no contractions?

[Rockie]

Hi everyone old spearo new to freediving. Just a quick question is it possible never to have a contraction? I can breath hold whilst walking for 1'40 and never experienced a contraction. The urge to breathhe, getting light headed and limbs tingling ive experienced before but never a contraction. I just wondered if there are others who are the same or am I abnormal?

 

[cdavis]

A little out of the ordinary, but not abnormal. Contraction response varies hugely between divers. Some don't get them at all, some late, some early, very individual. If you don't get contractions, be careful that you have some other good way to warn you when to come up. I've dove with guys with high c02 tolerance who don't get much for contractions. They tend to be very susceptable to staying down too long and BO.

 

[Bill McIntyre]

I've never had a contraction.

 

[Rockie]

Thanks cdavis I tend to on stay down 40 seconds but like I said can breath hold 1'40 out the water I think I will stick to around 50% of my capability when in the water.

Thats nice to hear Bill. I did wonder with everyone talking about contractions. I thought I was being left out.

Thankyou both.

 

[Bill McIntyre]

Thats nice to hear Bill. I did wonder with everyone talking about contractions. I thought I was being left out.

I've always felt the same way. People write about how many contractions they endure before its time to go up, and I wonder what the hell I'm supposed to use as a signal.

 

[Rockie]

If it makes you feel any better so am I now I am just going to half what I can do out the water and I should be ok. What do you do?/Going to do?

 

[ONT]

I'm in the same boat (marine pun not intended) for not having clear contractions... after a while, I just really want to breathe! Can anyone else that doesn't really get contractions share what strategies they use to gauge time/CO2 or push through that urge to breathe?

 

[Bill McIntyre]

If it makes you feel any better so am I now I am just going to half what I can do out the water and I should be ok. What do you do?/Going to do?

I have no idea what I can do out of the water. I never hold my breath out of the water. As far as what I'll do goes, I guess I'll just do what I've been doing for about 65 years. I'll go up when I feel the urge, but I can't even tell you what the urge feels like.

Even if I knew how long I could hold my breath out of water, it wouldn't provide much guidance.

Example- yesterday we spearfished at four different spots. At couple of them the current was strong. Because I had to swim against the current on the surface rather than relaxing, my dives were a lot shorter. At a couple of other spots, the current was mild, and I could hold my breath a lot longer. But by the end of the day, even at a spot with mild current, I was tired, so my dives were shorter than they were at the beginning of the day. I never look at my watch while under water. I come up when I feel that I should, and then look at the watch to see how I did.

I should emphasize that I'm not the best source of advice on free diving. I'm a spear fisherman who does it while holding his breath. I've never done "tables" or any of this stuff I read about. The place is full of people who are great sources of advice on pushing your limits, but I'm not one of them. My breath hold sucks compared to the real freedivers, partly because I'm 75, and partly because I'm very conservative. If I get a minute dive, I'm very happy.

But getting back to the lack of contractions thing. I suppose you could say that I've never had one because I never push my limits, but I haven't always been that smart or cautious. When I was a teenager we had never heard of shallow water blackout, and I thought it was normal to see stars when I surfaced, but I don't recall feeling any contractions. Of course we didn't have watches either, so I have no idea how long my dives were, but I certainly must have been pushing my limits. And about 10 years ago, I got foolish cutting a white sea bass out of the kelp at 65 feet for a friend, and had lots of symptoms on the way up. My legs were tingling, my chest was burning,and I was light headed, and then saw stars when I hit the surface, but I still didn't feel a contraction.

 

[cdavis]

I think its enough individual that you have to figure it out for yourself. One buddy of mine, who doesn't get contractions, almost blacked out in a pool practice dive. He knew he wasn't getting good signals of when to come up before that, but it was a wake up all the same. He spent the next year in the pool exploring his limits and figuring out what he felt like when it was time to come up. A course helped a lot.

Caveat: you can BO with zilch warning, even if you get contractions ,etc. A trained buddy is still very necessary.

 

[Rockie]

Thanks both. I am the same Bill I just know when to come up and I couldn't tell you when that was either.

 

[Bill McIntyre]

cdavis makes a good point about blackouts with no warning. In California kelp beds, especially with poor visibility, a majority of us feel that its impossible to use a tight buddy system, but I do wear a Freedive Recovery Vest in hopes that it will be a decent substitute for a buddy in most cases.

This conversation has made me recall one occasion when I was very close to blackout, but it was under circumstances different from what I experience while spearfishing.

In 1962 when I was a USMC Lt. I went through a US Navy SCUBA school at Pearl Harbor. We were divided into two man teams that always did everything together. One day while doing pool work we were taking a break for 10 minutes, and my swim partner challenged me to a distance contest to see who could swim the most laps of the pool with mask and fins. He went first, and I said that there was no way some Navy kid was going to beat a Marine, and then set out to prove it. I beat his distance and was continuing for another lap, but then very suddenly felt very faint and weak. I barely came up and grabbed the edge of the pool and my head was spinning. An instructor had noticed this epic contest and said that I had been looking very weak and wobbly, and he was just about to jump in and grab me when I surfaced.

 

[Rockie]

That sounds like you were at you limit Bill. I am like you very new to free diving and not one to give any advice but that would have worried me. I am just doing it to get a little more bottom time spearfishing as opposed to free diving free diving. I do like the sound of these freedive recovery vests I will have to look into these

 

[Bill McIntyre]

The vests are getting better and better.
https://forums.deeperblue.com/threads/new-version-of-freedive-recovery-vest.102331/

 

[Rockie]

Thanks Bill I was just about to ask where did you get yours from. Ive had a look online on my phone but will have a better look tomorrow on the computer. They all seem to come from California? I am in the channel islands South of England. I will have a read of the link above. Thanks Bill

 

[Rockie]

Bill could you do me a favour and send me the link to the website with yhe FRV Mark II s. I can only find the Mark II. Thanks Bill

 

[cdavis]

If you keep having trouble with getting a link, google Freediver Recovery Vest, Terry Maas. It will come up.

 

[little sarge]

Rockie: how much weight are you diving with? And with this weight when are you neutrally buoyant? And are you positively buoyant on the surface?
Sounds like your pushing the envelope mate! Do you have a dive buddy which can help you when or if it goes tits up?

 

[Bill McIntyre]

Bill could you do me a favour and send me the link to the website with yhe FRV Mark II s. I can only find the Mark II. Thanks Bill

The Mark II S is very new, and he just hasn't updated his web site yet. It was just a week ago that he sent me his first professionally taken photos of it. But he told me that from now on, new vests sold will have that configuration. If you do decide to order, just be sure that he understands that you want the new version. It looks like the season is about over here, so I'll be sending mine back to be modified very soon.

Last Saturday I passed up a chance to see it in person. I was invited to his 70th birthday party and was tempted, but its a four hour drive through Los Angeles freeway traffic to get to Ventura and my wife had another commitment. I didn't want to be driving home by myself late at night after a few beers or spending the night in a hotel by myself, so I passed.

If you do end up getting one, profit from my next door neighbor/diving buddy's mistake. After he charged the battery, he forgot to replace the plug in the charging port and it flooded. I asked Terry if there was any way to save it, and he said it was a total loss. But then he contatcted my buddy and offered to replace the hardware for $500. I think that is entirely reasonable. And he said that from now on, the charging port plug will be connected to a cord so that it will be harder to misplace.

 

[Bill McIntyre]

I just received this email. Now the web site does show the II S.

Dear FRV purchaser,
Over the last year, we have gained much experience with the FRV and we've learned some things as well. Attached is the updated manual, which we update frequently on the web site ( www.oceanicss.com).
One serious item we have become aware of is possible corrosion build up within the spring chamber of the actuator. PLEASE READ PAGES 27 AND 28 OF THE MANUAL, which addresses this issue. Basically, you need to soak the FRV actuator is a special anti-salt solution--plain water is not good enough. You need to then release the spring by dry firing (pulling the manual activation cord with no cylinders) and then lubricate the spring chamber.
Also, users of the earlier version have charge plugs without cords, and some of you have forgotten them and ruined your units. Please tape the plug to the charger so you don't forget to use it.

Lastly, we have developed an exciting new softgoods vest that is very streamlined, bubble free,and easy to repack. Please see the manual for details.
For early adopters such as yourself, We will be glad to replace your vest at our cost for installation and testing. US customers will be $250 including shipping. International customers will be $225 with you contributing shipping both ways. When we receive the FRV for replacement of the softgoods, we will upgrade the computer code (increases battery life by 100%) and provide you with a lanyard charger plug if you don't already have one. We are in production now, so the new vests won't be ready until January. You may send your FRV now, or wait until that date.

Terry Maas

<FRV_Mark_II-S.pdf>

 

[Rockie]

Thanks Bill I will have a look on website link.

Littlesarge: about 10.5kgs and buoyant at the surface. Just added I guess 500-600g to my vest but not tried it yet. I go with my cousin most of the time if not I dont push it. How you getting on?