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spearfishing morality and ethics

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Thanks Marwan for the kind words.
I'm sorry for contributing to flame this thread and to turn it in something personal. I sent a personal message to Deepwater and I'm sure we'll come to understand each other to live together as respectfully and friendly as the Deeperblue folks have always been.
PS: by the way all my family has always been actively antifascist. Both my granddad and my wife's grandfather were pursued, captured and tortured by nazi-fascist at that time. They were brave men, which I'm proud of.
 
Reactions: Jonny250 and fcallagy
There are a few interesting problems with this thread -

First is projecting sentimentality onto nature. 'how do you think the fish feels?' Have you ever watched fish eat? Follow that logic and you'll end up 'detesting' everything. How do you 'think' anything 'feels'? - the relationship between thought and emotion really is the problem here.

Next is the idea that freedive spearfishing even puts a scratch in fish populations. I've met a lot of freedive spearos and they are, as a group, way more in touch with the environment and nature than anyone involved in something like PETA.

Then; the intellectualization of negativity. As I've said elsewhere, and as innumerable ancient traditions assert: Negativity is a substance - regardless of how it is rationalized. One is functionally better off viewing it quantitatively.

Last is a working definition of insanity: Looking at anything from just one point of view.
 
Reactions: Erik, podge and spaghetti
No need for harsh words. Let's be civilised.

If I may just reflect on this:
I personally detest hunting fish with the current situation in our oceans.
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That is fair enough. I am sure you can make good argument about it.

But it is also difficult to argue against the fact that spearfishing is one of the most environmentaly friendly ways to catch fish.

Buying fish from supermarket is just promoting whatever method they use to get the fish in exchange for high moral ground - "I did not do it" (I just paid for someone else to do it).

We can argue this for ages, but essentially the problem boils down to overpopulation. And unfortunately it is not going to get better.

Now, you can focus overpopulation problem into spearfishing if you really want, but let's at least be clear about it.
 
Reactions: Adrian and spaghetti
Hey Deepwater,

Just like to know if you are a vegetarian or if you eat any fish of any sort? We only shoot what we can eat and the beauty of spearfishing is that you can target a specific fish instead of hoping to catch something and getting something else and either killing it for the sake of it or traumatizing it so it dies a slow and painful death after being thrown back. Anyone who doesn't eat their catch should probably stop spearing but I think I speak for 99% of the spearo's on here when I say that anything you spear you gut and eat.
 
Reactions: jtkwest and spaghetti
Guys,

I have written a letter of apology to Spaghetti. I also need to learn how to put my thoughts down on paper in a more diplomatic way.

I am sure the world would be a better place if we had noble spearos like Spaghetti and a few others.

You see, I have only been exposed to people that will shoot anything on site-including scuba divers. They also spear fish that they would not and just for fun, which IMHO is something a serial killer would only do.

I have no intention of holding a spear gun but will express my admiration for the real professionals I have met on this board and not the malnourished farm animals I have encountered elsewhere.

Oh BTW, I dont eat fish or any seafood as I am allergic to it. If I want to have tuna now and then, I go buy the canned stuff from the supermarket.

Again, my apologies for ruffling up a few feathers. I honestly thought we were free to express our opinions. I love animals and fish and dont like to see them being hunted for sports. But again, thats me. I would like to see criminals pulled out from prisons and hunted as sports as well but then what kind of a society will we be building.
 
Reactions: Lockedin, Magpie and podge
Marwan said:
Deepwater,

If i look at what youve written , youre basically asking to start sh*t up...if youre against spearfishing thats fine, thats your opinion/view etc... better stick to areas of the forums where you feel are more relevant to you...
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Dude, do not even go there. Accusing me of starting sh*it and sticking to other forums is sort of like telling me to piss off and keep my opinions to myself.

Anyway, its done and dusted.
 
rules should apply here as they do at home you shoot it you eat it unless its unhealthy or there is a removel program where it needs to be taken out or population reduced to keep everthing healthy
 


Sweet, and once again harmony is restored.
Its takes a big man to type that out so respect due and freely given from a spearo who ONLY kills what he is going to eat, and as I couldn’t eat a whole scuba diver in one go then I reckon you’ll be safe.roflrofl
Peace Brothers

 
If this were a pure freediving site, or a pure photography site, or a pure underwater sight seeing site, then I guess it would OK to say that spearfishing in not ethical.

But DeeperBlue has forums that are clearly labeled for spearfisherman. That implies that its a safe place for spearfishermen to discuss their passion and exchange information. They should be able to do so without having someone tell them that what they do is not ethical.

Permit me to draw a comparison. I happen to think that pure freediving amounts to seeing how close you can come to death without quite going over the edge, and I hate to see young guys actually being encouraged to learn to how to suppress the body's warning provided by CO2 build up. But since this site is not a pure spearfishing site, but has forums devoted to pure freediving where people expect to be able to exchange information on how to go as close to death as possible, then I should refrain from expressing my opinion.

Similarly, Deepwater should refrain from expressing himself on spearfishing.
 
Reactions: vali and Magpie
Bill McIntyre said:
Similarly, Deepwater should refrain from expressing himself on spearfishing.
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I will express myself on any subject i feel like expressing myself on. Freedom of speech correct. I just have to be a bit more diplomatic.

hey , if you dont like it, have me booted of this forum.
 
it-s difficult to start a debate having this idea as subject
but i try 2 tell u my opinion....
i will never kill a human been, althought some of them deserve it...[self defence excluded i guess...because a normal been have a normal serf behaviour in such cases]
with fishes things are somehow different
i do hunt
but i know that a simple diver with a gun cannot do damage on purpose
there are unwritte laws....a kind of respect for underwater life...
never catch more that u need
never catch female in labor [because they provide fishes 4 years to come]
never catch fish under weights
and i must tell u that if a fish manage 2 escape from the firs hit...i let him survive and not hit him again
it-s possible 4 that fish to survive or not
if does, ok, if not, it will be food for other fish...
i-m a hunter but i must tell u this....a part of me die when i sper a fish....
for shure I cannot explain this, but it-s a fact....don-t ask me why....pls
 
I certainly don't have the power to get you booted off the forum. However, I would point out that there is no guarantee of freedom of speech on this web site. The rules of acceptable speech are whatever the owner says they are.

I was simply trying to reason with you and say that if I could bite my tongue in the interests of keeping the board a friendly place, it might be possible for you to do so too. Apparently you are more interested in expressing your opinion in inappropriate ways than you are in promoting harmony.

It isn't fruitful for me to butt into a freediving discussion and tell them that what they are doing is stupid or unduly dangerous, and its not right. Its not fruitful for you to butt into a spearfishing discussion and tell them that what they do is not ethical.
 
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Ah I see-I misread your post.My mistake.

Yes, a hairy chest helps for thumping away when listening to my own voice.

Bill, I just expressed my opinion. If no one liked it , I am sorry. I don't want any conflicts either. Again, the title of this thread says "spearfishing morality and ethics".

I did apologise and yes, should have kept my mouth shut. But then you ought to have a filter blocking out words like ethics etc.
If there is a moderator on this forum, please have me removed.

Ali
 
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Why can't we all............. Just get along! ahahahaha

look I don't see why you should be asked to get kicked out of the forum for expressing your self however, There are things that you have said that I would find extremely inappropriate specially to spagh and I know you have apologized and like stated before it's done with and dusted. So lets end this back and forth and stick to a civilized discussion.
 
Deepwater said:
Bill, I just expressed my opinion. If no one liked it , I am sorry. I don't want any conflicts either. Again, the title of this thread says "spearfishing morality and ethics".
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Yes it does. And while you are the one taking the beating, I think the guy who started the thread shares the blame. It was a stupid idea in the first place, and the trouble that has ensued just shows why it was stupid.
 
I don't think anyone should get removed from the forum for what has been said here. There have been sharp comments and there have been apologies. The whole thing reminds me of an oscillating universe, dispersion, then contraction - sometimes bursts of feeling like this actually bring people of dissimilar opinions closer, as the overall balance and reactions here are pretty positive and tend to settle down into mutual understanding. Passion is positive, and as long as there is a minimum of respect for each other, differing opinions only serve to illustrate and enhance the diversity of life.

The ego however sometimes traps us into thinking that we as a human being are being attacked when we are confronted with an opposing opinion - when it's only a point of view that is being questioned. It's the ego that turns us on fire, especially when we are questioned about things that are important to us.
 
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Reactions: Old Man Dave, Erik and fcallagy
Adrian beautifully put, now quickly close the thread before it gets all fractious again.martial:fridayroflrofl
 
Personally I quite enjoy watching people make dicks out of themselves. It costs me nearly a tenner a head to get this much entertainment at the cinema rofl Trouble is it's hard to take people serious again afterwards
 
Reactions: Lockedin
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