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Lessons learned - a SWB Story

Thread Status: Hello , There was no answer in this thread for more than 60 days.
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The idea is that you actually lean back on the last 5 meters or so on the ascent. It actually works when you test it out. With a bit of positive momentum in the lean or arch and then you let yourself go limp, you actually end up face up nicely. I agree that if you were at all vertical, like on a normal ascent, you could likely end up face down.
 
feign,

this enire thread has been excellent and the idea of leaning way back on ascent sounds promising. very much a last ditch safety/rescue measure, to add along with the importance of focusing on getting that first breath.

i will be sure to give it a try next time out.

thanks guys :) :) :),
sean


here is another informative post on the subject, taken from a different thread, by the ever-so-wise mr. fattah (hopefully he does't mind):
http://forums.deeperblue.net/safety...oosen-weight-belt-remove-mask.html#post650647

Having had many dives with sambas and several blackouts, including one samba on a recreational dive in 2002, I can say first hand what happens in these situations.

Even for someone with great experience with hypoxia, you will never realize that you are in trouble until you reach a shallow depth. If you really overdid it, you may realize you are in trouble at a depth of around 15m, but usually you'll realize it around 10m or less. Once you realize that you are in trouble, you have about 1 second of useful consciousness, which is not enough to do any task. Once that one second elapses, the only thing you will do is continue kicking towards the surface, in a virtually unconscious state.

Even if taking the mask off had an oxygen saving effect, this oxygen saving effect would have be IN EFFECT for at least 10-20 seconds of dive time to actually have a noticeably positive effect. But, you need to SUBTRACT the energy of actually removing the mask (and holding it hard clenched in one hand, which is what you would likely do). Not to mention the total loss of velocity caused by the drag of doing it. In my opinion it would be detrimental.

I did a 'dumb' solo freedive in 1998 to 31m with a big weight belt and bifins. On the ascent, I realized I was in trouble around 15m, and my last clear thought was 'I should ditch my weight belt.' The next thing I knew, I was at the surface and my vision was gradually returning. I was still wearing the weight belt.

By 2002, I was much smarter. After having already set a WR and having had blackouts at the end of dives, I realized what I should really be thinking when in trouble. I did a shallow dive on a wreck (23m) for a very short total dive time (1'30"), but my recovery had been far too short from the previous dive. On the ascent I suddenly realized I was in trouble around 15m. I knew I had one second of useful consciousness. I used that one second to tell myself one thing: Remember to breathe upon surfacing!! I reached the surface in a virtually unconscious state, but I took a deep breath, and had a big samba. My buddy was 30m away pointing in a different direction. If I had tried to ditch my weight belt, I would probably be dead.

In my mind, the only time it is conceivable to ditch the weight belt with benefit (or remove the mask), would be if you got stuck in something on the bottom (wreck, fishing line, etc.), and you overstayed your bottom time and realized you had been on the bottom for WAY too long. Even before beginning the ascent, you decide that you must ditch your belt and remove your mask. You don't lose any momentum or cause any drag, because you aren't even moving yet.
 
....
Keep turning it over, more may surface. Unirdna had a wild BO with me and remembered much more about it the next day. There is a description in Freediving Stories a couple of years ago, "our greatest enemy" or something like that. I've read in these forums of at least one other guy who recovered after BOing by himself, but its mighty rare.

Connor



here is a link to another similar thread with an account of surviving a SWB while spearfishing. it also provoked some good discussion and is well worth reading. in my mind, the more accident reports we have available the better.

http://forums.deeperblue.net/safety/66420-my-shallow-water-blackout-nightmare.html

cheers,
sean
vancouver, canada
 
Excellent post Spaghetti. Keep listening to your girl. When I am thinking of staying down "a little longer" than comfortable I flash back to those reports of lobster divers drowning that seem to get onto the forum each season & come up.
That is exactly how I feel. Although I have always been a fairly conservative diver, fatherhood has given me very different perspective on what is important in life
For spearfishing in murky water, a proper buddy system is just not practical (or even possible). As Eric says, thinking you have a buddy to help out can actually make things more dangerous.
Whatever you tell yourself, you WILL push yourself that little bit further if you think there is someone there to save you. I think the phrase is "risk compensation" . Several studies have shown, for example, that drivers will tend to drive faster and more recklessly in cars fitted with ABS than those without, meaning that although the car is "safer" the overall accident rate remains the same.
I have the same reservations about the freedivers safety vest, I think it will encourage people to push themselves further, as they have a parachute to save them
...
Interesting - it makes sense. I used to rock climb a lot and noticed that the onset of parenthood consistently reduced the drive/urge to push it, or even climb at all in some cases. (There are probably exceptions - the late Alison Hargreaves springs to mind). When others depend on you, the risk calculations that we all do consciously or unconsciously, are different than when you are young, free and single, and feeling immortal. The amount of time/mind-share available to train and take part tends to diminish too (being replaced by something infinitely more important).
 
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.... In Florida in 2001, when training for the CW record, I surfaced from a 72m dive with total memory loss of the last 8m. According to Kirk, I reached the surface and did a perfect recovery, including the ok sign. My own memory of the dive is blank, all I remember was being at 8m wondering if I was going to make it -- next thing I know I'm looking at Kirk's face, my vision is returning, and I find that my hand is in the 'ok' sign.

I have experienced the same thing recently at the end of a dynamic/no fins attempt. I cannot remember the last 8 meters of the dive, fell into a dream (including a total loss of a sense of time) and "woke up" at the end of the pool-lane, breathing normally. My buddy didn't observe anything unusual about the way I completed these last 8 meters.
 
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From what I've been thought, Hippocampal neurons are amongst the more sensitive ones to hypoxia (the hippocampus is presumed to be the part where the short term memory is stored).
 
I became attracted to learning more about free-diving just this year after returning from a vacation in Alaska. Snorkeled in Ketchikan. Got back home and hit the web. This thread was the first one that came up.

A very sobering story. Thank you for posting it. I have never tried to free-dive beyond swimming pool depth, or hold my breath for more than 30 seconds, but at least I am now aware of the dangers of SWB. This is downright frightening.
 
glad to hear your ok that was a really intense story .I always feel im safe in 90-100 feet definetly gave me a little reality check thanks for sharing
 
You probably are safe at 90-100 feet. Since virtually every blackout I've ever heard about (outside of dedicated line dives with safety divers) occurred during dives that were shallower than that.
 
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wow, Necro-Post. it really changed my diving, still not back to normal, can't get in the zone when i dive deep anymore.

hope none of you have a similar experience.
 
I still dive a lot, but can't seem to get it together on the deep stuff. still have lots of fun :)
 
Hi Amphibios,
Incredible story!!!

I am realy happy to see that everything is nearly back to normal.

I have 2 questions:
1. If I understand you had a meal a short (or long) time before the dive, did you or I missunderstood?
2. Can you tell us what happened after the hospital, how much time, how did the recovery go? what was different when you began diving again? etc...

Thanks mate,
Dive safe (and shalow) :friday
 
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