Dolphin stroke, no fins

[Siku]

As I can't wear fins in my local pool I've been practicing monofin-style but with no fin.

I've progressed from literally going nowhere to being able to do 25m reasonably easily. Hopefully this is helping with my monofin technique as well as general aquacity and, of course, butterfly. I'm now as good at dolphin-no-fins as I am at DNF (i.e. terrible).


Does anyone else practice this stroke?
If so any tips or observations would be very welcome.
How do your distances compare to standard DNF?

Thanks

 

[Simos]

I'm still at the going nowhere phase if I don't use fins for monofinning :-( my back/hips are not flexible enough to get a proper undulation going and I think I lack core strength too.

Are you keeping your feet/knees close together?

 

[Siku]

I'm trying to as I've heard you get more propulsion that way.

Swimmers do this stroke really fast after a tumble turn but I've been trying to do it very slowly so it's more like monofinning.

My core strength and flexibilty are really bad so don't give up! I've improved mainly by trying to increase my awareness of those muscle groups and movement patterns. And, of course, don't worry about numbers (speed and distance) - it's easy to cheat with the knees, but resist and focus on the core.

Done well it's such a beautiful stroke.

 

[Simos]

I'm the worst person to give advice on this but might be worth trying to do faster but smaller undulations without fins (not kicking with knees obviously).

I noticed when I switched from longer fins to shorter swimming fins that it was much better/efficient/natural to do faster but smaller undulations. You just need to find the right rhythm.

Are you sure you can't wear any fins at all? There are some pretty tiny swimming fins you can buy...

 

[Siku]

I'll certainly try a bit faster. I imagine it could be more efficient to build up some momentum.

I'm taking it slow to try and get the movement right, the same way you'd learn a new dance move or a piano piece. I've tried speeding it up and it's actually hard for me to do a quick dolphin, even a crap one.

We did this in training once and Joelle did a demo. I don't remember how fast/slow her undulations were but each one was moving so much water that there were huge ripples on the surface in her wake, and boy was she going quickly! No one else could compete (although Allie was pretty good).

 

[Simos]

Let's hope someone else joins the conversation but I think the swimmer's dolphin stroke is not the only stroke you can use with the monofin. There are also fins like the DolFins that are now coming out that actually require a different technique and more kicking with knees/feet but they cost and arm and a leg at the mo...

 

[Kars]

I try to put to words what one does for a monofin technique with a monofin. I hope this helps you to distil a monofintechnique without fin(s). I do sometimes practice monofin technique without fins but I find that for my limited abilities the most speed is obtained from a simple lower leg kick while keeping the rest nearly strait. However I do find when I put on small fins the speed is great and when I put on the big one the speed is awesome right after no fins. Until it ebbs off...

This is mend for with a monofin or bi fins:

As a warm-up you can first do a few laps of back-crawl, at a slow and faster pace. This will help greatly to warm and loosen up your shoulders and upper back.

Starting position after pushing of the wall.
Hand on hand arms resting on the head, having your shoulders sunk into your body (instead of stretched out), strait but not too tense legs, maybe heals a bit outward because x-legs help to keep them strait.

1) Start the cycle by lifting your arms up a bit, keep the legs and body strait letting it rise a bit.
2) tense and curl your hips forward and lift the middle back up.
3) Tense your your feet, Roll your upper body (hands, head, shoulders) forward as you straiten out your legs, letting you back and ass rise up.
4) Glide

It's all an act of balance, something I personally am not good in at all. But seeing a nice technique frame by frame you can analyse and see a lot. I should make an even more detailed analysis with listed motions and time bars for each one. Because some motions overlap. For this a GO pro 60fps side view footage would be really cool!

Timing of the different movements is crucial, maintaining the balance too.
Often for me it helps to do alternative slow and fast lanes.
I recognise my 25m pool profile is very tough for learning a consistent stroke, and the fear of bumping into a surface swimmer doesn't help either.
Often I find myself doing to big undulation, bordering on my strength and flexibility range, rendering my swimming tough and exhausting. When things come together it feels like flying fast and effortless!

Gosh I wish I had a consistent technique...

(I checked out the two swim strokes from 1'10")

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z0c-1U17Fms"]Elisabeth kristoffersen - 150m DYN training - YouTube[/ame]

 

[hteas]

here is the best video I have found on no-fins dolfin

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qEGlOYxO_48]Dolfin Style Underwater - YouTube[/ame]

I just wish I could do it that well

 

[ReefTroll]

That is a neat style but looks fairly labour intensive??

 

[dimitris33]

I sometimes make some 25s that way. Cheating with the knees in the beginning is a must otherwise you are not going anywhere. When you gain some speed by continuous strokes then you can start reducing the knees help. The "rule" kick and glide or 2kicks and glide etc does not apply here unless you are a master. Try also upside down i.e. looking up the surface as it seems to me little easier that way.

IMO this is the best method to train for DYN. After doing some 25s that way then when you put your monofin on you feel like God.

 

[hteas]

ReefTroll,
The dolfin kick in the video is definitely energy intensive.
At the same time it allows you to play with the technique in order to become more streamlined and efficient. As your technique improves, it will also improve technique with fins on.

 

[Simos]

here is the best video I have found on no-fins dolfin

Dolfin Style Underwater - YouTube

I just wish I could do it that well

You should check out the name Misty Hyman if you can find some videos of her, she is awesome in dolphin kicks. There should be some on YouTube.

 

[ReefTroll]

Fair call hteas!

Simos, what an unfortunate name I always thought she had

 

[dimitris33]

I've made some Dynamics with dolphin strokes without fin on Saturday. I have found that the most easiest way to train on this is by doing 25s on your side. This way I found that spine is much more flexible contrary to looking down classic style or upside looking the surface where usually you loose your right direction and balance unless the surface is mirror flat. Doing strokes on your side (left one 25m and right another 25m and so on..) you can look far away the walls of the pool so you gain a nice balance without even thinking about it, so you can then focus on your technique.

Speed is also better that way, at least for me.

 

[Simos]

I've made some Dynamics with dolphin strokes without fin on Saturday. I have found that the most easiest way to train on this is by doing 25s on your side. This way I found that spine is much more flexible contrary to looking down classic style or upside looking the surface where usually you loose your right direction and balance unless the surface is mirror flat. Doing strokes on your side (left one 25m and right another 25m and so on..) you can look far away the walls of the pool so you gain a nice balance without even thinking about it, so you can then focus on your technique.

Speed is also better that way, at least for me.

It's true that sideways you can get a nice big amplitude - they all have their place. We usually alternate - length looking down (front snorkel), length on back, length on left side, length on right side and so on. You can try doing 4setsx4 this way (ie 16x33m) with minimal breaks and notice how/if your technique breaks down as you get tired (do this with rubber fins, will be too much with no fins)

 

[Siku]

Thanks for the input everyone. I tried some dolphin no fins on the side this evening and found it very different, although I'm not sure if the change was physical or mental! lol! I'm sure the view affected my balance.

I've found swimming dolphin no fins on the surface with a front snorkle as Simos suggests very different to swimming it apnea submerged. I've also noticed that it seems easier nearer the bottom - and gets harder as the deep end drops away and leaves me in open water! Anyone know if this 'near-the-bottom' phenomena is real or psychological?

 

[Simos]

Thanks for the input everyone. I tried some dolphin no fins on the side this evening and found it very different, although I'm not sure if the change was physical or mental! lol! I'm sure the view affected my balance.

I've found swimming dolphin no fins on the surface with a front snorkle as Simos suggests very different to swimming it apnea submerged. I've also noticed that it seems easier nearer the bottom - and gets harder as the deep end drops away and leaves me in open water! Anyone know if this 'near-the-bottom' phenomena is real or psychological?

I am not 100% on this but in theory it should be easier at the deeper end. Probably the bottom of the pool gives you some frame of reference to make it easier to swim horizontal - also the closer you are to the bottom, the faster you think you are going.

Personally I find it a bit annoying at times to be too near the bottom as my knees hit the bottom (bad technique I know!)

 

[Siku]

the closer you are to the bottom, the faster you think you are going.

Good point!

 

[mystiach]

 

[HansQz]

I know this is a late reply, but here is a link to another video like the one Mystiach posted of Natalie Coughlin.

The link below has sound and shows Michael Phelps' dolphin.

Underwater Kick - with Michael Phelps & Lenny Krayzelburg - YouTube

Notice that all the power (both Michael Phelps and Natalie Coughlin) is generated from the hips/torso down, with very little to no upper body movement. The more the upper body moves & undulates, the more drag one creates.

Try using a kickboard. As a former competitive swimmer (I still swim for training), I can tell you that a useful tool all swimmers utilize to help with kicking is a simple kickboard.

You can do sets of either flutter kick, or alternate strokes (flutter, dolphin, breaststroke). Time your sets and go at regular intervals, for example, 5 x 100 yard/meter kicks at 2:30 or 3:00. Try to keep your upper body stable and still without moving up & down, and keep your heels beneath the surface. I Guarantee you will feel the leg & torso burn!