Descending in a Straight Line

[blueface]

I reduced the amount of weight I use to 9 lbs. with a 3 mm suit and my partner noticed that I over rotate and dive at an bad angle wasting time and effort. How can I correct this problem? The easiest way to dive straight is to look at the bottom but the mask creates drag. Any thoughts?

Skip Perry

 

[Gwaihir]

I have the same problem,and awaiting eagerly an answer .I have thought about attaching a 2kg veight to an arm ? or maybe a neck weight is the answer ?

 

[Dennis77]

Hm. You use 9lbs with a 3mm suit? 9lbs are about 4,5 kg, right? I use 4 kg, wearing a 5mm suit. Perhaps you should try to use less weight? In which depth are you neutral bouyant?

To look towards the bottom creates problems. First of all, it get´s much more difficult to equalize. And it creates stress, because you have to stretch your neck. More stress, more o2 consumption.

I personally think, the best way to learn to descent vertically is the following. Dive on a rope. The more often you do this, you will get a feeling for your position in the water. Then you can start to dive in the blue, without a rope. But your buddy watches you not only for your safety, but he also check your position. After the dive, he can tell you everything about your position.

It´s not easy. But time will bring success. Or let´s better say; the more dives you did correctly on a rope, the better you´ll be without a rope.

 

[apneaboy]

If you look at the bottom you will arch your back and you won't go down straight. You should look straight ahead, preferably at a taught line. Your nose should point at the line not the floor.

The thing you need to be careful of when changing this is that you know where the bottom is so having a plate or markers so you don't hit your head is important. It takes a bit of practice but you will notice you go straighter and use far less effort looking forward not down. If you have no line and the bottom is deep I use the surface as a point of orientation so i can judge if i'm straight or not.

Neck weights will help you stay straight especially on the drift faze of the dive.

You should weight yourself to be neutral between about 10 - 15metres, 9 lb sounds a lot in a 3mm

Good luck

 

[Pixie74]

I had that problem, so I added more weight and it seemed to help.

 

[demasoni]

Check out this post:

How to go straight down...without looking down? - DeeperBlue Forums

 

[blueface]

Hm. You use 9lbs with a 3mm suit? 9lbs are about 4,5 kg, right? I use 4 kg, wearing a 5mm suit. Perhaps you should try to use less weight? In which depth are you neutral bouyant?
It´s not easy. But time will bring success. Or let´s better say; the more dives you did correctly on a rope, the better you´ll be without a rope.

I'm neutral at about 25 ft. The suit is very buoyant for a 3 mm. It is a 2-pc with a farmer John bottom. I think I might be concentrating too much on stream lining and not thinking about orientation. It was easier with more weight. Thanks!

 

[sgnips]

more weight helps your descent, though not improving your dive position, and also means a loss of safety

You should weight yourself to be neutral between about 10 - 15metres, 9 lb sounds a lot in a 3mm

THIS is a good advice

learn to dive with LESS weight first, eventually with NO WEIGHT AT ALL!!
i always wear a 2pcs 5mm and never carry more than 3kg, often only 2kg; also, at the AA instructor course Umberto and his staff made us dive with no belt for almost 80% the time we spent in water... i can assure you it's been worth

let us know

 

[blueface]

more weight helps your descent, though not improving your dive position, and also means a loss of safety


THIS is a good advice

learn to dive with LESS weight first, eventually with NO WEIGHT AT ALL!!
i always wear a 2pcs 5mm and never carry more than 3kg, often only 2kg; also, at the AA instructor course Umberto and his staff made us dive with no belt for almost 80% the time we spent in water... i can assure you it's been worth

let us know

I am definately going to drop some weight but the problem is I have to kick a lot more to get down and I get tons of CO2 and a weaker dive reflex. I guess I just need to practice more. I have done most of my diving practice with no weight at all and only a partial breath. I have been experimenting with different amounts of air in the lungs but for spearfishing I like to take full breaths in case I need to work hard (fight a fish) at depth.

If I use less weight and took smaller breaths I would still be negative at 20 or 25 ft. and a stronger dive reflex. Wouldn't this be the same as over-weighting on a full breath?

Is it better just to take full breaths and kick like a maniac? I do like the fact that it's easy to get back up with lighter weight.

Thanks!

Skip

 

[Gwaihir]

always take full breath.

 

[apneaboy]

The more weight you use the easier you go down to a certain extent is true. You need to look at the end of the dive though because the more weight you use the harder it is to get up!

If you practice good technique with ideal weight or even slightly light you can become very efficient at the duck dive and the initial few kicks to get you down so you don't expend too much energy even when weighted neutrally quite deep. I can get down with a 7mm with no weight when practicing if i need to.

At the end of the dive you have an easy ride back up, when you need it.

Take the example to the extreme, if you keep adding weight eventually you wont need to do anything to get down, but then getting to the surface and staying there would be extremely difficult. Adding weight feels like the path of least resistance but its only half the story. Technique is the way to get down easier not more weight.

Have a look at a few competition videos and analyse the technique they use to get down, have your buddy have a look and see if they can spot any obvious stuff. Take a course with somebody you will learn loads of good stuff, especially safety information.

Good luck, dive safe

 

[blueface]

Thanks for all the input. I could certainly improve my duck dive and kicking.

 

[Dennis77]

To drop all of the weight, like sgnips said, is good to work on your duckdive and finning technic. Of course you have to kick like a maniac. But therefore your way back will be easy as you will shoot towards the surface like a trident missile.
But this is only for training. If you want to dive a whole day just for fun, you´ll be exhausted like hell if you have to work all the time to stay down.

The advice to take a look at competition videos,.... I´m not so stupid to say my style is perfect. Not at all. But often the technique you can see in such videos is far away from perfection.

 

[jay cluskey]

expending less energy makes for a more relaxed dive and also increases depth more quickly also i remember diving with about 4kg on a course i went down like a bomb yes, i got to my depth and fealt it quite difficult coming back up mins later spit was full of blood and rest of day was rubbish i was too tired to dive i had a bit of a squeeze
a few months later i dived with apneaboy using 2.5 kilos ,1 on my belt and 1.5 round my neck . easier dives, quicker depth achievements ,less energy spent , more dives.
technique will improve with more dives and good positive criticisim and a great coach.

 

[sgnips]

learn the duck dive with no weight, and you'll get 3m down with the belt, effortless

another point is, you can't exactly control your partial breath, so your buoyancy is about to be different from dive to dive, that is: always take full breaths

also, partial breath dives might be extremely dangerous and are something i would not recommend

dive safe!

 

[blueface]

learn the duck dive with no weight, and you'll get 3m down with the belt, effortless

another point is, you can't exactly control your partial breath, so your buoyancy is about to be different from dive to dive, that is: always take full breaths

also, partial breath dives might be extremely dangerous and are something i would not recommend

dive safe!

I practice exhale dives to shallow depths just to get my dive reflex going and I occaisionally take partial breaths using no weight at all and my dive reflex is very strong because I reach the static phase much quicker among other reasons. I know not to expend a lot of energy when doing this. Have you done any exhale dives? If I'm spearfishing I will always take full breaths unless hunting very shallow and I need to stay down.

Another question I have is; When I have to kick hard to get down I start with a few hard kicks followed by medium and then soft. When I reach the static phase I feel pretty good but on the bottom the CO2 feeling comes quicker. How do I stay comfortable longer? My depths are 80 to 90 feet and time is 1:30 or so.

 

[sgnips]

i did some exhale dive in pool and very few in the sea because i have to look at the newbies and have little time to make something else, anyway i use exhale to learn mouth filling (but it is excellent as a warmup before diving sessions)

i have some trouble interpreting some of the terms you all use here, as they might be different than the straight translation

what you mean by dive reflex? (bloodshift?)
and by static phase? (good feeling due to high O2pp?)

about your second question: i feel the same when making some stops at max depth, usually 25m or more, co2 contractions come just a while after stopping my descent, and feels like they wouldn't have come if i continued to move down (depth and time are just like yours)
i think we have to work on relaxation in depth, i am definitely sure i can make a 30m dive lasting much more than 1:30, even double that time
maybe your kicking lacks technique, or you look for high speed you really don't need, or something else, this resulting in wasting lot of energy and losing relaxation

hope my poor english is working good enough...

 

[blueface]

what you mean by dive reflex? (bloodshift?)
and by static phase? (good feeling due to high O2pp?)

When I say dive reflex I mean Mammalian diving reflex (lowered heart rate, more relaxed feeling etc.) Static phase is the point of a dive when I stop kicking and sink to the bottom.

I was thinking my fitness level has a lot to do with my short bottom time. My finning technique and duck dive could also improve. Thank you for the response! I will continue to try. I woul like to take a course but I live in Guam and it's far from any place that offers it.

Skip

 

[sgnips]

i learned that dive reflex has nothing to do with depth: it activates just by getting your body (the face in particular) wet, you can achieve it in your bathroom

sure your fitness level ha something to do with your bottom time, but your mental fitness has much more impact on it: work on

 

[blueface]

i learned that dive reflex has nothing to do with depth: it activates just by getting your body (the face in particular) wet, you can achieve it in your bathroom

sure your fitness level ha something to do with your bottom time, but your mental fitness has much more impact on it: work on

Thank you so much sgnips I will learn to focus and concentrate more. I know that you are right because sometimes I think too much and I can't relax.