how deep with a mouthful

[trullalla]

hi all,

i was doing some experiments the last days, and got to some interesting depths in a mouthful of air. i was wondering how deep can other people go on a single mouthful (starting form the surface), and with which mask they do it.

thanks for replies.

linda

 

[Alun]

hi Linda

i think it depends on how much mask squeeze you are willing to accept. personally i don't like to let my mask squeeze much at all. i've done about 20m with the Sphera from the surface. it mostly depends on how much air you can get into your mouth. you can get extra air into your throat if you look up.

 

[trullalla]

hi alun,

well, i can get down to 30 with the sphera and the pressure is not so bad.
the thing is that i did 24 with a mouthful, with the minima (i usually equalize it at 10 the first time). i usually do 15+ with a reverse pack. now i was wondering: is this average? to me seems a lot. could that depend on the size of the sinuses? or do i have such a big mouth (like some funny guy suggested!)?
what are the other guys doing?
would be nice to know.

are you going to come in october then? i'm going to buy a long long rope just for the occasion!


linda

 

[Alun]

hi Linda,

that's very good! much better than average i would say. it sounds like you should be able to equalize very deep. i don't think i'll be able to head over there this year, but maybe next year!
alun

 

[trullalla]

alun,

i think i misunderstood something you said: when you wrote you do 20 with the sphera, you mean in a mouthful, or that you go to 20 without equalizing the mask?
when i said i do 30 with the sphera i meant i can go to 30 without equalizing it, but that is not in a mouthful. i did 24 in a mouthful, but with the minima.

hey, what am i doing now with a 92 mt rope if you don't come???


anybody else have some numbers to offer about my original question?

cheers

linda

 

[Alun]

hi Linda

i mean i've been to 20m with one mouthfull from the surface. i probably equalise the mask once or twice on the way down. i could never go to 20m without equalising the Sphera... i could maybe get to 6-7m before it gets uncomfortable... i don't like to let my mask squeeze. i try to equalise it fully if at all possible.

30m without equalising the mask is very deep. i'm wondering whether you have air coming through your tear ducts. i heard that Herbert Nitsch gets this. for some people if you equalise quite hard air comes through into your mask, so it equalises or partially equalises without you having to release the nose. maybe you could test this out... put your head under water without a mask, and equalise. ask Roland if he can see any air coming out from near your eyes...

i think you'll need the 92m rope yourself before too long!

alun

 

[efattah]

For me, I have done 40m without equalizing the sphera, or 30.5m with one mouthful from the surface, also not equalizing the sphera. I don't have air coming out of my tearducts because if I did, then air bubbles would enter my fluid goggles, which doesn't happen.

 

[cp1204]

Is it a big problem to equalize early? Air you use for equalisation isn't wasted! When you equalize on 10m mark there is mask_internal_volume*2 liters of air in mask. I use it on my way back to surface - air under mask begin to expand and you can breath it again! There is sufficient amount of O2 and not too much CO2 there because it's about 10-20 seconds when you equalize first. My 2 cents: equalize when you want to- the air isn't wasted anyway.
[edit] Sorry. English is not my native language, as you may have noticed. By equalisation here i mean equalizing water pressure and pressure of air under mask, not in middle ear.[/edit] :duh

 

[trullalla]

hi all,

eric, thanks for the reply. have you tried to see how deep you can get in a mouthful with the goggles? that should be the same depth you do with the sphera then.

alun,
i've been thinking about it, and experimenting a bit more, and now i have the doubt that i actually equalize the sphera without noticing it. the sphera nose is much stiffer than in the minima and so maybe i'm not pinching it properly and some air is escaping. and maybe i don't notice it because it's just a tiny bit at a time.
the thing is that i'm not very used to the sphera (i like the minima much better, more confortable and soft) and only today for the first time i could equal my pb using the sphera! before that my deepest dives where with minima, and every time i dived with sphera i run out of air a lot earlier.

cheers,
linda

 

[Alun]

Linda
you should get yourself a pair of fluid goggles! i tried them a couple of times in Dahab and the water stung my eyes quite badly but had i persisted then i think i would have got used to it. filling them with saline is better but it can be very tricky.
goggles could potentially add 10m or more to your maximum equalisation depth. it doesnt sound like you really need them now but they may give you a boost as you go even deeper. next time i visit Dahab i'll do my best to use goggles instead of my mask, so that equalisation becomes less of an issue.

 

[immerlustig]

and i wonder if anyone ever tried cw without a mask at all.

roland

 

[trullalla]

hey alun, fluid goggles would be nice, but i just invested a bit of money for my new rubbery wetsuit, and for seb course, so i don't see it happening soon!
but today i was experimenting again, and i got very close to my pb with no packing at all, and still had air to spare. the descent was much more relaxing due to less buoyancy, and i couldn't notice any difference in the ascent.
so for the moment i'm happy enough!
p.s. did you know we will have a comp here in november?
cheers,
linda

 

[pat fish]

Hi Linda and Roland

During the Coupe des Calanques in Marseille there were some athletes diving CW without mask. Like Joe who did a solid 48m CW dive on just a nose clip. Check out this picture:


cc_d1_042.jpg



warm greetings to Dahab
Pat

 

[efattah]

Brett LeMaster did his 81m WR in CW with no mask, just a nose clip.

However this is a risky method. On his first attempt he crashed into the scuba diver at the bottom (no lanyard) and wasted so much energy that he had a bad blackout on the ascent.

 

[Alun]

i think Roland meant with no mask, goggles or noseclip...

i'm sure someone must have dived deep this way. i dont know of anyone myself though. i'd like to try it out next time i'm in Dahab (wet equalisation). i think going down would be easy enough, but coming up might be tricky!

Roland, Linda... when are you leaving Dahab this winter? sometime Nov? Dec? there's a reasonable chance i could head over sometime in late Nov/ early Dec.

 

[DeepThought]

and i wonder if anyone ever tried cw without a mask at all.

Yo Roland...
If without a nose clip and goggles then I dove unassisted like that a couple o' times when I was frolicking at the sea at 7 meters or so...
If I take my hand of my nose and don't exhale air from it water get in and get in some of the cavities, first times it feels bad but I got used to it (was trying to keep the water out actually but kept forgeting). If I equalize after water got in I feel the mistake immidiatly: noise + sharp pain in my middle ear - I pushed water in. Wet equalization by accident.
So far I've been lucky with those accidents and never had an infection (and our sea is filthy most of the year), but I try not to repeat those incidents.
Water will flow out of my sinuses spontanously some time later that day. On my keyboard for example, or on my pillow when I lay my head. Funny surprise.
It is possible to keep the water out of my nose if I don't dive vertically but at an incline and also raise my head a bit, which screws swimming posture.

As for another experiment:
Last time in Eilat Ilan (which I think you know, or will meet in seb's course) has decided to take off his mask at depth and said it feels great.
Went down and tried the same, the second the mask was off I felt something clenching at my throught. Repeatedly.
first thought in my head: "my first laryngospasm. KEWL!"
Went up leasurely and it persisted till my face were out of the water and I wanted to take my first breath. It was nice to feel the water flowing on my face though.
I see no reason to dive without a nose clip if you don't use a mask unless you want to do wet equalization (which I think should be done as the last resort.

 

[immerlustig]

hi,

i'm thinking about no mask diving as an alternative to goggles. i'd use a clip then, i guess. i haven't tried yet, as i'm too much enjoying looking around and actually seeing things

i wonder what vis was like on lemaster's 81m dive? i guess here with +20m vis bumping into someone is quite unlikely. i sa a picture of tanya streeter from the comp in nice (?) this year. she didn't wear a mask either.

alun, we'll most likely hold out here until mid/end december. the idea is to stay as lomg as temp doesn't drop below 23 celsius. e also have a spare room if you need a place.

cp1204, the issue here is not that air might be lost or not, but rather how efficiently you can use that available mouthfull of air for equalizing. no mask or a small mask means a deeper dive. also, the deeper you can get a mouthfull the deeper you will be able to equalise.

cheers all,

roland

 

[naiad]

Water will flow out of my sinuses spontanously some time later that day. On my keyboard for example, or on my pillow when I lay my head. Funny surprise.

As for another experiment:
Last time in Eilat Ilan (which I think you know, or will meet in seb's course) has decided to take off his mask at depth and said it feels great.
Went down and tried the same, the second the mask was off I felt something clenching at my throught. Repeatedly.
first thought in my head: "my first laryngospasm. KEWL!"
Went up leasurely and it persisted till my face were out of the water and I wanted to take my first breath.

I used to get the water flowing out of sinuses thing, as I never use a nose clip or full mask in the pool.

Recently I have tried diving in the pool without mask, goggles or nose clip, and it produces a strong apnea reflex, like that produced by a cold wind blowing on my face. I didn't like it at first, but now I am used to it and it may even be an advantage.

Now I need to be brave enough to try a static or dynamic like that.

Lucia

 

[efattah]

Vis on LeMaster's 81m dives was 40-50m.

Keep in mind that it is pretty dark down there at 81m even in clear water. And without a mask you are five times legally blind.

 

[Fondueset]

I've done probably 8-10m with no mask or nose thingy - stupid in fresh water without salt to explode all the evil little organisms. Water continued to spontaneously emerge from my nose for at least 12 hours. I was very lucky nothing nested in there.

Has anyone noticed ears and sinuses equalizing separately? I don't generally need to pinch my nose to equalize - but I find my sinuses making little creaking sounds and a bit of a headache unless I make a separate effort.