Er... apnea bladder control...

[glubglub]

This has been brought up before, but I thought I jog the memory again.

I've been training dynamic apnea lately to actually lose weight more than anything. That and Pacific is pretty cold now.

Lately I've done 2x25m in pool with regular frequency, which is fun except...

Whenever it takes slightly longer to reach it, say 1min+ instead of 50secs+ I lost bladder control

Rest assured, I hydrated fairly well, and my 1mm suit has seals on the appropriate parts, so contamination is pretty contained, if not, I think those toddlers cause way more damage bacterial count wise (isn't urine actually sterile? [ame=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Urine]Urine - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia[/ame])

So does this mean I'm getting close to my limit? Or is it the sign of dive reflex? If so, is that good or bad?

I don't think it's immersion diuresis, as I don't have urge to urinate at all most of the time, and bladder control loss just happen at the end of my apnea session where I slightly fight the urge to exhale. Actually it happens after I inhale the first time at the end.

 

[sgnips]

i also don't think it's immersion diuresis, as you're doing dyn in shallow water (are you...?)
maybe while fighting the urge to exhale you reduce your control on the rest of your body including bladder
you ask if you are close to your limit: 50m dyn? hmm... i'd say no, almost sure about that, but the point is: do you feel close to your limit?

don't think it's bad, except for the urine you're sharing in the pool (but who doesn't?)
and i wouldn't call it actually good, either, as i don't see any benefic effect in this, otherwise almost everyone would report it

 

[BennyB]

i also don't think it's immersion diuresis, as you're doing dyn in shallow water (are you...?)

You can get immersion diuresis in shallow water as well, otherwise they'll have to come up with another scientific reason why thousands of freedivers are peeing in pools

maybe while fighting the urge to exhale you reduce your control on the rest of your body including bladder

I think this could be it, but likely combined with the effects of immersion diuresis. I know a couple of people that in static lose a bit of self control towards the end, be it a bit of wayward gas or some pee (luckily no number 2's yet...)

If you are going through a lot of contractions then you are probably concentrating on them and not trying to control your other downstairs urges. It's all a part of the dive reflex, of course people's dive reflex can be different - stronger/weaker or triggered at different levels.

Cheers,
Ben

 

[sgnips]

Quote:
Originally Posted by sgnips
i also don't think it's immersion diuresis, as you're doing dyn in shallow water (are you...?)

You can get immersion diuresis in shallow water as well, otherwise they'll have to come up with another scientific reason why thousands of freedivers are peeing in pools

i intended that as DEEP immersion diuresis, sorry

but does the one you mean has only to do with increased heat dispersion in water? or you can have immersion diuresis even in warm shallow water?

 

[BennyB]

I guess it comes down to how you define cool water, as immersion diuresis is supposed to be triggered in water cooler than body temperature. Not many pools are at 37deg and wetsuits would not keep the body that warm either. As far as pressure goes, I imagine that even the small pressure of immersion at the surface is enough to trigger some sort of response. I know that immersion diuresis in the pool is a pretty common thing though, I get it and most people I train with do.

Cheers,
Ben

 

[sgnips]

i get it also, and always meant it to get because of cool water (25 to 27 degrees the ones i train in)
thanks

 

[Tony Babowicz]

I think its a normal occurrence. Most likely part of your dive reflex. I piss frequently during dynamic training. I keep a big bottle of water on the deck to recharge. It keeps me warm on those cold days.

 

[glubglub]

*phew* Thank you for clarifying that out.

No, I don't think I'm close to my limit either. I've been only doing 50m dynamic for a week now, and honestly the biggest limitation I have now is my kick efficiency and turning time. I still have much much room for improvement. Right now when I hit 50m felt like when I first started up hitting 25m way back when I first tried monofin. It's just mental prep.

Touching on diuresis: I thought it's urge to pee, rather than involuntary control loss. When I'm at 10 - 12 meters under in 60 F water, I would experience it, but not on a heated pool at 80 F, not normally at least.

 

[DeepThought]

Touching on diuresis: I thought it's urge to pee, rather than involuntary control loss.

I thought (and still think) the same. From what I understand diuresis is the production of urine, not releasing it.
The phenomenon of feeling close to losing control over the bladder (or the other... exit) is not that uncommon in apnea. As for actually losing control... I'm not sure.
Could it be that you hydrate too much?
Do you eat mostly protein, or fast before apnea? this could also cause an increased production of urine...
Do you hyperventilate (any kind of purge/forced breathing)? Maybe lose of bladder control is the first sign of partial loss of motor control for you...
Do you have gigantic contractions? - maybe the repeated abnormal pressure on the bladder causes it to release....

I can't think of any other reasons at the moment...
In theory it could be that you're just wired that way... I would try to change my routine and see if there's any effect.

 

[doyenofcastle]

I had that also loosing control and I never reach to contractions even though the BH reach 3 minutes