How much can someone improve with training.

[3xpr1ment]

Hi forum

I would like to ask how much I can improve my performance with training. My PB is 5.05 with almost no training (I go to the pool every day and do many 40m dynamic so as to get used to dolphin kick). So, do you think if I quit smoking (I smoke a lot, 20 cigarettes a day) and train hard I would have any possibility to compete (lets say beat Aris Ioannidis 7.06 which is my Country´s national record rofl).

PS. My age is 36

 

[Rik]

Your performance is not influenced by how much you train, but what you train. So try to find someone who can teach you the right technique and trainings methods. This would be the first step in beating Ioannidis record.

A trainingsprogram for freediving should consist of endurance, technique and performance. Technique training should include breathing, swimming and relaxation techniques.

Previous national and world records have shown that age isn't a problem at all.

Smoking however does limit your diving potential, because it does decrease the amount of oxygen that can be absorbed by your blood and it does harm lung tissue directly.

It is difficult to predict how much you can improve. Nevertheless with your current performance, it is likely that you can improve with the right help.

 

[3xpr1ment]

Thank you Rik for taking the time to answer. I´m afraid having a personal trainer is out of my budget so I would have to find a different approach.

What do you mean by endurance? Long distance running or cycling or swimming for example?

As for the smoking, do you think (you, being a medical student) that the damage can be (at least partially) reversible in a short period of time (1 or 2 years), so i can count on this improvement.

Just to make it clear, beating Aris Ioannidi´s or any other record is not the goal by itself, just a target to keep me going. (Ari if you see the post, and have some time, drop me a line on how to win you )

 

[Rik]

Well... you don't actually need a personal trainer, but you need someone who can evaluate your technique. This could be an instructor or another experienced freediver.

Endurance can be both running, cycling or swimming. Endurance can increase the sensitivity for carbon dioxide, and therefore you need it to train before training that increase the performance. (several weeks to months). More information about a time table on training can be found in Umberto's book.

Blood does recover within 3 months after quiting smoking. The recovery of the lung damage is dependent on the kind of damage. The immune system can recover faster, while structural damage (damaged alveolar sacs) are less likely to recover at all. Quiting smoking does also prevent further damage to the lungs and does diminish the chance for lung cancer in time. Thus there are sufficient reasons to quit smoking, other than improving your performance.

 

[Siku]

Don't forget the main reason to give up is that it's not nice. The perception it's nice is an illusion based on the cessation of nicotien withdrawal.

When I realised that i gave up in a moment and it was easy.

 

[ericvrp]

Or you start with finding a safe place to train, start practicing and see where and what it brings you. Who knows, maybe in six month you find out that you like freediving more than smoking and you WANT to stop smoking because of that.

Now it might feel you HAVE to stop smoking because you want to freedive.

cheers

 

[aris ioannidis]

Gia sou 3xpr1ment!

just came around your thread. Honored to be mentioned but to set the facts straight the Greek record is held by Giorgos Panagiotakis w/7.34.

Smoking definitely not helping but think age is not a big factor. I am turning 42 this year while some world champions are older. The hard part is to manage to stay in good shape while aging.

As far as training is concerned, I think you do not need that much but you need to customize it. So, if your goal is to improve in Static you should train in Static. For example you could do 5 sets of increasing breathholds with 2 mins breath up inbetween; then rest 5 min and do a max. Empty your mind and focus on relaxation and feel of the water.

 

[Simos]

I'll be controversial and say that I don't think smoking will make a big change in static - why would it? (unless you've completely destroyed your lungs which I'm sure is not the case)

I think there are definitely a lot of other factors that are more important than that... But you should still quit

I would say that if you are doing the times you mentioned without training much then you probably have the potential to beat that time with the right training and dedication. Remember that potential is just one factor and again in my opinion not the most important one - having the right mentality and determination is the first one!

On age - evidence from the top freedivers would suggest that it shouldn't be a problem especially if you consistently train as Aris pointed out. I remember reading somewhere a long time ago that aging could actually help with apnea as metabolism/heart rate slows down with age... No idea if this is true or proven..
Posted via Mobile Device

 

[ReefTroll]

I'll be controversial and say that I don't think smoking will make a big change in static - why would it? Posted via Mobile Device

How could it not? Damaged lungs are far less efficient than healthy lungs at transporting oxygen around the body. The reason smokers can't run, ride, etc as far or as fast as a non-smoking version of themselves is based upon this, so why would it not affect a static which relies on efficent O2 transfers?

 

[Simos]

Just to add on the point about smoking (as I am not being controversial for the sake of it) if I understand things correctly, smoking affects in activities like running where fast/efficient gas exchange in the lungs is really important. But this is not the case in freediving and especially in static. The one thing I think might be affected is possibly your ability to pack as I imagine a smoker's lungs might be less flexible but again this is just a guess... Would be really interested to see what others that know more think on this...
Posted via Mobile Device

 

[Simos]

Just saw your post reeftroll (you posted while i was posting) but I guess I might have explained me reasoning? Why would it matter since you have a finite amount of oxygen in the lungs in static and a smoker will definitely end up using it in the same way as a non smoker would. I would push the boundaries and say that if anything, a smoker would use it up slower hence it might even be better to smoke...
Posted via Mobile Device

 

[Simos]

I guess my argument is along the lines of what some believe about aerobic fitness ie that top aerobic fitness might not necessarily be beneficial to Freediving and static

Think about it this way: imagine a smoker that goes about their daily lives not being able to take in as much oxygen as a super fit marathon runner. the smoker's body will adapt to use up less oxygen...


Posted via Mobile Device

 

[ReefTroll]

And companies such as Airsep wouldn't need to exist. The truth is that when I worked as a biomed technician, we sold oxy-concetrators to smokers, whose bodies were so shagged they couldn't get enough oxygen into themselves to walk a flight of stairs. Or to talk at length to be honest. So even a lesser state of this is going to affect statics massively.

 

[Mullins]

static which relies on efficient O2 transfers

Couple of questions: what do you mean by 'efficient O2 transfers' and why do statics rely on them?

 

[ReefTroll]

Well the ability to efficiently get oxygen into the blood for a breath hold. Smokers lungs have a reduced capacity to pull oxygen from a given amount of air.

 

[ReefTroll]

That and the fact smoking actually kills lung tissue over time and therefore literally lessens lung capacity.

 

[Mullins]

Well the ability to efficiently get oxygen into the blood for a breath hold.

What do you mean by efficiency in this context though? If one's oxygen transfer from lungs to blood was 'inefficient', where would the losses be?

 

[ReefTroll]

Well I may not have used the best terminology mate, but I assume (I know, a dangerous word) that lungs that are less able to suck oxygen from the inhaled air ie - smokers lungs with less function, would requie to work harder, which is seen in smokers (and massively in life long smokers) and their inability to exercise as effectively as they should. So wouldnt it stand to reason that lungs taking less oxygen each time would require the heart to pump a little faster to transport near the same amount of 02, therefore affecting statics?

 

[Mullins]

wouldnt it stand to reason that lungs taking less oxygen each time would require the heart to pump a little faster to transport near the same amount of 02, therefore affecting statics?

No, I wouldn't think so. When you're doing a static you're close to Basal Metabolic Rate (BMR) and you don't need fast gas exchange. If oxygen was actually being lost from the system (inefficiency) that would be a problem. But I'm not sure that it is.

Reduced vital capacity would have a detrimental effect on statics, but to say the effect would be 'massive' is to make a very big assumption.

 

[Mullins]

Relatedly, people often talk about the improvements in respiratory 'efficiency' that you get from cardio training. However if cardio did improve efficiency in a sense relevant to us as freedivers (the amount of oxygen we consume to do X amount of work), very fit people would consume less oxygen when at rest than unfit people do. I had a brief look around and the studies I read found that improvements in cardio fitness did not alter BMR in test subjects...