Omer Airbalete Rust Problem

[sparus]

Hi everyone,
I am a new member of the board.
I have been using pneumatic spearguns for approximately 20 years. To me the best WAS Omer airbalete.
However, I had some problems while pulling the trigger. It was heavier than than usual. So I had to disassemble my speargun. I was shocked to see whole parts get rusted including piston, and piston lock-release mechanism. The whole pieces were covered in rust. Because all of these metal parts were made of non-stainless steel. Although there were plenty of omer airgrease, it seems that it has no protection against rusting. Furthermore, it is not logic to make these pieces from non-stainless steel.
I warned a friend of mine who also uses omer airbalete, the result was the same.

If you are using an omer airbalete please check if you have rust inside. And if you are willing to buy an Omer airbalete, please think twice.

Here are the rusted pieces.

This photo belongs to my friend. He also checked his gun after I talked to him.

 

[Diving Gecko]

Wow, thanks for the warning.
I have had Omer send me spareparts for the One Air in the past, free of charge.
Actually, I think traditional airguns' trigger sears are not stainless either, but I haven't ever seen any of those rust. Perhaps, a tiny bit of sea water could have crept into the interior of your guns? Possibly via the piston seals?

 

[sparus]

I have a very old mares sten and mares cyrano. I guess my mares sten gun is older than me, it was my fathers. However, I have never faced such a rust problem. Furthermore, my airbalete was at home for 9-10 months. The other airbalete gun (my friends) is actively used. I think the problem arises due to the moisture in the air pumped to the gun. Nevertheless, lets think that our guns took sea water in the tubes, I still think that these parts should be stainless steel. This is not a homemade speargun, I really paid a huge amount to reach "quality". Omer should re-consider this situation. I really like the weight, silent action and aim line design in Omer airbalete.

 

[Diving Gecko]

I have a very old mares sten and mares cyrano. I guess my mares sten gun is older than me, it was my fathers. However, I have never faced such a rust problem. Furthermore, my airbalete was at home for 9-10 months. The other airbalete gun (my friends) is actively used. I think the problem arises due to the moisture in the air pumped to the gun. Nevertheless, lets think that our guns took sea water in the tubes, I still think that these parts should be stainless steel. This is not a homemade speargun, I really paid a huge amount to reach "quality". Omer should re-consider this situation. I really like the weight, silent action and aim line design in Omer airbalete.

Ah, good point on the air humidity. I will make a note of trying to pump up my guns in a dry environment.

As for the material choice, Omer has for a long time been cutting corners in production - why their brand is still regarded as good quality is really beyond me. But that said, I am fairly sure the material in your dad's gun's trigger is likely the same as in the Airbalete. Or maybe Omer thought it was and then somehow somewhere someone might have lowered the spec a bit?
Anyhow, I wouldn't expect Omer or any big manufacturer to start using stainless on the inside of these guns. Also, even if they did, 316L stainless steel - which is the most used marine grade stainless - supposedly can suffer from galling so they would probably have to use something that can be heat treated/hardened like the 17-4PH used in many shafts. But that's more steps in production and more costly, hence why I don't think it will happen. Omer would rather spend money on advertising...

 

[sparus]

Mares sten is not with me now. In a few weeks I will disassemble it and will inform you.
You are totally right on "quality" vs "Omer". They did not even reply to me.
I guess 303, 304 or 316 could be better than what is used now on airbalete. I can remove shavings with a file on that material. So I think it is not a hardened steel. It can be some sort of cast.
Anyway, I will try to find a way re-making of these parts from N690 or maybe AISI 630. Since I am a hobby knife maker, I am familiar with steel and heat treatment. But I am fully open on any offers on type of steel to be used.
Futhermore, to re-make a modified piston I think to use a resin embedded steel. But I have no idea what kind of resin I should use. Epoxy?

 

[Diving Gecko]

Is AISI630 the same as 17-4PH? If so, that's an option.
I seem to recall that perhaps 410, 440 or something like that is known as a good "knife steel" and perhaps stainless (but I could be mistaken)?

SpearQ8 is an engineer who has spent countless hours improving his spearguns with incredible results. Here are some of his thoughts about trigger materials: http://www.spearboard.com/showthread.php?t=191049

 

[sparus]

Thank you very much!

 

[sparus]

You are totally right on "quality" vs "Omer". They did not even reply to me.

I was wrong they replied to me... "contact to your local dealer blabla"...
I see no difference between "no-reply" and "a reply like above". Anyway, think twice before buying an Omer pneumatic speargun.

 

[popgun pete]

Most likely saltwater got into the gun. How it can happen is if your gun suddenly depressurizes at depth then ambient pressure will open the inlet valve and seawater goes into the gun’s interior. I had this occur and thought that the air leak was maybe not too bad, but on walking along the shoreline the gun seemed strangely heavier than usual. I gave it a shake up and down and sure enough I could hear water sloshing around inside the gun. I lost no time in pulling it apart as soon as possible.

P.S. from memory early AIrbaletes had no oil inside them, just grease. At the time I predicted that they would use oil eventually as grease does not move around inside the gun like oil does.

 

[sparus]

That was the first thing I also suspected. However, there no visual signs of water inside the gun. Furthermore the pressure was the same as it was before. To me the most important issue about this situation is using non-stainless steel in a speargun. I don't see the reason lying behind this. If you take a look at the photos I sent, the spring on the lock-release mechanism is made of stainless steel. But the rest seems to be some sort of casting.
After this happened to my gun, I also started to use oil plus to grease. In a few days I will disassemble my gun again. I changed almost every piece; main cork, lock-release mechanism and piston. We will see if that shit happened again or not.

 

[popgun pete]

I have used Russian spearguns with absolutely no stainless steel used anywhere in the gun and they still worked OK provided they were washed after every dive and the oil was changed each year. Never saw any rust inside them when on occasion I pulled them apart.