Euro tabbed spears.

Old Man Dave · Jul 2, 2009

Anyone know if the Omer america series of tabbed spears are equipped to fit euro triggers? I sort of assume they are as they are made by Omer and Omer guns are euro triggered.

I was wondering if a 6.3mm diameter Omer america spear will fit in my Omer XXV Gold, set up with open muzzle to allow for the tabs.

Anyone got any experience along these lines? Also any sources of the spears in europe?

Looking to mod the XXV with lifters at the muzzle and use a single circular band which will run parallel to the spear shaft. Would like to use a tabbed spear with this set up.

Dave.

DivingDane · Jul 2, 2009

hi Dave

yep they fit euro mechs, same shaft that is in the Omer Cayman HF with flopper cone and raised tabs. i think in the larger HF's they are 6.7 and 7mm but i know they make a 6.3mm so you should be fine, sounds like a really nice gun when you are finished ideal for smaller fish and an absalute laser.

DD

spaghetti · Jul 4, 2009

Here I am Dave (took a day off with my baby). Go for it: any Omer shaft will fit any Omer trigger. America are particularily well made: I have a 6,3 with sharkfins wich looks stunningly beautiful: the sharkfins are welded state of the art, recessed flopper is very precise, the steel is quality: not too rigid, not too elastic.
About the source, I'm afraid that it's not worth ordering a shaft from Italy, as the shipping would be more than the shaft itself...
So are you installing a Hammerhead muzzle or a custom "Old Man's" home made?

Old Man Dave · Jul 4, 2009

General idea would be to manufacture 2 lifters from a nylon type material and hold them in place with a stainless bolt that will replace the pin that holds the carbon barrel to the head. Should be light and strong. Can carve away some materila to further lighten and streamline them after a test or two. Needs a few fancy machines but I have them. Also doesn't alter (or weaken) the original gun so no damage done if it doesn't work. If they work well I might epoxy bond them in place for a bit of extra strength.
Dave

DivingDane · Jul 6, 2009

hmmm i like, very nifty idea, may try to make something like that for my 110 HF?

Lazuli · Jul 7, 2009

So where is the best place to get these sexy tabbed spears from??

spaghetti · Jul 7, 2009

Brilliant idea, Dave. The inline bands may increase the accuracy and (slightly) give a little more power too.
If I may give you any advice, your main concern might be the buoyancy and balance of the gun.
With the thin 25mm barrel, the Omer XXV has a very delicate balance, and so I guess you'll have to take care not to unbalance the gun too much by adding extra elements in the front segment...
I guess you can work on the problem by the means of choosing materials: you might need to make it heavier with lead inserts (?) or maybe to make it more buoyant with rubber or cork or polystirole elements (?) I can't tell, just guessing.....

Laz I guess that apnea.co.uk or scubaland.fr are the closest source for Omer shafts for you Britons.
You may also try with Dave Spearo.co.uk, as Seatec's sharkfin tabbed spears are really really good.
(curiously, Omer's sharkfin tabbed spears are called "America" while Seatec's are called "Australia"....No wonder if Cressi started making its own "Madagascar" tabbed spears maybe? :t)

Mr. X · Jul 7, 2009

Hi OMD, sounds like Omer is the way to go in this case. I noticed DK underwater sports carry Picasso spears and offer a sort of "pinned" sharkfin for spears as a £10 upgrade: Spears - Picasso Underwater Sports Spearfishing Diving
RA Offer grooved or pinned options too & offer universal & RA compatibility (at least they used to).

Alternatively you could smooth out the grooves on your existing spear to take a dyneema wishbone, as I and others have done (Lazuli &, possibly, Mundial?).

But why bother raising the bands? You already have a rail which will keep the spear on the straight and narrow. Have you considered replacing the plastic stopper bar used with the metal muzzle wishbone (part X or Z in the instructions I think) with a stronger, longer bar to handle bulk rubber? Be careful not to raise the bands too much, I found the standard Omer Eurobands tend to pull slightly up when used with a Dyneema wishbone, not good - it's insecure and in your case might negate some of the benefit of the rail.

:hmmI like the sound of those Omer spears. Would be interested to know if you find a supplier OMD.

Old Man Dave · Jul 23, 2009

I built the lifters described in post 4 above. Here's how I did it.

!. Bought a piece of 1 inch (25mm) diameter x 4 inch (100mm) long "Nylatron" from the local engineering works.

2. Used a 1 inch (25mm) diameter hole saw to drill through at right angles to make 2 pieces with curved ends.

3. Disassembled the speargun front end including removing the 5mm diameter securing pin that went through the barrel and the head.

4. Put a 5mm drill bit through the, now empty, pin hole and drilled the nylatron lifter. Repeat for second lifter.

5. One lifter each side with a 5mm hole right through both and lining up with the existing hole in the barrel/head. Unfortunately The Omer worker who drilled the original pin hole must have been drunk. However I went with what I had as I didn't want to redrill the gun. I wanted the whole thing to be removable and the gun to remain original.

Stage 1. complete.

Dave.

Magpie · Jul 23, 2009

Very nice Dave, have the lifters affected the balance much? Guess you could just drill out each lifter a bit and add some foam or lead if needed.

How much was the nylatron? Could do with some of that for my bodging box.

Old Man Dave · Jul 23, 2009

Stage 2.

6. I cleaned up the ends of the lifters on a lathe and counterbored the outside ends with a saw toothed faucner bit. I could have done it without the lathe but if you got it , flaunt it .

7. The lifters were now ready to be bolted on using a 2 inch (50mm) M5 stainless bolt/set screw, washers and nut.

8. Had to trim the tops of the lifters a bit to clear the built in rail on the carbon barrel.

9. Fitted an old 16mm diameter x 52cm looped band and stainless wishbone, just to try it out.

10. Loaded it up and it seemed fine, although the lifters seemed a little wide.

Stage 2. complete.

Dave.

Old Man Dave · Jul 23, 2009

Hi Tom. I'm still writing my report so get to the balance bit in a minute. Nylatron was £1.40 from M&G.

Dave.

Magpie · Jul 23, 2009

Cheers Dave, never was very patient rofl

Old Man Dave · Jul 23, 2009

Stage 3.

11. The band seemed to be more or less parallel to the spear but maybe a tad low at the front. I hadn't allowed for the built in rail on the carbon barrel. Mind you the band was a bit old and manky and a new one and/or a thicker one might be just right.

12. Took the gun for a test dive. Even with the old rubber and the slightly over wide lifters it looked and felt good. First shot, I hit a bass with a good aimed head shot at about 4 foot (speartip to fish) range. Next shot I got a head shot on a big wrasse with more of an instinct shot from closer range. Not bad for a test run.

13. Back home I trimmed the width of the lifters and angled them in, top to bottom.

14.I had bought this tie in stainless Omer wishbone from Apnea, Jersey, along with a piece of bulk 16mm diameter rubber. I had bought 1 metre of rubber originally intending that to make 2 bands but I discovered that I had not allowed for tying the ends so I had to use 60cm of it. I wanted the stainless wishbone as a stop gap until I got a tabbed spear. I know I could have used a dyneema wishbone with my 6.3mm notched spear but I'm a bit new to this "make your own bands" thing so went with what I know.

15. Tied it all together and this needed to be in situ as there is no slot in the XXV head to remove the looped band. First ever clinch knot and it held . Looking good.

End part 3.

Dave.

Lazuli · Jul 23, 2009

Seems those fish were fairly close Dave. I'm very interested to hear what the accuracy and spear penetration will be like at longer ranges.

Old Man Dave · Jul 23, 2009

Stage 4.

16. Loaded up the tied in stainless wishbone looks good. Gonna be even better with a tabbed spear and dyneema wishbone, but that's for next season.

17. Those lifters are still too wide when the gun is loaded and the rubbers stretched thin. Next area for testing and modifications me thinks .

18. Still a tiny bit low. although this is a 16mm diameter band and the standard is 18mm. If I did it again I would raise the lifters just a mil' or 2 at most.

19. The finished gun still retains its super slim profile and the band is parallel as near as damn it.

20.Future moves involve testing and refining. I'm sure that I can reduce the width of the lifters a bit more and maybe prolie them a little to blend them in. The balance is identical. The front stainless/plastic yoke piece I was using with the screw in bands shown in the last pic is almost identical in weight to the nylatron lifters and stainless bolt that has replaced it. Add to that the slightly increased volume of the lifters and their position further back and there's no disernable change. To be honest it feels exactly the same in both balance and tracking but is a lot easier to sight down. Bring on them bass.

For now ... the end.

Dave.

fearthespear · Jul 23, 2009

Neat! Now go those fish OMD!

Jonny250 · Jul 23, 2009

dave, where the lifters sit against the carbon barrel - is there some of the plastic muzzle head inside that? just wondering about longer term fatigue on the carbon from the band-load on the lifters.

nice job!

Old Man Dave · Jul 23, 2009

Yes Jonny. The muzzle head fits inside the carbon barrel for about 1 inch exactly where the lifters fit. That's where the pin I removed and replaced with a bolt fits.

Dave.

strangelove · Jul 23, 2009

Dave are you going to sell these ? Very nice, it looks like a HH muzzle.

View attachment 25042

I wonder if replacing the original pin with the SS screw can cause the barrel to crack ?

Euro tabbed spears.

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