Safety Training for Overhead Environments

I'm no photographer, but today we bought a disposable "waterproof to 45 feet" camera and took some shots. I'll try to scan them and post if they are worth viewing.

There are several websites with good pictures. One site I just found has a couple of good shots of the spring I dove today (Ginnie Springs / Devil's complex): <http://www.mountaindiver.com/dive07.html>. In fact, that website shows a photograph taken from inside the cavern looking back at some scubadubbas at the cavern entrance - I took a photo from that exact spot today with the disposable. We'll see who's the better photographer (ha - I'd go to the website if I were you).

The opening looks small in that photo, but two divers can easily swim between those rocks side-by-side. We did it several times today. The photographer was obviously using a strong light, because the rocks in the immediate foreground are not illuminated from the back side of the cavern, and the light coming through the entrance does not strike the back side of the rocks.

Notice in the bottom of the picture there is a rope line running straight toward the cavern entrance. That rope is anchored just in front of the photographer and extends behind the photographer to the back wall of the cavern, which slopes down behind him. I'm not sure how far back that wall is, but I made it there easily today - I would guess it to be about 30-40 feet from the cavern entrance, which is at a depth of only about 12 feet . . . so the trip from the surface down into the cavern to the back wall is only about 50 feet or so. The distance and depth per se are no challenge, but the current is signficant, and you need a light to see where you are going as you head into the cavern. Coming back out, you can just head for the light coming through the entrance, but you still have to make sure you don't bonk your head.

Scott dives these caverns also - maybe he has taken photos???

Scott - have you been back to the grate at Ginne that prevents further penetration into the cave? We did not venture that far today, but next time, I'd like to look for it. I assume it is on the floor of the ballroom somewhere, probably right of where the rope is anchored on the wall?? One of the things that concerns me is light failure - I'm not sure one can see daylight from the entrance.

Also, Scott may want to share with us what he's learning as he dives dark water sinks. Now that must be eerie!!

I think you've made a good suggestion and one we ought to look into. In fact, Scott and I were just talking about Spare air today at the end of our marathon spring dive day (Scott showed me a number of great places I'd never been). I don't believe spare air would be an intrusion on the freedive experience if it were never used in freediving . . i.e., it's only there to aid in a rescue, not to prolong a freedive. - And if a rescue is actually needed, who cares whether or not it is a freedive rescue or an air-assisted rescue.

One of the complexities is that we would have to be cave certified - not just open water scuba certified - to carry spare air in many of the places we dive. That's a lot of extra training in the use of equipment we would never use and to handle situations we would never encounter just to be able to carry an emergency bottle of spare air. So, one has to decide whether it is worth all the time and trouble. One way to solve that is to dive with friends who are already cave certified, but who have given it up for freediving . . . just have to make sure the certified guy does not need to be rescued!

I think you are right about it's potential usefulness in the event that an actual rescue is needed. Thanks for the idea and the input!

You're probably right, Vince, they don't really get mad at you. It's usually the person who is using the scuba gear in a cavern without cavern certification who gets angy . . . . right after his equipment is confiscated and he is banned from the site.

I don't think freedivers want to go that route. If you want to use spare air in a cavern, you have to get the C card; if you want to use spare and a light, you have to get the full C (cave) card.

Personally, I think a light is safety equipment for a freediver because it helps him keep from bonking his head on rocks, especially on the way out of a cavern because the backsides of the rocks are not illuminated by the daylight coming through the entrance. A cavern-certified scuba diver can take his time and feel his way out around dark rocks, but a freediver doesn't have all day. A light is also useful to see cave-diver's lines before entanglement occurs. So for me, it would require full cave certification to carry spare air because I also want the safety of a light.

Also, I wouldn't agree about scuba certification courses being of much use for freedivers. That's like going to truck driving school to become a race driver . . . sure, there's some cross-over, but too little to make it a productive use of time and money. We need more courses specifically for freedivers. Unfortunately, the scuba instructors I've spoken with have no interest, and really very little knowledge about freediving. You have to understand that their economics depend on creating customers who will buy a BCD, regulator, etc., etc. in addition to the price of the course. I can't blame them . . . it simply isn't their bag.

First, ditto to Scott's message - we had a great time and look forward to diving together again soon. This forum is bringing together freedivers who would probably never find out about one another otherwise. My son said it was the most fun he's had since he and I camped on Standing Indian Moutain (that's not a cavern, for the unfamiliar).

thin air - I agree with you and Snorkelbum about what a great emergency device spare air would be. I also agree that it is good for freedivers to be generally knowledgable about all kinds of diving-related safety issues, even if we're unlikely to be the victims.

Cave/cavern rules may be different other places, so you might not have a problem carrying a spare air bottle for emergency use elsewhere. However, here in north Florida, where scuba diving IS cave diving, the rules are taken pretty seriously. Dive sites get closed off if too many people die in them, so there is great attention given to allowing only those with adequate training to take scuba into a cavern or cave. I think that as freedivers, we do not want to be percieved as renegades trying to skirt the rules. But it does perturb me that we may be denied a life-saving emergency device because others feel they need to dictate our behavior. -Don't know how to go about getting this changed though.

Nearly all private sites I've heard of insist that to dive in their cavern, you have to be "cavern diving" certified from the National Speliological Society-National Cave Diving Section (I think that's the name - you can check it out on some of the web sites I posted earlier in this thread) or NAUI or GUE (Global Underwater Explorers). If you go beyond the light zone, i.e., into the cave, you have to have full cave certification. I've not known anyone personally who has had gear confiscated or been banned, but know people who claim it has happened. The "rules" in these place certainly state that it can happen, though I don't know how they could actually take your gear - they are not police. They can certainly kick you out and forbid re-entrance.

All of the State Parks in Florida that have springs or sinks with caves have that rule - no cave certification, no diving, period. The enforcers are Park Rangers, and they have the authority of police.