I'm thinking of taking creatine w/ weight training b/c i want my muscles to get a little bigger, and I know that having increased upper body muscle mass is detrimental to freediving b/c these muscles eat up more 02 and also will make you less hydrodynamic. but I am willing to deal with that b/c i am not a tournament freediver or anything like that. But my question is will creatine have any other adverse effects on my physiology that will hinder my freediving.
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Creatine effects?
- Thread starterSpearoPimp
- Start date
Thread Status: Hello
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The efficiency, recovery rate and lactic acid resistance, of weight trained muscles will, in my experience far out weigh any O2 guzzling effect you could ever achieve. I am confident that weight trained muscles are relatively more efficient at metabolism and would use equal or even less O2 than spaghetti limbs. They are running at idle when spaghetti legs or arms are working hard and when they are called on to work hard they do anaerobically and use even less o2.
As for creatine.. its a natural substance found in red meat and i cannot think of a good idea why is might be negative to apnea.
As for streamlining, a natural bodybuilder cannot expect to put on more than 2 kg of real muscle in a year. This is not a factor at all to resistance in the water, unless it all goes to your head which gets fat and flat in which case i would say change your routine.
Skin.
As for creatine.. its a natural substance found in red meat and i cannot think of a good idea why is might be negative to apnea.
As for streamlining, a natural bodybuilder cannot expect to put on more than 2 kg of real muscle in a year. This is not a factor at all to resistance in the water, unless it all goes to your head which gets fat and flat in which case i would say change your routine.
Skin.
I know several top freedivers who use creatine, but not to increase muscle mass. Rather, they use it as a recovery aid during the last phase of a train-up for a record or competition. In this mode, creatine is taken immediately after a brutal training session in the gym (not deep diving) or pool. Lots and lots of water must be consumed. By brutal, I mean these folks are in flat-out aerobic, anerobic, resitance, etc. effort for four or more hours.
The proposition, as I understand it, is that the creatine speeds up the restocking of mitochondrial ATP and makes it possible to undergo the same torture the very next day.
I neither endorse nor disparage this practice. I've tried using creatine after harsh workouts, but I personally cannot say whether it helped my recovery or not. Maybe it only works on young folks ! Maybe I should be trying to detect whether it slows my decline into decrepitude.
The proposition, as I understand it, is that the creatine speeds up the restocking of mitochondrial ATP and makes it possible to undergo the same torture the very next day.
I neither endorse nor disparage this practice. I've tried using creatine after harsh workouts, but I personally cannot say whether it helped my recovery or not. Maybe it only works on young folks ! Maybe I should be trying to detect whether it slows my decline into decrepitude.
Creatine phosphate is the ideal energy source for apnea exercise. Your body can store enough creatine phosphate for 5 seconds of 100% maximal exercise, which converts to as much as 2 minutes of submaximal diving style movements.
Seals and marine mammals have vastly higher creatine concentrations in their muscles and use it as a primary fuel during dives.
Upon depleting the creatine phosphate energy reserve, about 50% of it is regenerated within 60-seconds of recovery breathing. After 5 minutes of recovery 90% of the creatine phosphate has been regenerated.
The fact that higher muscle creatine can effect weight training has very little to do with freediving---in the sense that the PRIMARY gain of higher creatine by far is the instant energy it provides without the use of oxygen or carbohydrates. Burning creatine phosphote stored in muscles produces no byproducts such as CO2 or lactic acid. It is a totally 'clean burning' fuel, the only drawback is you can only store a limited amount of it.
Anaerobic training will naturally cause a huge increase in muscle creatine concentrations.
As an example, during a 10-sec 100m sprint by a world class sprinter, 50% of the energy comes from creatine phosphate, 50% comes from stored ATP, and virtually 0% comes from glycogen (carbohydrates). This is why a 10-sec sprint doesn't produce lactic acid; to produce lactic acid requires burning carbohydrates.
Another example:
During a 100m sprint:
- The first 5 seconds burn pure ATP
- Then, the ATP stored is exhausted
- Then, the creatine phosphate in the muscles is consumed as it regenerates the ATP store
- The ATP store is basically back to normal now, but all the creatine phosphate has been broken down into creatine and phosphate
- You now can burn the ATP with 5 more seconds of sprinting
- Now you have exhausted all your ATP and all your creatine phosphate, so you must start to burn carbohydrates which produces lactic acid and will try to consume oxygen as well
If you stop after 10 seconds of sprinting, the reason you are out of breath is because your body is trying to regenerate the creatine phosphate and ATP, and it is trying to regenerate those by burning carbs to produce ATP, which in turn restores your ATP store and also rebuilds the creatine phosphate molecules.
Seals and marine mammals have vastly higher creatine concentrations in their muscles and use it as a primary fuel during dives.
Upon depleting the creatine phosphate energy reserve, about 50% of it is regenerated within 60-seconds of recovery breathing. After 5 minutes of recovery 90% of the creatine phosphate has been regenerated.
The fact that higher muscle creatine can effect weight training has very little to do with freediving---in the sense that the PRIMARY gain of higher creatine by far is the instant energy it provides without the use of oxygen or carbohydrates. Burning creatine phosphote stored in muscles produces no byproducts such as CO2 or lactic acid. It is a totally 'clean burning' fuel, the only drawback is you can only store a limited amount of it.
Anaerobic training will naturally cause a huge increase in muscle creatine concentrations.
As an example, during a 10-sec 100m sprint by a world class sprinter, 50% of the energy comes from creatine phosphate, 50% comes from stored ATP, and virtually 0% comes from glycogen (carbohydrates). This is why a 10-sec sprint doesn't produce lactic acid; to produce lactic acid requires burning carbohydrates.
Another example:
During a 100m sprint:
- The first 5 seconds burn pure ATP
- Then, the ATP stored is exhausted
- Then, the creatine phosphate in the muscles is consumed as it regenerates the ATP store
- The ATP store is basically back to normal now, but all the creatine phosphate has been broken down into creatine and phosphate
- You now can burn the ATP with 5 more seconds of sprinting
- Now you have exhausted all your ATP and all your creatine phosphate, so you must start to burn carbohydrates which produces lactic acid and will try to consume oxygen as well
If you stop after 10 seconds of sprinting, the reason you are out of breath is because your body is trying to regenerate the creatine phosphate and ATP, and it is trying to regenerate those by burning carbs to produce ATP, which in turn restores your ATP store and also rebuilds the creatine phosphate molecules.
I'm glad to know that, as I was also wondering about whether going to the gym would positively or negatively affect my diving. Now I've got all the motivation I need!Skindiver said:
If my head starts getting fat I'll be seriously worried! rofl
Lucia
I just read some info on creatine, and one thing that got me thinking was that taking creatine also speeds up the metabolism in the relaxation phase. Its supposed to cause some 50 - 100 kcal more per day burned by the metabolism while relaxing. This is an advantage when losing weight or bodybuilding, but I wonder if it could be a disadvantage in freediving. Could static performance be affected by this?
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When i was in sport medice we had to do a paper on creatine for positives and negatives
there werent many positives, increased muscles build (how big your muscles look) was the only one. the reason the muscles look larger is the excess creatine would store water in the muscles, this would also cause the muscles to be damaged more while working out. The body can not always recover from the extra damage to the muscles, the muscles grow but dont gain strength. Football players using creatine for extend periods of time (6 months) had a higher chance of injury.
we found ppl using creatine saw the best over all performance increase using creatine in 6 month intervals. They would increase the muscle mass then go off the creatine and strengthen the muscles.
ya thats what i remember from that class, sorry for the lack of detail i took it 5 years ago and have not persuide it any further
there werent many positives, increased muscles build (how big your muscles look) was the only one. the reason the muscles look larger is the excess creatine would store water in the muscles, this would also cause the muscles to be damaged more while working out. The body can not always recover from the extra damage to the muscles, the muscles grow but dont gain strength. Football players using creatine for extend periods of time (6 months) had a higher chance of injury.
we found ppl using creatine saw the best over all performance increase using creatine in 6 month intervals. They would increase the muscle mass then go off the creatine and strengthen the muscles.
ya thats what i remember from that class, sorry for the lack of detail i took it 5 years ago and have not persuide it any further
Ive never been a big fan of creatine for the sole reason that it allows you to build musle quicker and hence less strenth, it helps your musle to restore quicker than it normally would and thus you push harder at each session possibly over extending yourself... In times when you go to the gym to build more musle, remember you also want these to be strong and I always used to go the natural way when doing this, drinking a high protien shake for lunch on days of your workout always worked for me and I got the same strong musle gain as the creatine guys the shake included wheat germ a egg yolk sugar free yogurt, preferably vanilla flavoured or plain, a bit of low fat milk and some honey to taste. This gives you a protien and energy boost which your body needs when pushing hard and also wont allow you to completely over extend yourself. I always used this method and it worked very well for me but if you dont burn it dont use it otherwise your body will put all that energy and protien into fat. I used it when I played rugby and had to gain muscle and weight for my position before the season started but have stopped with the heavy gym and rugby after I hurt my back but thats a different story and it wasnt due to lack of protective muscle more stupidity and pride...
Another reason I didnt use creatine is because I heard it shrinks your privates and your head rofl
Another reason I didnt use creatine is because I heard it shrinks your privates and your head rofl