi socks with silver lining, and 5mm elios socks- some with opencell on the inside and some with nylon on the inside. All were nice but these Spettons are my current favorite.
Ice masks will also help to keep your face warm for those extended trips into ice water conditions.
I hope that others are getting out and diving because all that I have done the past three days is shovel snow.:head Today's has been the worst because it was too much for my snowblower and I had to shovel in the rain for a while?! My snow banks are now taller than my wife and my neighbors and I had to shovel out the City Snow plow 3 times so far today! I just watched my neighbor hire a guy to clean out his drive way with a Bobcat front-end loader. I was VERY jealous.
Maybe I'll be able to dive next weekend.
Jon
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Hey Jon,
they made my socks and mitts from black shadow neoprene. Both are extremely warm. The socks seem warmer than my 5 mil omers with the ankle seal. The mittens often stay dry. I've been thinking about wearing wool gloves under them. The smooth top is really soft neoprene. I'm amazed how comfortable and easy to get on and off it is. The best thing though is how you begin to warm up immediately when you get out. You can just bask in the sun like a seal. Risky with scuba though - I've made a couple of small scrapes just with fingernails - have to really watch it if you're shrugging out of a BC or something.
they made my socks and mitts from black shadow neoprene. Both are extremely warm. The socks seem warmer than my 5 mil omers with the ankle seal. The mittens often stay dry. I've been thinking about wearing wool gloves under them. The smooth top is really soft neoprene. I'm amazed how comfortable and easy to get on and off it is. The best thing though is how you begin to warm up immediately when you get out. You can just bask in the sun like a seal. Risky with scuba though - I've made a couple of small scrapes just with fingernails - have to really watch it if you're shrugging out of a BC or something.
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thanks for all the imput. I too have very low body fat, and as I dive mid summer in a 5mm elios and am perfectly comfortable-I'm leaning towards a 7mm for winter-strictly freediving. the sea here can, during a cold winter, dive into the high 20's. Rather go with a little less mobility and more weight than start getting chilly too soon. The mitts are great, I agree-I've been surfing winters here for too long and you wouldn't last 10min with 5 finger gloves. Can't wait to get more sea time and less pool time.
The ice dive was called off for today and I had too much shoveling to do to even think about going to dive the outlet for a dive.
All of my socks were warmer than the OMER's since those were just double sided nylon. My Elios socks were warm, but my feet slipped all around inside them and I almost broke my neck my a couple of times from having my feet slip around inside of them. I certainly would never reccomend lubing up a sock to put it on since they are so slippery already. The other ones seem to be slick on the top part but have a nylon coating on the inner sole of the sock. This makes them easier to walk in.
The main reason I like the Spetton, socks more than the Elios ones is because of how they are stiched together. The elios ones had a seam running right down the top of the foot that would rub on my foot as I swam.
The other socks are made with more panels and are smooth across the top of the foot. It's kind of like the difference between different types of bike shorts- more panels euqals more comfort and more expense to make/buy. The Spettons also have a nice mini-sole on the, outer, bottom that make them more durable. I still wear sandals over the top when walking to the dive site, but the extra sole protection is appreciated.
Jon
All of my socks were warmer than the OMER's since those were just double sided nylon. My Elios socks were warm, but my feet slipped all around inside them and I almost broke my neck my a couple of times from having my feet slip around inside of them. I certainly would never reccomend lubing up a sock to put it on since they are so slippery already. The other ones seem to be slick on the top part but have a nylon coating on the inner sole of the sock. This makes them easier to walk in.
The main reason I like the Spetton, socks more than the Elios ones is because of how they are stiched together. The elios ones had a seam running right down the top of the foot that would rub on my foot as I swam.
The other socks are made with more panels and are smooth across the top of the foot. It's kind of like the difference between different types of bike shorts- more panels euqals more comfort and more expense to make/buy. The Spettons also have a nice mini-sole on the, outer, bottom that make them more durable. I still wear sandals over the top when walking to the dive site, but the extra sole protection is appreciated.
Jon
Re - body fat - I'm 6'1" about 164lbs. The elios socks are really simple for sure. I have some parkway 6 mils I picked up in the sale bin locally - they've got some kind of heavy duty fabric - almost a heavy canvas on the bottom - great for walking on gnarly stuff. Insane weather here right now - east wind - which is very odd, and blizzards! Hard to find a good point of entry without ice.
Great Picture Jon, the coldest I dove here in AK was 4C, with my picasso dark 7mm, first dip in the water I get the classical ice cream headache, but after a while it was gone. I lasted 90 minutes, the week points were the foot, pretty numb after 90mm , the numbness extended to the legs, that force me to leave, if there was fish, I would probably had try a little longer.
Added to the picasso suit I use 7 mm picasso socks and 5 mm cressi gloves, let me plug a question here.
Any one is aware of a sock thicker then 7 mm ? I am having some coupling issues with my omer foot pocket and I was thinking about trying a 9 mm sock if that existed.
Added to the picasso suit I use 7 mm picasso socks and 5 mm cressi gloves, let me plug a question here.
Any one is aware of a sock thicker then 7 mm ? I am having some coupling issues with my omer foot pocket and I was thinking about trying a 9 mm sock if that existed.
Elios could make you a 10mm sock if you want.
I needed an ice cap with my picasso as the hood was cut a bit larger than on other suits I have owned.
Chris, get ready for the storm that just went through here! I talked to my father-in-law today and he said they had a 3' swell running up the Milwaukee river today- very strange.
Jon
I needed an ice cap with my picasso as the hood was cut a bit larger than on other suits I have owned.
Chris, get ready for the storm that just went through here! I talked to my father-in-law today and he said they had a 3' swell running up the Milwaukee river today- very strange.
Jon
I wonder if you sleep in an unheated icy waterbed and drive to work in a SUV Submarine Underwater Vehicle!? You do stuff I never even imagined doing back in Minnesota, geez, I thought summer water skiing and winter X-C skiing on the Miss. was wild but I sure wouldn't have jumped into a hole in the ice.
Great backfloating pic, Fondue.
DDeden
It was pretty wild here. The reason I could shovel in a t-shirt was because the air was so warm, even though we had a ton of snow.
My father-in-law mentioned a 3 foot swell that worked it's way up the Milwaukee river and knocked barges off their tie offs and trashed a couple of his docks- which was also pretty unusual.
It's still snowing here, although much lighter than yesterday, and they are talking about another rain/snow storm for later on in the week.
Jon
My father-in-law mentioned a 3 foot swell that worked it's way up the Milwaukee river and knocked barges off their tie offs and trashed a couple of his docks- which was also pretty unusual.
It's still snowing here, although much lighter than yesterday, and they are talking about another rain/snow storm for later on in the week.
Jon