new to freediving need wetsuit advice, thank you!

[Shannon R]

Hi everyone!

I'm fairly new to freediving, at least in terms of doing it in cold water (now that I live in the wilds of Northern CA). I just ordered my first 2-piece suit (ScubaPro Element 2PC Apnea 3mm Womens Wetsuit), it fit well except for the hood which was oddly small, too small to fit over my chin and keep water out. Also it had a strong chemical/rubber odor I wasn't able to really air out, so I'm returning it.

I'm now very confused by the choices. That was a 3mm, but I realize I should probably get a 5mm (3mm is okay for Smith River summer diving, but not off season or in the ocean, which I also hope to do). I have been looking at the C4 Sideral, Seac Snake, and Fourth Element RF2, which all look fairly similar and same pricing (around $360). But I've also just noticed the Cressi Apnea (only $260), but seems to be only men's sizing?

Any suggestions for a newbie? I'm 5'11", 145-150 lbs, female, with a large head (for females, apparently, doesn't look large, but I have trouble fitting generic female-sized hats).
I am looking for something with warmth, flexibility, will keep water out, and not too hard to take the top off. Also, really important is chemical smells, I'm very sensitive. I am fine with neoprene, but foam/rubber of any kind can be a problem.

Thank you so much!
Shannon

​

 

[Bill McIntyre]

My recommendation is to get a custom suit from Polosub. I have short legs, long torso, huge head so I really need custom suits but even "normal" people seldom get a perfect fit with off-the-rack suits. I bought 5.5 mm and 3.5 mm suits from Polosub and they fit perfectly. I went too a dive shop in SoCal that sold the suits and let them measure me and place the order but I know that others take their own measurements and order directly.

 

[Shannon R]

My recommendation is to get a custom suit from Polosub. I have short legs, long torso, huge head so I really need custom suits but even "normal" people seldom get a perfect fit with off-the-rack suits. I bought 5.5 mm and 3.5 mm suits from Polosub and they fit perfectly. I went too a dive shop in SoCal that sold the suits and let them measure me and place the order but I know that others take their own measurements and order directly.

Thanks Bill for the tip! That might be what I need. I also have long torso, short legs and big head! LOL. Now do you have any advice about closed cell vs. open cell, etc? Still getting my head around all the options...

 

[Mr. X]

Polosub spearo suits look very nice. YouTube Spearo Dan Mann uses Polosub suits after visiting their factory/workshop in Italy.

Also consider Eliossub they custom made my first wetsuit (for spearfishing). Which is still good after more than 12+ years. Reassuringly they recommended their cheapest neoprene, Ecoline, for spearfishing.

If you go for a custom suit, I have previously offered suggestions, elsewhere on this forum, about how to make sure you get good measurements.

 

[Mr. X]

Btw If buying "off the shelf" softer more stretchy neoprene is often/sometimes used, so fit is less critical

Measure carefully and check the manufacturers size table for the suit model concerned. Worked well for my second wetsuit, a 5.5mm camo Mares wetsuit. Mares fit my shape quite well but FYI Omersub seem more aimed at a slim adolescent build. Beuchat suits seemed to be somewhere in between Mares and Omersub. But there are many other brands (including Mako spearing suits in America).

But be careful: I tried buying a camo suit for my son on sale from a store in Italy. Not successful . I am shaped and sized more like you two (although almost 50lb heavier and an inch taller than Shannon), but my son is more slender and smaller (like his Mum ) and normal/athletically proportioned but the suit was oddly shaped, with arms that were way too skinny but thighs that were far too wide/baggy. Had to return it to Italy .

 

[Bill McIntyre]

Thanks Bill for the tip! That might be what I need. I also have long torso, short legs and big head! LOL. Now do you have any advice about closed cell vs. open cell, etc? Still getting my head around all the options...

Open cell is warmer and sretchier. You need lube to get into it.

 

[Shannon R]

Btw If buying "off the shelf" softer more stretchy neoprene is often/sometimes used, so fit is less critical

Measure carefully and check the manufacturers size table for the suit model concerned. Worked well for my second wetsuit, a 5.5mm camo Mares wetsuit. Mares fit my shape quite well but FYI Omersub seem more aimed at a slim adolescent build. Beuchat suits seemed to be somewhere in between Mares and Omersub. But there are many other brands (including Mako spearing suits in America).

But be careful: I tried buying a camo suit for my son on sale from a store in Italy. Not successful . I am shaped and sized more like you two (although almost 50lb heavier and an inch taller than Shannon), but my son is more slender and smaller (like his Mum ) and normal/athletically proportioned but the suit was oddly shaped, with arms that were way too skinny but thighs that were far too wide/baggy. Had to return it to Italy .

Thank you! I'll look into that one as well. I'm now thinking of holding onto the one I bought (I could tell it was worn and complained about it, I may be able to get a further discount if I keep it), and somehow modify the hood. The smell isn't as bad now and its really the hood that is annoying. I realized trying it out again today that its not really too small, more like the neck isn't long enough so it pulls back at the top and the face hole is too big. So water definitely gets in through the hood, and its annoying that is slides around. But I think there are some base hood/face mask layers? Do you or does anyone else know where to find these? I'm having some trouble searching for it but I've definitely seen them in videos with cold water freedivers. I still want to get another suit (5mm), but since this one was only $100 (for top and bottom) and is 3mm and perfect for the water temps right now I may live with the imperfections while looking for a better one. I also noticed the arms are a bit too tight because I have larger biceps than most women (I work as a river kayak guide in the summers).

And yes so many brands! I didn't know when I set out to buy a freediving suit what an "adventure" it would be! LOL

 

[Shannon R]

Open cell is warmer and sretchier. You need lube to get into it.

Thank you Bill! I was reading more about these suits and how you can also ask for a nylon layer on the inside to avoid the lube. I've not looked into lubes yet so not sure what they are made of and if I want to put that stuff on my skin. Would prefer to avoid that extra step. I think.

 

[Bill McIntyre]

Thank you Bill! I was reading more about these suits and how you can also ask for a nylon layer on the inside to avoid the lube. I've not looked into lubes yet so not sure what they are made of and if I want to put that stuff on my skin. Would prefer to avoid that extra step. I think.

If you add the nylon layer you don't have an open cell suit. It won't be nearly as flexible and warm without the neoprene sticking to you skin. Decades ago in my misspent years as a scuba diver I had nylon lined suits, so I know the difference. In the last 20 or 30 years, everyone diving on my boat has worn open cell suits and used lube. I use Unicure, a scent free alcohols free skin and hair conditioner. It's made to put on skin. I dilute is 50% with water in a spray bottle. Some people spray it in the suit. Others spray it on their skin before putting the suit on . A lot of people use baby soap or something similar. Many people put the soap in the suit, add water, hold the suit with the sleeves and cuffs up so it doesn't run out and slosh it around.

 

[Shannon R]

If you add the nylon layer you don't have an open cell suit. It won't be nearly as flexible and warm without the neoprene sticking to you skin. Decades ago in my misspent years as a scuba diver I had nylon lined suits, so I know the difference. In the last 20 or 30 years, everyone diving on my boat has worn open cell suits and used lube. I use Unicure, a scent free alcohols free skin and hair conditioner. It's made to put on skin. I dilute is 50% with water in a spray bottle. Some people spray it in the suit. Others spray it on their skin before putting the suit on . A lot of people use baby soap or something similar. Many people put the soap in the suit, add water, hold the suit with the sleeves and cuffs up so it doesn't run out and slosh it around.

Interesting. Can you lube with a natural oil, like coconut oil, or does that ruin the material? I looked up the ingredients of Unicure but actually is not alcohol-free (has cetyl alcohol) and has parabens and bromine as well, so that won't work for me, I'd need truly chemical free and since I can't even find a shampoo in existence that is, or lotion, I make my own hair tonics and use olive oil and coconut oil on my skin. Or is it possible just to wet the inside of the suit without soap or using lube before donning? There is one dish soap I could use that wouldn't bother me (free and clear product) would that be the type of soap needed, something liquid that suds up? Thanks for your help!!!

 

[Shannon R]

Polosub spearo suits look very nice. YouTube Spearo Dan Mann uses Polosub suits after visiting their factory/workshop in Italy.

Also consider Eliossub they custom made my first wetsuit (for spearfishing). Which is still good after more than 12+ years. Reassuringly they recommended their cheapest neoprene, Ecoline, for spearfishing.

If you go for a custom suit, I have previously offered suggestions, elsewhere on this forum, about how to make sure you get good measurements.

Thank you Mr. X. I think I will go with Polosub after looking into their product line more. I like that you can get a custom fit. Now I'm thinking I may have to wait, as I was planning to lose some weight this summer and I don't want to buy the suit and then not fit in it after trimming down a bit!

 

[Bill McIntyre]

Interesting. Can you lube with a natural oil, like coconut oil, or does that ruin the material? I looked up the ingredients of Unicure but actually is not alcohol-free (has cetyl alcohol) and has parabens and bromine as well, so that won't work for me, I'd need truly chemical free and since I can't even find a shampoo in existence that is, or lotion, I make my own hair tonics and use olive oil and coconut oil on my skin. Or is it possible just to wet the inside of the suit without soap or using lube before donning? There is one dish soap I could use that wouldn't bother me (free and clear product) would that be the type of soap needed, something liquid that suds up? Thanks for your help!!!

I would think that a natural oil would work, but I'm not sure whether it would damage the neoprene. The fact that I've never seen anyone do it would make me cautious though. If you have a dish soap that doesn't bother you, then that's the way to go. I don't think that just wetting the inside of the suit with water works very well. I have known a couple of guys that just jump off the boat with their suit and put it on while the rest of us watch in awe, but I'm not going to try it.

 

[7BDiver]

I second the idea of getting a custom suit from Polosub, ordered a good 8 suits from them for myself and diving buddies over the years and only good experiences so far. The price is so competitive with off the shelf suits I would never buy one again, been burned with poor fitting off the shelf suits for just about every one I have bought, cant understate how much more custom fit is worth. Only drawback is the lead time. Elios has a huge selection of shelf sizes to choose from but if I remember the hood size detail is left out and might be a gamble. The wait time for these is still high but there is a little cost savings compared to the full custom tailor which will custom fit the hood too.

As for suit lube, there is always the Shark Snot brand which I use, it is a little spendy but is a nice solution for the skin and suit and has been lasting longer than expected. Outside of that, the Mako stuff worked well but may have a little more a chemical nature to it compared to "seaweed" but it is not soap as I recall. Using lube can be a little but of a extra hassle but the suits do come on, off and clean much easier. Wouldn't want to have to shampoo a lined suit all the time after having to relieve yourself in some cold water, which will be unavoidable in the winter.

 

[Shannon R]

I second the idea of getting a custom suit from Polosub, ordered a good 8 suits from them for myself and diving buddies over the years and only good experiences so far. The price is so competitive with off the shelf suits I would never buy one again, been burned with poor fitting off the shelf suits for just about every one I have bought, cant understate how much more custom fit is worth. Only drawback is the lead time. Elios has a huge selection of shelf sizes to choose from but if I remember the hood size detail is left out and might be a gamble. The wait time for these is still high but there is a little cost savings compared to the full custom tailor which will custom fit the hood too.

As for suit lube, there is always the Shark Snot brand which I use, it is a little spendy but is a nice solution for the skin and suit and has been lasting longer than expected. Outside of that, the Mako stuff worked well but may have a little more a chemical nature to it compared to "seaweed" but it is not soap as I recall. Using lube can be a little but of a extra hassle but the suits do come on, off and clean much easier. Wouldn't want to have to shampoo a lined suit all the time after having to relieve yourself in some cold water, which will be unavoidable in the winter.

Thank you! I had to LOL at the name "Shark Snot", but I looked up the ingredients and looks pretty decent! So I'd probably try that one. (I see you can get an added "pee tube" for the suits with Polosub, for avoiding that issue, although I surf in the winter here and never had an issue with having to pee as long as I go right before, even when I stay in for 4 hrs. )

I'm not in too big of a hurry, since its summer time and I have enough to work with for summer river diving for now, so as you say, better to get the custom fit. I haven't checked into Polosub materials yet. I don't actually see any info about that on their website. Have you noticed any weird off-gassing? As I think I mentioned in my initial post, I have no problem at all with neoprene, but some of the other "foams" can be an issue. This "Suba-Pro" suit I bought that uses "x-foam" (allegedly without an odor, but definitely has one, and is not going away), give is a new tire kind of smell that is irritating. I'll also email Polosub to ask more about that. Is it harder to return if there is an issue in the case of custom fitting?

 

[Shannon R]

Thank you! I had to LOL at the name "Shark Snot", but I looked up the ingredients and looks pretty decent! So I'd probably try that one. (I see you can get an added "pee tube" for the suits with Polosub, for avoiding that issue, although I surf in the winter here and never had an issue with having to pee as long as I go right before, even when I stay in for 4 hrs. )

I'm not in too big of a hurry, since its summer time and I have enough to work with for summer river diving for now, so as you say, better to get the custom fit. I haven't checked into Polosub materials yet. I don't actually see any info about that on their website. Have you noticed any weird off-gassing? As I think I mentioned in my initial post, I have no problem at all with neoprene, but some of the other "foams" can be an issue. This "Suba-Pro" suit I bought that uses "x-foam" (allegedly without an odor, but definitely has one, and is not going away), give is a new tire kind of smell that is irritating. I'll also email Polosub to ask more about that. Is it harder to return if there is an issue in the case of custom fitting?

Also does anyone have the Polosub email? I live in the US and can't dial internationally and the email itself is not listed but requires using a mail program I don't have in order to see it.

 

[Shannon R]

Also does anyone have the Polosub email? I live in the US and can't dial internationally and the email itself is not listed but requires using a mail program I don't have in order to see it.

Found it! looks like its info@polosub.com

 

[Bill McIntyre]

Also does anyone have the Polosub email? I live in the US and can't dial internationally and the email itself is not listed but requires using a mail program I don't have in order to see it.

Also does anyone have the Polosub email? I live in the US and can't dial internationally and the email itself is not listed but requires using a mail program I don't have in order to see it.

 

[Bill McIntyre]

Regarding that pee tube- if it's anything like the ones I've seen, I don't think you're equipped to use one.

 

[7BDiver]

Shannon, info@polosub.com is the one I am familiar with and usually get a response from Davide. Elios gets more specific into the types of the neoprene choices they offer but Polosub generally just commits to the customer they are using a top quality neoprene for the application, likely based on thickness and type of suit. I do not disagree with that claim. Generally the off the shelf suits will compromise on neoprene quality in order to get that super elastic (foam) one size fits all property. Custom suits will use a more dense higher quality neoprene (rubber like) that is less stretchy but will not be made of the cheap unrefined petroleum derived chemicals. The higher quality neoprene will be made from petroleum products but also chloroprene that is made using calcium carbonate. There is a chemical odor either way but the Polosub neoprene seems to go away largely after a few dives/rinses. There is a huge difference in how tacky (texture) the quality neoprene feels, it also does not stick (weld) to itself, tear and pull apart like the cheap stuff does when layers sit smushed together during storage.

 

[Shannon R]

Regarding that pee tube- if it's anything like the ones I've seen, I don't think you're equipped to use one.

LOL! Thank you! I didn't actually know what it looked like! (I was hopeful they had figured out something crafty for women, but I guess not, but then again one could use a funnel....)