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Creatine load

Thread Status: Hello , There was no answer in this thread for more than 60 days.
It can take a long time to get an up-to-date response or contact with relevant users.

fpernett

Well-Known Member
Nov 7, 2001
832
102
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Anyone has experience with creatine loading before competition?
What do you feel more efficient slow or rapid loading?
What is best citrate or monohydrate?

I asked this questions because there is no data on literature about it's use in freediving, so I ask for personal experience
 

Cliff Etzel

Photographer & Visual Storyteller
Jul 7, 2000
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I utilize the citrate form.

My research indicates that the citrate form of creatine is more readily absorbed by the body - something like 97% absorbtion rate as compared to monohydrate at 5% absorbtion (I think)

The monohydrate version also tends to cause abdominal cramping as well.

You will also find the best way to take Creatine is on an empty stomach approximately 30 minutes before lifting or cardio. I usually combine it with some amino acid supplimentation as well.

As a side note - within 30 minutes after working out, I have read that a pure protein powder should be consumed with water along with some form of carbohydrates (complex ir liquid carb supplimentation) - studies have shown that after strenuous exercise like weight lifting and/or cardio workouts that the muscles almost readily absorb these substances instead of the body turning them into fat.

I have utilized this routine and noticed great results.
 

efattah

Well-Known Member
Mar 2, 2001
3,294
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Complicated

As all dietary issues, this is a complicated one. I have tried creatine monohydrate, creatine citrate, creatine pyruvate, creatine glycerol phosphate etc... In addition, pure creatine malate will soon be available from S.A.N.

Monohydrate is definitely the worst; abdominal cramps from any creatine are caused only by ingestion of un-dissolved crystals, and since monohydrate is by far the least soluble, it also brings the best chance of such cramps.

Further, the common practice of taking tons of dextrose to spike your insulin with creatine sucks for freediving because it kills your adrenal glands, and so your ability to stay conscious in hypoxia plummets.

More recently, there have been ideas about combination training/diet programs to maximize natural creatine production. Such programs include a combination of power training, as well as the creatine precursors arginine, methionine, trimethylglycine, and guanadinoacetate, as well as BCAA's.

In the end, creatine supplementation takes time, regardless of the loading method.

The big problem here is that most people don't realize that taking creatine, in the end, is to form creatine phosphate, so you need phosphate. If you take creatine without extra phosphate, you cause such a demand for phosphate that the creatine 'steals' the phosphate from your muscle ATP, decreasing your total ATP, which makes you worse than you started off. Some of the smarter companies include small amounts of phosphate in their creatine 'mixes', but even those are not sufficient in quantity. And, to make matters worse, too much phosphate is only slightly more than too little.

Eric Fattah
BC, Canada
 

icarus pacific

Human-in-training
Nov 7, 2001
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Fair question Jay.

I for one just plain dove. :hmm

I hope there's a store near the kkcrib in case my Midol runs low...


sven
 

pkotik

FreeDiving Editor
Nov 28, 2001
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CREATINE

My 21-year old son thinks he is too skinny, has begun consuming
creatine, and thinks that in conjunction with his weight-lifting it
is adding muscle mass.

I have a queasy feeling about this - don't like it. Any general
advice on creatine ?
 

PILOT

Deep Purple
Oct 30, 2002
65
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having to dive and midol running low.....

now thats just good humor, plain and simple
 

Cliff Etzel

Photographer & Visual Storyteller
Jul 7, 2000
549
34
118
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Paul - Creatine by itself isn't going to add mass as he is wanting.

There are several excellent books as well as personal trainers out there that can help him attain the specific physique he is desiring.

I would make sure though that he isn't doing over the counter HGH or worse.

If proper research has been done, this substance should only be taken if one is over 40 or as prescribed by your health care professional.

Just my $0.02
 

Frederic Buyle

New Member
Dec 22, 2001
31
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0
Just for your information, creatine is considered as doping in some countries.

For example, it's on the official list for banned substance and doping in France.

There must be a reason.

Be carefull about the quantities and the product's origin. And often, creatine supp have "hidden" banned substances like ephedrine and nandrolone to boost the effects....and that can only be found by analysing the product.

Fred.
 

efattah

Well-Known Member
Mar 2, 2001
3,294
487
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E.U.

The European Union is only one step away from banning ALL nutritional supplements in Europe (including vitamins and minerals). They are doing this under pressure from the drug companies, so it doesn't suprise me that they would ban creatine or any other supplement. For example, here in Canada, it is almost impossible to buy amino acids (i.e. L-arginine, L-glycine, etc., or any other protein powder consisting of free-form amino acids)!! They are banned! Does this mean that amino acids are bad? They are just protein.... Also, here in Canada, it is not possible to buy the 'picolinate' form of any mineral (i.e. zinc picolinate, iron picolinate), even though all the studies show that these are the best kinds of minerals. So, just because Canada has banned 'picolinate' minerals, does this mean that picolinate minerals are bad?

Supplements are already in your body. Drugs are created by man. The IOC does not ban supplements, they ban drugs, and only drugs which are shown to be harmful. The exception is hormones (such as hGH and EPO). Hormones are in your body, but taking exogenous hormones is very dangerous.

The reason the drug companies want all nutritional supplements banned is obvious. They make more money. Most men, for example, are zinc deficient, which causes sexual problems. By banning zinc, the drug companies are assured that the man will be prescribed viagra, to 'cure' his problems. By preventing menstruating women from taking calcium, the women are more likely to get moody and depressed, so the doctors then prescribe prozac to 'cure' the depression. The long term effects of preventing people from taking calcium include osteoperosis, so the drug companies will make a fortune treating that disease. Some people have a need for a lot of magnesium; by blocking those people from accessing magnesium, they can even have seizures. But, if they have seizures, the doctors prescribe drugs for epilepsy. Of course, the epilepsy drugs have side effects which could includes migraines, but the doctors can prescribe all sorts of drugs to fix the migraines, but the side effects of those drugs can include homicidal mania! So then you commit crimes and go to jail! But the drug companies make money. Creatine is given to many people with brain problems (some people's bodies cannot convert guanidinoacetate into creatine). Creatine has given them a new life. But, the drug companies would rather ban creatine and give the patient some more expensive drugs.

Of course, even though the drug companies want all supplements banned, the presidents of these companies are known to take supplements themselves... to keep themselves healthy.

So ask yourself, would you rather take supplements (i.e. vitamins, zinc, folic acid, choline, creatine etc..), or would you rather take chemicals invented by men (viagra, prozac, tylenol etc.)

In the old days, of course, all you needed to do was eat food! But MAN has screwed up the land so badly that food no longer has enough nutrition in it. For example, most people think that eating oranges gives them lots of vitamin C. But, oranges have been so badly hybridized, and grown in poor land, that many oranges in supermarkets today have NON-DETECTABLE levels of Vitamin C !!!

Eric Fattah
BC, Canada
 
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pkotik

FreeDiving Editor
Nov 28, 2001
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THANKS, ERIC

So, Eric, bottom line is all I have to do is take some zinc and everything will be okay again ?


Paul
Plantation, FL USA
 
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efattah

Well-Known Member
Mar 2, 2001
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:)

For some people, a bit of zinc is all it takes... :) Stock up before it's banned!


Eric Fattah
BC, Canada
 

Mad Max

New Member
May 21, 2002
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Hy Everybody!

First of all creatin "helps" building up the muscles. If you are Body builder and you do some 6 reps with your max weight creatin can help to do about 10 reps after a few days, this means that you can build more muscles in a shorter time.
But the problem is, if your not very strict with your creatin dose, I mean if you're taking too much of it, it can damage your liver and kidneys. You have to drink a lot more than your normal dose a day. Normal about 2-3 litres, with creatin you have to drink up to 5-6 litres, otherwise it can damage your kidneys as I said.
Most bodybuilders I know take it, but it couses another problem. In the first two weeks of creatin you gain about 3-4 kilos after 8 weeks another 2-3 kilos, BUT most of the weight is water wich you loose after come off from creatin. So the real weight you gain is about 2-3 kilos (muscles).
Then be carefull you cannot take creatin the whole year, only three times a year for 8-10 weeks the other time your body needs a brake from creatin.
My cousin for instance take it 6 weeks ( he took too much) and sufferd a few days on kidney pain. But now he takes it again couse the first time he gain 2,5 kilos.
Be carefull with alcohol and coffein(that includes red bull as well as coca cola). Both dehydrate the body so the effect of creatin is like nothing. (be carefull with alcohol anyway).


So, too Paul, there is nothing really bad on creatin if you know HOW to take it. Say your son he should buy some good fitnessmagazines (like FLEX, or Muscles & Fitness), there are always some good articles about this topic. But the most important thing in bodybuilding is "eat more as you need", and eat healthy things.
Training+Feeding+Recovering= good muscles


But I never thought creatin would help with freediving.


Sorry about my bad english

Mad Max
 

Murat

Promethian
Jun 21, 2002
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Re: E.U.

Originally posted by efattah

Supplements are already in your body. Drugs are created by man.


Eric Fattah
BC, Canada

Both meat and fish has some creatin in it.So it's natural.Bannig creatin?.Ok then, they must also bann eating red meat and fish ! !
We must know the difference between the drugs and supplements.But it's seems like that some important guys on the top don't know anything.I odered my first supplement from the net.It was creatin monohydrate 1kg box.It arrived here but it stuck in custom.They send me the paper that saying you must get permission from one of OUR doctors.God damn! ! ! there are some poletical shits going around here.One island two goverment,border line in between,you don't allow me to pass you side.But you fell free to say me "get prescription from one of OUR doctors".
:naughty :ycard :ycard :rcard :vangry :vangry :martial
 
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efattah

Well-Known Member
Mar 2, 2001
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Creatine & Meat

Not only do fish & meat have lots of creatine, but raw fish has especially lots. In fact, if you ate almost exclusively raw fish, you would absorb as much creatine as you would with supplementation. Maybe that's why seals have so much creatine in their muscles.


Eric Fattah
BC, Canada
 

Erik

Well-Known Member
Jan 21, 2001
4,731
753
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Re: Re: E.U.

Originally posted by Murat


Both meat and fish has some creatin in it.So it's natural.Bannig creatin?.Ok then, they must also bann eating red meat and fish ! !
QUOTE]

They wont have to....just eradicate it, or at least make it extremely expensive. That's what is happening with Genetically Modified Foods, like cereal crops. Organically grown foods, like fruits, vegetables and even chickens, cost a lot more in the stores, so a lot of people cannot aford them (or think they can't), while useless GMO's are cheap to make and sell. Someone also gets a patent on this new, supposedly improved "food", and gets rich in the process. Farmers need fast and efficient methods, so organic is out.
Do yourselves a favour and spend the extra money or grow and hunt your own....we've spent millions of years evolving with this stuff around: it's what we're supposed to eat!
Cheers,
Erik Y.
 
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fpernett

Well-Known Member
Nov 7, 2001
832
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Thanks

Many thank for your opinions.
Luckily in my country most of the food is 100% natural.
That combination of creatine with intermediate products of Krebs cycle will be more effective
 

icarus pacific

Human-in-training
Nov 7, 2001
2,880
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Re: Re: Re: E.U.

Originally posted by Erik
[
Do yourselves a favour and spend the extra money or grow and hunt your own... it's what we're supposed to eat!
Cheers,
Erik Y.


I agree completely... eat your greens, yellows and reds. And should you run across something pink, well then eat that too. :p
(especially if it's got that fish-thing going on...)

;)


sven
 
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sam1234512345

New Member
Oct 6, 2017
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Bumping an old thread. Cliff Etzel said he thinks creatine citrate is best. I havn't tried that one but I have been on creatine-pyruvate for only one day, and so far it seems very good compared to other forms. Perhaps citrate, and pyruvate have similar chemistry once they are in the body to do with absorption, and uptake by cells.
 
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