Patrick Musimu Article in Diver Mag

[bam bam]

I was going to just write about it, but then thought i better let people view the article instead.

The one part i do like is the:

"Musimu doubted the provenance of the 192m claim"

Funny he can't accept someone else "unofficial" achievements, while pushing his own "unofficial" achievements.

There are plenty of other things that take a swing at AIDA and freedivers!

Also Patrick is apparantly going to be at DIVE2005 29-30 Oct, National Exhibition Centre in Birmingham! Maybe we go and ask some pressing questions ourselves?

 

[donmoore]

Thanks for posting the article. I thought it was great. I don’t blame Patrick for his view of AIDA. I think he is wrong though, but then again it’s a lot easier to look from the outside and say that, then be the one who was subjected to comments that were not deserved.

The AIDA is a group of people with different views. It is a democracy! There have always been some that were against equipment and technique advances. But it is also made up of open-minded people as well. His mentioned of Tanya Streeter and Louis Leferme’s e-mails shows this. They are part of the AIDA too and their support of Patrick should count just as much as they others.

Anything you accomplish in life will be put-down by some. Its called jealousy! If you don’t want to deal with, then don’t accomplish anything and those people will leave you alone! Sorry, for throwing in my own philosophy.

Of course the writer got a little wrong, and probably more than I tell. But the part about flooding the Eustachian tubes is one example. The Eustachian tubes are usually closed so compression of them is not a factor. Their only purpose in the wet equalization was to transfer the water from their openings in the thorax to the middle ear.

I also agree with Patrick that the whole definition of no-limits makes it not compatible with organization groups anyway. Who can say what is safe for something so far out there? If they want to come measure the line afterwards or check the depth watches - let them have it. But they should concentrate their efforts on the standard free diving disciplines and competition, which they do an excellent job of. Bottom line Patrick Musimu is the current no-limits champ!
don

 

[bam bam]

I also agree with Patrick that the whole definition of no-limits makes it not compatible with organization groups anyway. Who can say what is safe for something so far out there? If they want to come measure the line afterwards or check the depth watches - let them have it. But they should concentrate their efforts on the standard free diving disciplines and competition, which they do an excellent job of. Bottom line Patrick Musimu is the current no-limits champ!
don

Understandable, but why would AIDA openly want to be there, while critising his techniques. That doesn't make sence.

Also you've added to my initial comment of him doubting the 192m claim. Ok he is now the champ, but only by an additional 17m!!!

then there is the implication of small incriments of records, well look at Tanya S and then Martin's recent increase.

 

[donmoore]

but why would AIDA openly want to be there, while critising his techniques. That doesn't make sence

Simple, AIDA is a group of individuals. Some wanted to be there and some where critical of his technique. The action or views of a few don’t define the group!

On the 192 meters, was their anything close to the amount of documentation as there was for this dive? Seems like it’s just out there as someone was there to say it happened. Sebastian Murat says he did 105 meters in CW in training. Does he claim it was a world record? I don’t doubt him, if he says he did it, but he acknowledges it was only training. There wasn’t a TV crew there, there weren’t official people measuring ropes, and their wasn’t the foremost dive electronic company saying they felt the measurements were correct.

Anyway it doesn’t matter if Patrick broke the record by 17 meters or 38. He did it way beyond any margin for error.
don

 

[donmoore]

This might not be the thread to say it, but on the AIDA, I personally think they made some huge steps this year getting rid of the equipment rules, etc.. I also think the next thing they need to do is ban record only events for CW, dynamic, and static. Competitions that allow more people to pursue records without extraordinary budgets are where the future of the sport is. Where athletes, spectators, vendors, and media can come together and in an all-inclusive freediving environment.

It looks like it is already happening. Tom Sietas three records of static, no fin dynamic, and fin dynamics, I believe were all set in competition. The previous two men CW with fin records were set in competition. With the rule changes, even people who can afford to do a record only event, may choose to save their money and do it competition.
don

 

[Alun]

urm.... i think DB could get into trouble for allowing the magazine article to be shown on this website...

 

[tylerz]

Man, I found it hillarious that he was wearing a 7mm for water temperatures that at the minimum were 22C. We don't use 7mm even in surface temps as low as 4C.

I find it distracting that so much attention in the article is spent on claiming others' lack of support and suggestions against his attempts, and then at the same time he seems to belittle others' abilities.

"... Musimu warned that it would be difficult for others to challenge his achievement."

For a jump of 17m or even 39m it seems a little self-complimenting to make such a statement, especially when the following statement suggests people are not pushing their limits. I did a 20m jump over a 2 week period, the chance that others at such depths have the ability for jumps is quite likely.

"I just saved the world 10-15 years of crappy commercial records, that's all!"

Why are they crappy? Is his more honorable in some fashion? I fail to see it after reading all his comments about himself, his dives, and others.

"The 300m theory surprised him."

He is promoting having no limits and then would rather put down such suggestions as opposed to promoting them.

"...his ideas, but The freediving community rejected them,..."

He insists on creating a bad image of a community, yet won't put himself in a position of being accountable for why they deserve this. Who is the freediving community as a whole? Who are these armchair theorists? What actual statements were made that he interpretted so accurately to imply what he claims? Show some proof or something that lets somebody have the potential to discount the statements, otherwise he is just holding all the cards so he can say whatever he wishes and nobody can say otherwise. He doesn't seem to have any issue with doing so and painting a negative picture.

"I wanted this victory, because when I started diving the other freedivers said: "You're black, you can't dive! You're too old! You have too much muscle.""

C'mon this just sounds like a huge over simplification of actual statements made to him, all creating a very negative picture in the form he presents them. Sounds like a little child who doesn't like others to have an opinion in anything. Or is just self-glorfying and imagining how upset those who defied him must be. Maybe it is just the language barrier...

I don't doubt that he could have run into very strong negative feedback, but his is no better in response to it. Actually it is worse since it wraps all the negativity up with the positivity from the community and trashes it all. But I am more inclined to believe he has taken many statements completely out of context, or at least how he presents them to the media or how they interpret them, albeit they show them as quotes.

Great dive, staggering confidence, awesome determination, sleek resourcefullness; childish, vengeful publicity.

Bad taste in my mouth growing with every quote of his.

 

[Erik]

Man, I found it hillarious that he was wearing a 7mm for water temperatures that at the minimum were 22C. .

7mm for extra bouyancy I imagine.
Peace,
erik Y.

 

[tylerz]

I don't know what transformation he experienced down there that he claims and others supposedly witnessed in him, but definately he is far from the general concept of inner-peace, although he obviously has his own relative version that none of us can deny him.

 

[tylerz]

7mm for extra bouyancy I imagine.

Yeah, I am thinking of how hot it must be in there, and how that would throw us out of relaxation, overheating increasing our heart rate, decrease our vasoconstriction, etc... I wonder if he flushes the suit often before the dive. Might be effective to make vents in the suit to flush water through it during the dive.

 

[watts]

If Patricks 209.6m dive on a training day in preparation for the big day is to be considered a world record why shouldnt Toms 10min static or Sebs 192m. It would be interesting to know of others world records done on training days in the various disciplines. Im sure we would also see huge jumps in times and distances compared to those done under the scrutiny of a record attempt.

Nathan

 

[Erik]

Yeah, I am thinking of how hot it must be in there, and how that would throw us out of relaxation, overheating increasing our heart rate, decrease our vasoconstriction, etc...

Agreed. You and I would be cooking in that environment, especially breathing up on a sunny day. It takes me forever for the MDR to kick in in warm water if I don't do some negatives to start. But if he's adapted to those temps, then I guess it would be ok for him.
Then again, I dive a 3mm but have 9mm on my chest in water that's 20C at the surface. Plus the dry gloves....
Peace,
Erik Y.

 

[island_sands]

Also you've added to my initial comment of him doubting the 192m claim. Ok he is now the champ, but only by an additional 17m!!!
.

And? 17m is quite a distance at those depths... don't you think? If swimmers beat each by 2.08 seconds no-one contests that... I think Don is right... its all jealously.

Instead of whingeing about it why don't people train and aim to match or beat his achievement....

 

[Stephan Whelan]

What I find interesting about all this is Patrick's attitude. It's obvious he's done a tremendous achievement and even his critics have turned around and said it was a good dive - however it is met with a constant anger about something.

I'm fasinated to know what is driving Patrick's unhappiness with the rest of the FreeDiving world - however he seems to not want to talk to us at all (although I am still hoping for some sort of response from him).

 

[hanke]

You all didn't read his post-dive statement, did you?

http://www.patrickmusimu.com/statement.html

``My statement further to the 200m achievement, stemmed from an anger I thought I had under control but which surfaced with me as I finally broke the box in which a lot of the “self-proclaimed” leading minds in Freediving, seem to be locked in and wanted to leave me trapped in knowledge to the forefront of other recreational and/or high-level sports. Integrating my know-how to existing training programmes of other high performance athletes.''

``As a certified physiotherapist and mental coach, passionate about sports, I am embarking on a new journey. Because I truly feel that the logical, or should I say, the natural next step, is to bring my newfound knowledge to the forefront of other recreational and/or high-level sports. Integrating my know-how to existing training programmes of other high performance athletes.''

etc.

Also, please note that this is probably more recent than the article (magazine articles often take a long time to get to print).

For an outside observer, this article written by Patrick is basically an apology to all of you,
although you don't find the exact word apology here. It's very strange to me. Why can't you take it, apologize for your statements and make a fullstop after all the disputes around this dive?

From an outsiders perspective, it seems like he got angry for a moment (and I think nobody here will seriously doubt he had a reason!), which was an error, of course, a very human one, but now he is calm and friendly again. While in the meantime ... the people *here* at these forums got angry at him. And the circle closes. It's very childish. You people here posting about how he doesn't find peace etc. don't look like *you* actually did find it.

 

[Merlin]

Maybe he should have spent some of his trainning time on anger management classes.

 

[tylerz]

You all didn't read his post-dive statement, did you?

http://www.patrickmusimu.com/statement.html
...
For an outside observer, this article written by Patrick is basically an apology to all of you,
although you don't find the exact word apology here. It's very strange to me. Why can't you take it, apologize for your statements and make a fullstop after all the disputes around this dive?
...
the meantime ... the people *here* at these forums got angry at him. And the circle closes. It's very childish. You people here posting about how he doesn't find peace etc. don't look like *you* actually did find it.

Actually you are absolutely correct that I just read the latest post-dive statement 2 days after my previous posts(sorry don't hang out at his site daily). And I as well saw it as an honorable appology and mature change in attitude. I also intended to state it so, but there didn't seem much rush as this thread had little activity. Although interesting that you ask the question and supply the answer for us yourself.

How you go from a discussion about a magazine article, to a suggestion that we here are being childish, not accepting his appology, and angry at him... boggles me??! Not sure where all that comes from. I think if you reread the posts, you will see there is no expression of anger, but simply an unbiased assessment of his approach to publicity in such articles. If you read other threads you would see that overall I and others have supported Patrik's dive and approaches and even argued for his case. Your assessment is completely off target. Peace? Interesting that you are suggesting those who have an unbiased opinion about somebody else's obvious lack of peace, as witnessed in the mentioned articles, implies they are not at peace? Could you please explain that concept?

However, you will find that many people would not be appeased by his subtle approach to an appology, so you may still have the chance yet to cast your judgement on others.

 

[samdive]

I'd still like to know what "we" did to upset Patrick in the first place. Does anyone know?

 

[donmoore]

I don’t think there is person alive who hasn’t had a problem with anger at one time or another. Being quick to judge shows a problem with anger just as much as an outburst. Everyone could probably benefit from an anger management course.

Second reporters never write exactly what a person says and they also tend to emphases things that weren’t intended to be emphasis. Their goal is to make their story the most read as possible.

Third, we should never assume we know exactly what a non-first language English speaker is saying and especially their attitude behind it is. Believe me, I have some experience with this. I’m married to one! Being slow to judge is a necessity, because you will get it wrong very fast and then there will be conflict.

Let the past outbursts and judgments be in the past. Patrick, your dive and accomplishments are incredible! If you choose to participate in this forum, we will be honored to have your input. We want to know everything you want to share about your training, your techniques, equipment, goals, future, etc..
don

 

[Patfan]

Let the past outbursts and judgments be in the past

Donmoore I seriously love your attitude and objectivity....

having jumped repeatedly on the bandwaggon of sarcasme and childishness.... I will abstain from future conflict :ko ....well i'll try i'm only human after all..... rofl


and I think that Patrick or anyone for that matter who is talked to with the respect and objectivity you've come with would be more than forthcoming...