open vs closed muzzels

[daur]

hello to you all!
i am a newcomer to this site, although i have got quite a few hours spearing..... mostly night fishing in the mediterenian....
ho yea, excuse any spelling mistakes...
i was wondering about the differnce between open& closed muzzels, since i have had only pneumatic gun so far..
i am thinking of buying a good speargun to replace my old one...
i was thinking of a RA, omer,c4..... any insight? apart from the regular s.african vs euro debates?
thanx a lot... i have spent the past week or so, reading past threads on this truly amaizing site!

don't forget to breath!!

 

[miles]

Hiya

My OPNION:

From what i gather, open muzzles on euro type guns were first made by the Hawaiian and US spearo's. They prefered the open view as this was what they were accustomed to on their wooden guns.

The open muzzle does offer a more open view, making aiming easier for some spearo's. It also allows for quicker swinging of the gun on fish.

Their are a couple of aftermarket manufacturers that produce them, with Hammerhead muzzles being very popular. How-ever, many euro gun manufacturers now also make their own range of guns fitted with open muzzles as standard.

On the other hand, normal muzzles have been working for most spearo's all over the world. Bottom line is that YOUR personal preference is all that matters. BUY the one YOU like the best!!

Regards
miles

 

[daur]

hey !
thank you for your reply!
i have no preferance since i am using a pneumatic gun for the past few years... i want to cross the lines& buy a rubber speargun... i was thinking about a 100 of c4 or RA...... from what i read here these two look appealing.. i spear the mediteranen reefs at about 12 m...
i can go twice the depth but so it is soooooo far away....
one of the desissions i need to take is about the muzzel...
your assisnetce will be a great help for me (since i saw you own a c4... very uncommon i must say..)
well, hope to here from you& from others soon!
cheers!

 

[Marwan]

hi I have both types of muzzles, i own a riffe gun (open) as well as omer, rabitech, cressi (all closed muzzles), to me i cant say the muzzle makes that much of a difference, i prefer the euro guns for most of our diving (I also dive the med) , i always feel (thats my personal perception) that the euro style rubbers are more accurate than circular bands, if you buy omer or c4, i dont think that you will feel much of a drag when side tracking after a fast fish. i will echo what miles said, go with what you like more, and what you could find spare parts for easier i would add.

 

[panosb]

I agree with Marwan, GO with what suits you best!!! I like more open muzzle euroguns. What i noticed is that after using open muzzles for 6 years, it was hard for me to go back using closed muzzles!!! The best choice you can have right is the new OMER XXV Gold. You can have both open and close muzzle in one gun!!! The gun comes with a closed muzzle which after removing two pins you can convert it to an open with circular bands!!! I own an 100cm XXV Gold and it is very versatile. I also own a C4 MONOSCCOCA which top of the tops but it a very expensive solution for shallow water general hunting as i suppose you are doing. Get used to a more compatible gun b4 moving to a C4.

 

[daur]

hey guys!
thank you for your help! i have a question about the c4, one of you wrote not to buy it as a first rubber gun, why is that? i mean i know it is expensive, but if i am whilling to put the cash, why shouldn't i buy a good gun to start with?
is it too hard to operate?
cheers mates!!!

 

[Ted Budion]

My 2¢

The theory: open muzzles suit better guns with two or more rubbers, like the Americans like to use. They increase the line of sight aiming sacrificing precision because of the increase in recoil.

Closed muzzles (for screw-in bands, as European muzzles, for loops, like those from South Africa) work better with single band rigs because rubbers are in the same axis of the shaft.

This is the theory, because most divers almost inconsciously learn to compensate their guns shooting kicks.

 

[panosb]

hey guys!
thank you for your help! i have a question about the c4, one of you wrote not to buy it as a first rubber gun, why is that? i mean i know it is expensive, but if i am whilling to put the cash, why shouldn't i buy a good gun to start with?
is it too hard to operate?
cheers mates!!!

My friend, could an inexperienced driver drive efficiently and asafely a Ferrari? Of course no!!! It is almost the same. What a beginner needs is a decent gun to start with, get used to it (sometimes to destroy it too!!!) and once this is not enough to cover his needs then he should move on to a better gun and so on. There are some difficulties in their use ( i.e. ease of loading and other things).

 

[Dobs]

I've never used a C4, but my opinion is different from panosb's. If you have the cash why not? I don't think loading a 100cm C4 will be more difficult than loadin any other brand of 100cm gun. I know from my own experience that if you buy something cheeper of lower quality at first, you will always end up buying the better and more expensive product later on. So why not save some money and by the quality stuff
That's my 2 c.

 

[Ted Budion]

Another 2¢ of mine...

For someone who doesn't have previous experience, it doesn't make any difference, IMHO, if he learns using an open or a closed muzzle. Also, if he can afford an expensive gun (BUT appriopriate to his spearing conditions), why not?

OTOH, regardless of all theory, I think beginners are best served and advance more if they stick to the local spearfishing culture, to the least to get more advice and spare parts for the guns. I know that from personal experience: I decided to switch from mid-handle air guns to euro-band guns (Sporasub's H. Dessault at the time) when I lived and dove in the US. I eventually master the new set-up, but it took me much longer because my American buddies had never seen such a rig (Abbiller Sea-Hornets and Hawaiian slings were the rule then), inasmuch as they coined it the toy gun.

 

[daur]

panosb my friend!
you are very right! but i failed to mention i am not a begginer, i have more than 12 years of spearfishing, i go as deep as 25 meters, i just used an air gun so far!!
i want to move to a rubber gun& i am now a bit on the move, so i have no buddies.... i stay a few monthes every country.. now i have no sea, so i am saving to buy a top of the line gun, that will last for a long time, maintanence wise& fishing wise.... one that i will not grow out of, professionaly speaking.. and don't worry about loading the gun, i can handel it.....
thank you all for your help, if anyond can think of any other gun that will might fit me, i am more than happy to hear about it!

 

[Dobs]

Daur, you can always get a nice wooden euro gun like Totemsub, Dapiran or Abellan. Or have you ever considered to use a mamba kit on your pneumatic guns?

 

[daur]

hey!
what is a mamba kit? i have a mares 70 gun, but its in his last years, i don't want to disturbe him at such an old age.......
i'd rather save up for a new one.... i think i deserve it after 11 years...........
well i'd like to hear about the totem... although i really like the simple designe of the c4. it just cought me...
plus the fact that it is rare, is apealling... even thoughi know its stupid.
well what can i do? i fell inlove with a gun& now i am trying to find people to back it up... i just need to deside what kind of configuration i want, open-closed, what length, what type of rubber etc.....

 

[Dobs]

I know it is all about personal preference, but I'd take a handcrafter european wooden gun anytime instead of C4 But that's me
Here are some of the best in business:
http://www.totemsub.it/
http://www.dapiran.it/shopnet_dapiran/articoli.aspx?cat=FUC
http://www.gimansub.it/pag1.htm
http://www.abellansub.com/

As for the mamba kit it is the latest craze among pneumatic gun users. I've never used or seen one, but here is the website of the manufacturer for some info http://www.maorisub.it/

 

[strangelove]

if you want that kind of price range don't forget the teak-sea.

http://www.teak-sea.com

I have two, but if I was buying a gun today I would get a omer excalibur 3000.

 

[Tesla]

Hi,
Because I never used Open Muzzels, pleae tell me what is difference or advantege during loading speargun with open muzzle.
Could it be some loading problems during big waws and high carrent?
BR

 

[Robbo66]

Yes, I've the Omer T20 open muzzle and it's a pig to reload in swell, just look at the front of it and you'll see what I mean.

I have reverted to the beuchat carbon mundial elite....closed ! What a difference

Rob

 

[dave]

open or closed muzzle is just personal preference, but I do find an open muzzle slightly quicker to reload, even in a swell, it just takes practise, wrapping the line becomes second nature
cheers
dave
www.spearo.co.uk

 

[Robbo66]

Hi Dave,
Not when the band twists constantly and takes the rubber stretcher into a birds nest with practically every shot !.
Then you need to ensure the spear is firmly seated as otherwise will drop off left or right in swell.
Then under, over the spear and down under another gripper..... then the spear slides off.................aggghhh:head

Much quicker to thread it through closed muzzle imo,

Rob