contractions on descent

[rovanpera]

Hi,

I get strong contractions quite early on my dives, usually after 30-45 sec.
On fun dives or fishing in the 10-20m range I don't mind them (my dives are usually in 2 min range), but on deeper dives I do, and I have already injured my throat on a 30m dive and that took 2 months to heal.

I've been freediving in the sea for couple of years quite regularly, and this is now the main reason that is keeping my dives in the 30-40m range.

Doing a lot of diving and co2 tables doesn't seem to delay the contractions.

My preparation is tidal breathing followed by one big breath, no packing, and I'm not willing to change this.

Would be nice to hear from others who have had the same problem and how they have dealt with that.

 

[Azrael3000]

Out of interest, when you do a static, how long until your contractions start and how long is your static in general?

 

[rovanpera]

On statics the contractions start at 1.30, and I usually bail out after 5 min... I do the same preparation as with deep dives - tidal breathing and no packing.

 

[Simos]

I don't dive to that range nor have this issue but a couple of thoughts:

1. Throat injury - could have been prevented (even with contractions) with better technique and throat flexibility (you can train this I believe)? Seek advice from an experienced instructor for exercises etc

2. Since you don't want to experiment in other ways (good choice) maybe you can try diving a bit heavier so that you can get more free fall and generate less CO2 on the way down? Obviously way up will be harder so take it easy and gradually. Maybe try a VW dive if you have the right set up to check it out. Again someone more experienced than me will help more.

There are possibly a few other things to try but best to let someone more qualified than me to comment.

 

[rovanpera]

Hehe, I have learned my lesson and I'm not gonna get squeezed like that again. I was just suprised to see it happen on such a shallow full lung dive. I probably lost mouthfill and was trying to get more air from the lungs while having hard contractions. I do work on throat/chest flexibility reqularly.

I dive pretty heavy from the reasons Simos mentioned , usually I'm neutral at 8-9m. Ascending is not an issue from these kind of depths.

 

[Bill]

FRC dives will help with the pressure contractions. In theory, you can let out half the air and simulate 30 meter pressure at 10; easier and safer.

 

[rovanpera]

I've done frc and empty lung, both depth and static tables, but while those have helped with a lot of things, they have not delayed the start of my contractions. I've done FRCs to 25m and full exhales to 15m.

Can you be more specific in what kind of FRC dives have you done, how much, and what has been the effect on contractions?

 

[gnioco]

Hi,

I have same problems. My contractions start in static quite early, at 1:30 to 2:00, but working on relaxation I achieved that this contractions are pleasant and soft. My pb in static competition is 6:10.
I think that purpuse of CO2 training is to train "how to deal with contractions", stay relaxed etc...
If anyone knows specific training for "delaying" contractions, it would be useful also for me.
Thank you,
bye

 

[Bill]

One of the big problems with training is that too much of it is goal oriented. The volcano (sulfur dioxide mostly) for a few years has forced me to accept ridiculous limits in both performance and training. Some people learn things the hard way. Relaxed, almost empty lungs from about 2 meters seems to work best.
In the long run, it doesn't care how deep you go or how much you inhale and/or exhale, only the technique you used to get there. Relax, enjoy the dive, don't look at a gauge and the first sign that the dive isn't perfect, stop, return to the surface, analyze and repeat. You really don't want to learn bad habits.

 

[Bill]

@gnioco..... Some of my best statics had over 5 minutes of contractions. Granma Bel, the gal that helped me the most says "you have to make them your friend".

 

[efattah]

I would make the important comment that 'tidal breathing then one deep breath' may acceptable for a one-max or for the first dive of the day. But if you are making one dive after another, with short intervals, you will have to breathe way more aggressively to avoid excessive CO2 accumulation. The word 'hyperventilation' usually refers to aggressive breathing designed to lower the CO2 level below baseline. However, in the case of repeated dives, the goal is not to lower the CO2 level below baseline, but to lower the CO2 level BACK to the baseline. There is a huge difference. One way to test your method/setup is to do this:
- In the middle of your dive day, after several dives with regular intervals, do a regular surface interval, same as all the others, except instead of diving after your final breath, remain on the surface and do a static breath hold. See when the first contraction comes (and end the static after that), and compare that to your normal 'dry' static.

 

[tcrusson]

Hi mate, my contractions start as early as yours on most dives. Statics usually around 1:30 (2min at best), and when fun diving around 30-45s.
For some reason it doesn't happen on deep dives. The only explaination I can think of is that I dive relatively fast, and get narked quite shallow (60m). 45 seconds takes me to 55 meters, then I go to lala land and don't get contractions until I start the ascent. However contractions may happen on the way down if I'm tense.
Not sure how that would help, but in short: there's hope ;-)

PS: if I were you I would try to ventilate a bit more, I understand TV breathing would help you if you were getting close to a LMC otherwise, but having dived with you I'd say you've got a fair way to go before that happens, if you're diving in the 30s or 40s!

 

[efattah]

As you go very deep, the super high oxygen tension inhibits the contractions.

 

[tcrusson]

As you go very deep, the super high oxygen tension inhibits the contractions.

Why not. However it doesn't really explain why contractions often start straight after the turn?

 

[Bill]

That's why some call them pressure contractions. They may not have anything to do with CO2.

 

[rovanpera]

Bill, I know what you mean about bad habits, those are hard to get rid of. I'll try to take it easy both above and below the surface.

Tanguy, are you doing any intraflexion/bandhas during the dive, or trying to just completely relax? Maybe your mouthfill topping up has also a blocking effect on the contractions, you wouldn't be doing that on a fun dive? I'm on dry land still for 2 weeks, so I'm figuring out things to try when I get back to the big blue. Heh, your speed is almost double to mine...

Eric, Thanks, I'll try that test. I'm not trying to conciously hypoventilate, rather letting the body to ventilate as much as it needs and trying not to have a "pattern". I don't feel a buildup on fun dives, but that doesn't mean there is not any.

 

[Spearo_the_Hero]

My preparation is tidal breathing followed by one big breath, no packing, and I'm not willing to change this.

I suspect this is the culprit...so time to modify it a bit...and why not? Why not double or triple your last breaths? However, safe-and-sound it may seem to take only one breath it has been causing the onset of contractions very early, as Eric noted due to high CO2 and therefore makes for an uncomfortable shallow dive. Otherwise, you will have to endure early contractions and be going deeper with them---not easy to do if you want to double your depth in the future. When you do take your one breath are you taking it all the way up to your IRV or not?

This is why many do some type of purge breath or something after doing a few minutes of slow relaxed breathing(eg. 4 in 8-10 out) just to drop CO2 down to normal levels, which while getting you very relaxed has also been building up CO2. Then you take just a couple of really deep breaths.

Overall, you should experiment with what works well for YOU, but you must be willing to change if you want to stop contractions on decent, which is preventing your mind for relaxing into the dive. I personally don't like to feel early contractions. Otherwise you will have to be satisfied with 30-40M dives with early contractions. Not a bad thing, per se.

Everyone responds a bit differently. In the SSI Freediving system we suggest 2-4 deep and full breahs before the plunge AFTER relaxed breathing.

Your main issue and thread starter is about early contractions, consider to change the breath-up routine, which a proper one is everyone's secret to having a great dive-and each person's is different. Don't be afraid to change and try new things..you'll have good safety divers to spot you on the dives.

 

[rovanpera]

Some good suggestions here, thanks everyone! I'll update the thread when I get back to diving and trying some new things.

 

[Azrael3000]

I'm quite new to freediving so excuse me if I point out something blatantly obvious. But what I feel delays my contractions is that if I use the epiglottis to block the airways instead of the tongue. Overall I'm much more relaxed. I will need to put in more training as my epiglottis tires relatively quickly thus causing leaking. I will try and do some comparison and report back, in the meantime maybe somebody with more experience wants to comment?

 

[Bill]

Tongue block and reverse tongue block will probably become more useful as you advance.