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Dynamics PB

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Fabio Toyama

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I was wondering what is supposed to be a good standard for dynamics without fins.
Today I managed 75m (3 x 25) without fins after my weight training..

In the future I will try to be more hydrodynamic perhaps with a swimming cap, a suit, or neck weight (where can I buy them?)
I'm trying to condition my body to doing statics and dynamics tired to see if it improves my performance when relaxed.
Even tired I had some improvements.. did 5:40 static, 15 mins after heavy training.
Just need to be carefull not to overstress my body.. I've read some threads about it.
I'm also taking some anti-oxidants supplements.

I strangely find that my performance is not hugelly better when my body is relaxed.. My static PB is 6:10 in good conditions (temperature, body relaxed... ) and it's getting to 5:45 in bad conditions (water a bit cold and tired after weight training) ..
I would expect a greater difference between those trials in such different conditions of body and environment..

Is that normal?
Or maybe my PB in good conditions is already higher and I don't know..
As I haven't tried any dynamics with my body not being tired, my PB is still on 75m. I could not claim I'm capable of more if I haven't being there.

Well, let's see..

All the best to everyone!
 

IronLung

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I dont know whats normal and what isnt. I'm fairly new to freediving, Ive looked at these forums a lot, and after I did 125 YARD (it comes to about 112M) dynamic, sans fins, I knew it was time to get serious about this. When I did the 112 dynamic, most of the swim team was in the pool watching. They had seen me do 3 and 4 laps, upon hearing I was attempting 4 and half (Ended up doing 5) everyone was interested, I was just glad that there would people watching to do something should I suddenly start convulsing or something. I had a friend of mine walk alongside me on the side of the pool, just to be safe, though I do think it would be a good thing to make sure I have some trained rescured around next time I do anything like that. how safe (dangerous?) is it to do these things? I want to keep going, but I want to be safe. Oh, almost forgot, after getting a reply on another post, I got to wondering, what is the US record for dynamic without fins?

Ike
 
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Fabio Toyama

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yards / meters

What's the size of the pool you had this trial?
You said 125 yards in 5 pools. That's 25 yard length pool which is 22.8m length pool. That's quite unusual having a pool with that lenght.
Are you sure about the length of the pool?
Well, in yards or meters it's really impressive!
I'd appreciate if you gave us a bit more details on your swimming technique, warm up...
Keep going with your dynamics training and you'll be breaking records soon!
All the best
 

IronLung

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Yes, it was a 25 YARD pool, actualy, not as unusual as you might think, all high schools compete in yards rather than meters, in America anyway. It converts to 114 meters rather than the 112 I previously calculated, but hey, thats 2 meters more, I'm not complainin'! Thing is man, I really dont have a warm-up, I havent done any serious training or anything, I just felt good that day, did a breathe-up, and went for it. If you want a few tips on stroke technique, check out Training and Techniques Dynamic PB thread. I posted a video of Kitajima demonstrating a very good underwater pull-kick sequence, along with the extremely helpful dolpin kick (illegal in breastroke competiton, but not dynamics!). Thanks!

Ike
 

hypoxiajunkie

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Apnoe swimming to extremes is always dangerous: you can pass out from lack of oxygen. Without a spotter, well, you would drown. Its that simple. I had a black out. There is no warning (ok I was exhausted but thought I could make just one more meter - and almost did).

If I did not have a spotter I would be dead.
 

IronLung

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I am fully aware of swb, there were lots of people around, all watching, all great swimmers. I asked a friend of mine to walk alongside me outside the pool. And quite a few are lifeguards and have good training. I was safe, othewise I wouldn't have pushed that far.

Ike
 

hypoxiajunkie

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Originally posted by IronLung
I am fully aware of swb, there were lots of people around, all watching, all great swimmers. I asked a friend of mine to walk alongside me outside the pool. And quite a few are lifeguards and have good training. I was safe, othewise I wouldn't have pushed that far.

Ike

Good. Your statement:

" how safe (dangerous?) is it to do these things? I want to keep going, but I want to be safe."

Sort of worried me, since you are doing an AWESOME PB (I am so jealous!) yet seemed a bit unsure of just how dangerous it is.

As long as you have a spotter you trust with your life its not dangerous. I got fished right out, started to breathe on my own.

I have a rule for myself: if I exhale air underwater I surface. Otherwise I could not train since I have to train sometimes without a spotter. I know full well I could kick out five, maybe ten maybe even 15 more meters after that if I really pushed it - or I could die.

I wish I could do as well as you. My PB with fins is ok, but without fins ugh.

How old are you?

Make sure all your buddies realize just how dangerous this sport is! People DO die (Mestre, for example). Its only as dangerous as you make it. Be smart: dive with a buddy, or set limits (no hyperventilation for example; no going beyond X meters).
 

IronLung

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OK, I knew it couldnt be totaly safe being underwater, but I'd like it to be as safe as possible. And I do warn my friends, its not something you can just go and do, make sure youve got spotters if youre going for long distances and things like that.
Im 18.

Ike
 
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hypoxiajunkie

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Well, the good news is you are plenty of young enough to become a world champion.

Were I your age that is exactly what i would do.
 

hypoxiajunkie

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Originally posted by IronLung
WORLD Champion? You think so?

Why not? The dynamic no fins world record is "only" 166m. That is only another fifty-four meters. You expected to do less than you actually did. And you can always improve your technique (lung capacity, streamlining) You are much younger (more than ten years younger) than that record holder. You have probably been swimming for years already. And, yes, actually I am insanely jealous of you :)

You basically have 10 years in which to set records.

You could very likely already get a U.S. record for dynamic no fins - though you need to get judges and pass a no drugs test afterward.

Before you let this get to your head: PROMISE me that you will train with a buddy. You need a spotter. Plenty of people have blacked out with no spotter and <b>died</b>. That is my only concern for you, honestly: when young, people tend to think themselves indestructible. Um, were not indestructible. Young people also tend not to know limits and to try to push beyond them. So be careful: but, with training and a spotter you could certainly make records.

Mind you, there is no money in free diving. It's not like other swimming sports where you can expect scholarships, advertising spots etc.. Its not in the olympics (underwater swimming was in the 1904 olympics but not since then) Your coach would know more about your best chances to make a living out of swimming.
 

IronLung

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Well, you're right about swimming, I've been doing it all my life. Since before I can remember I've loved to be un the water, especialy underwater, theres something magical about it to me. So this is something I've pretty much been living my life doing, it's a lifestyle. It's how I relax. A good static or two, both around 3 minutes, is my meditation. Better than sleep it seems sometimes.

I will not train without a spotter, I promise.
Thanks for your confidence in me!

Ike
 

Kars

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Make sure your spotter is SWIMMING next to you with fins, and knows EXACTLY what to look for and what to do, and is not affraid to do so -stable caracter-. PRACTICE IT. repeat the practice every now or then, maybe even unannounced to check the skills.

Follow a proper freediving course, you'll learn much about a lot of things, and your buddy (find one!) also discovers maybe his/her disipline.

An oxigen provider may also be handy if you want to do a PB, and requierd for a record. Contact your national aida association.
Maybe it's fun to participate in a national freedivecompetition, if you swim a national it can be acknowleged / ractified, and you'll mee many 'soul'mates on top of that!

About training, focus on the technique, which is probably already on a High level. create some neckweight to allow for a better position when being full of air.

Have fun,

Kars.
 

neshamah

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hi

posted a video of Kitajima demonstrating a very good underwater pull-kick sequence, along with the extremely helpful dolpin kick
___________

Hi Ike I would like to see that video- where is it?

saludos

Daniel.
 

efattah

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IronLung,

The US record for dynamic without fins (in a 50m pool):
Men 81.8m Glen Garrett (Set at UBC in Vancouver, Canada)
Women 82.0m Julie Moran Morton (Set at UBC in Vancouver, Canada)

Glen's PB, to my knowledge, is 115m in practice.

According to AIDA rules, the pool must be either 25m or 50m, so technically you can't set a record in a pool which is less than 25m long. The reason is simple; if the pool is 9m long, you can push off the wall and get to the next wall, without swimming...


Eric Fattah
BC, Canada
 

IronLung

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Eric: That makes sense about the length of the pool.

For Daniel: http://www.swim.ee/videos/breast/DQ-legkicks-after-start.mpg
That litle kick adds SO much..

Kars: An oxygen provider? Would that be a tank of oxygen in case of swb? I'll talk with my buddy about your spotting technique, make sure he knows what hes seeing when I do this or that. Neckweights, how much weight should I use? I can hardly float as it is.

Thanks guys!

Ike
 

watts

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Ike i made neck weight a while ago with some lead shot and small sinkers. Mines about 2 kg and thats still not enough so ill have to make another. The other night i managed 75 m after doing some co2 tables .I was really happy with that cause i new i had more in me .This thursday im going to try to beat that so fingers crossed.:D
 

Roland

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IronLung,

An oxygen provider is someone that can administer pure oxygen. For this you can do for example an oxygen provider course from Divers Alert Network so you know how to do this.
A shallow water blackout (SWB), also called ascent blackout is what you can get when you dive deep. In a pool you do not get SWB but a pool blackout. There are small differences but the result is the same: a blackout.

The amount of (neck)weight you need is very personal.
The purpose is not needing to waste energy to maintain a good swimming position. You must neiter sink nor float to the surface and be able to float in a horizontal position so you do not waste energy to maintain a good swimming position and all your energy can be used for propulsion.
 

hypoxiajunkie

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See, that is an example of your advantage being young; you have a lower fat-muscle ratio. When I was younger I would sink even with full lungs. This is no longer the case, and though I would like to think that it is because I now have larger lungs I somehow doubt it.

Anyway, at least I have the pleasure of talking to the guy who will break all the records I can't even reach!
 
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