Static training & Diving performance

[tinkersg]

Dear Gilled Gurus,

I've been recreationally freediving in Hawaii for a couple years now without any training per say. Just recently found the forums. I won't be able to take a class for another year or so, but will continue to dive ... usually alone ... because I can't stop myself. So a little help, please:

Because I usually dive alone, I make it a point to never push myself. I always come up well before contractions. I've been down to around 30m like this (no idea how long). On my dry statics I usually encounter contractions around 3 min and can push out to 6 min. I've done some casual walking apneas and was able to walk somewhere around 50m (100m total). I have not experienced any hypoxic symptoms dry or wet (apart from some leg burn on the walking apneas). So my first question(s) ... finally... is about learning your limits:

How do I know it's time to go up? Should I be feeling something or do divers just incrementally go deeper until one day they wake up to their dive buddy slapping them in the face? Is there a correlation between what I feel on a dry static and would feel on a deeper dive, ie: is it safe (assuming I had a competent buddy) to go well into contractions in the water as I can easily do that an much more dry?

My second question, if it's not too much to ask, is regarding pre-dive/breathhold preparation. I seem to have some static sessions (don't know what my limits in the water are) that are way easier than others. Assuming the same physical and mental techniques are being used during the dive/breath-hold what are generally accepted as good preparations in the days and hours before the dive/breath-hold session? (eating, drinking, activity, ect).

I have many more questions, but I'll go with this for now and continue to browse the forums. Thanks for any help on the complex quesitons.

tyler

ps: anybody on Oahu want to go diving without having to kill everything in sight with spear?

 

[buddha]

Lot of questions to be answered but don´t be afraid to ask!
My first contribution is clear: ###Safety First###
You MUST found someone to go diving with and only then you can practice all the advices you are going to find here soon.

PS: How can you freedive alone on that awesome island man!!!

 

[Simos]

Dude I love it that you love Freediving so much but you MUST find a buddy. Otherwise it's an accident waiting to happen - it only takes one unpredictable situation... Having a buddy will help you be so much more relaxed too...

I personally think noone can give you answers to your questions - people have blacked out on the way down, on the way up, at the bottom you name it. People have felt 'not right', had contractions, and felt nothing unusual or any symptoms before blacking out.

You don't even dive to shallow depths - 30m is already well in the danger zone. I bet you that even the guys here that can dive to 100m would start feeling uneasy doing dives to 30m without a buddy.

Let alone everything else that can happen; get caught somewhere, get stung etc

Dive safe!!!!!!
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[Simos]

Also just really bear in mind that your limits are not always the same - each dive is different... And to find out what your limit is for the dive you are doing, you by definition have to black out (that's your limit) - without a buddy, this won't be very useful info!!!
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[cdavis]

Congratulations, you have quite a lot of natural ability. That is both good and bad. In my experience, divers who get contractions late (like you), or not at all, are much more likely to B0. Most of us have less tolerance for C02 and get a much stronger urge to breathe, earlier. You apparently don't and that can get you in fatal trouble.

What Simos said.

Find a buddy.

Connor

 

[Renejr83]

Alright enough with the "you need a buddy" I think we're beating a dead horse already. I think he gets idea, how about some the guys with ability and experience try answering the other questions as I'm interested in know also.
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[Kars]

How do I know it's time to go up? Should I be feeling something or do divers just incrementally go deeper until one day they wake up to their dive buddy slapping them in the face? Is there a correlation between what I feel on a dry static and would feel on a deeper dive, ie: is it safe (assuming I had a competent buddy) to go well into contractions in the water as I can easily do that an much more dry?

My second question, if it's not too much to ask, is regarding pre-dive/breathhold preparation. I seem to have some static sessions (don't know what my limits in the water are) that are way easier than others. Assuming the same physical and mental techniques are being used during the dive/breath-hold what are generally accepted as good preparations in the days and hours before the dive/breath-hold session? (eating, drinking, activity, ect).

I have many more questions, but I'll go with this for now and continue to browse the forums. Thanks for any help on the complex quesitons.

tyler

ps: anybody on Oahu want to go diving without having to kill everything in sight with spear?

How to feel where your limit is, is very much a gradual learning process, pushing yourself inch by inch. The safest environment is in statics where you can surface the easiest, the hardest environment is depth. A complication at depth is that due to the partial oxygen pressure you feel great, but when coming up you need to pay the piper,the oxygen debt. This is the known cause for shallow water Black Out. Like you've guessed there is no safe way to explore this on your own.

However what you can do is explore the limits on soft dry land.
Note that with experience the perceived discomfort changes, so it's not a static control marker. What some people experience at the very end before BO is getting tunnel vision. Others may have a trembling hand (samba like). Some use a counting game to check themselves, if they make a mistake they come up. Personally I find myself in the last part of the dive drifting away into 'a sleep'. It's difficult to make any conscious decisions in those last meters, I think it's for me a matter of self programming to come up at the right moment, just before or on the edge of samba. For me this took years to accomplish. I know of a few competition depth dives where I was able to turn at depth (before the plate) at the half way point and surface on the edge, indicating I estimated my exhaustion pretty good at depth. On the other hand things like hypothermia can seriously skew your sensations. You see that during your dives you use your buffers (spleen and more) and therefore your dive ability changes. That's one of the reasons I dive my competition dives without apnea warm-up, to have fresh buffers.

However there are things you can do in preparation to your diving session.

- Be rested
- Be hydrated
- Be warm and flexible
- Have an near empty belly with only easy to digest food, such as grains (bread etc.)
- Avoid mucus inducing ingredients
- Have a hot shower on the head to help clean up your sinuses and tubes
- Know your dive site, current, waves, animals, possible entry and exit points.
- Have good equipment, I recommend a dive buoy with some bottles of water - to stay hydrated - and a detachable line to your waist so boats can see you and you can rest on it when a cramp hits you. At the same time a 30m line would limit you, and you have the option to go up free immersion when the legs fail. If you dive with kelp, over hanging rocks than such a line attached is not recommended because of entanglement. Anchoring the buoy nearby is than better.
- A dive computer with dive time alarm also helps to alert you to go up in time.
- Let people know where you go, and when you're back.
- If you have the money you can buy the freediver rescue vest.
- Take brakes on land to rest, replenish and warm up.
- If you have a moment of panic, recognise and focus on what you can do, and do so in an efficient way.
- Never do more than 1 new thing at the time.
- Take enough rest in between dives, at least 3x the previous divetime.
- Breath slow and shallow from the belly. - Avoid hyperventilation.
- If you had a heavy or near samba dive, quit for that day, and analyse what went different and how to avoid it next time.

Well that's it for now, now I need some O2 to recover
I wish I was there to dive with you in the blue waters But for now the dark green brown black holes here must do.

 

[Renejr83]

Kars,
Great reply, I see u wrote "breathe slow and shallow from the belly" ...I understand 'slow' but why shallow? I've read breaths should be slightly deeper then a regular inspiration. Could you shed some light? Thx.
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[Kars]

I say shallow, to counter the tenancy to hyperventilate, so in practice it will be 'normal'.
Also breathing while moving muscles from full to empty uses more muscle power, uses more willpower, and thus it's more difficult to relax.

You can test this laying on your back, do easy belly breaths for a while and than revert to deep belly breaths. Which is more efficient and relaxing?

 

[Renejr83]

I see what you're saying. Ive noticed while pool training that its definitely more relaxing to take normal belly breaths as oppose to full on deep, diaphragmtic, thoracic respors. It makes sense now, thx.
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[Simos]

Alright enough with the "you need a buddy" I think we're beating a dead horse already.
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Well that's not true renejr83 - we're actually beating a living horse so that it doesn't end up being a dead horse

Kars has posted some great info as usual - but if you read his reply you'll realise that (as he points out) there is simply no safe way in the water to explore limits etc without a buddy and limits/feelings for BO are not the same from one dive to the other.

I have only one point that I disagree slightly with Kars (actually I am sure we agree but maybe needs a bit of clarification). This is on the point of having a dive computer with a dive alarm - IF you are using this as a last resort (say you are spear fishing and get carried away) then it might alarm you and 'wake you up' so that you can go up.

This is obviously good but I find that the only problem with this is that you will end up relying on the dive computer alarm instead of listening to your body and obviously since one dive is different than the next one, it doesn't mean that you'll always be able to make the same time. I can see the pros and cons to both approaches obviously - if it was just freediving I would say don't bother with the dive computer but spearfishing is a bit different and I don't know enough to say whether it's a good thing or a bad thing.

All I do know is that spearos are really stubborn when trying to catch a fish and an alarm might be a good kick in the butt sometimes to get them to give up and come up

 

[tinkersg]

Buddha, Simos, Connor- Thanks for the concern. Kars - thanks for taking the time to answer my questions. Very helpful stuff.

Can someone elaborate on some of warm-up stretches commonly used?

 

[Simos]

I am no expert tinkersg so would be interested as well to hear what more experienced freedivers have to say on this but it really depends what you want to do and how much time you have to stretch.

When I dive after a yoga session (1h:30min) I feel great - not only my whole body feels ready and relaxed, most importantly my mind is also ready and focused. Usually, if I just freedive without yoga it takes me a good 45-50 mins to get to a similar place in terms of mental focus.

I realise that it's not always possible to do yoga or a full stretching session before diving so I would recommend at least the following:

1. Diaphragm/Chest/Lung stretches - there's many techniques/stretches for these, many of them deriving from yoga. Some twists can be also helpful - some people also like using some moderate packing to prepare their lungs; you can also do a few full-lung holds instead of packing.

2. Back/chest/shoulder stretches - especially if you'll be monofinning, there's specific stretches you can do to prepare. It's really hard to explain but most of them involve stretching against a wall by kind of arching your back and opening your chest against the wall (sorry rubbish description). Also there are other stretches where you put your hands up above your head in 'diving' position and push against a door frame while you try to 'walk through' if that makes sense. Some cat stretches might not be a bad idea either and standard downward dog (sorry if these don't make sense).

3. Neck/Jaw stretching - often overlooked, I highly recommend these if you are doing depth as it really helps with equalisation.

There are obviously more areas that can benefit from stretching like ankles etc but the above should at least stretch the main areas... There's other things to consider e.g. if you are doing no fins, then obviously you need to stretch different muscles etc...

 

[Kars]

You're right about the alarm use Simon, good points! - Jep the computer is something of a last alarm in case you fall asleep between the fishes. It also helps to keep track of divetime, depth and intervals, which is also important. Though without the device you may be safer because you dive more conservative and pay more attention to your bodies feedback. But that feedback may fail too in some cases, like dehydration for example.

And I like to dive alone as well at times, but than I dive very conservative. My goal in such dives is to experience the silence, the relaxation, the flow. I do wear a computer, but I forget about numbers and depth, it's just loosing myself in the moment. Making extra long dives to great depths simply isn't so relaxing as making shallower ones using less than full air FRC dives. Thinkersg comes across to me a responsible adult, willing to learn and already knowing that a course is a valuable to kickstart and improve his enjoyment and safety. Let's give him some Karma so the universe supply him with a nice dive buddy!

Love, Courage and Water,

Kars

 

[tinkersg]

Simos- thanks for the stretching tips. I already practice yoga but never before diving (I didn't know if it was considered too much "work" for your body before diving), so I will definitely give it a try now.

Kars- Thanks for the karma. I appreciate your intuition on the matter. I'm not a reckless person, as you have derived. I do enjoy being down there alone in the silence (although this time of year in Hawaii I can almost always hear the whale's songs under 15ft), but I fully intend to find a competent buddy before I start feeling out my limits.

thanks for all the help everyone - what an awesome forum!

tyler

 

[Simos]

Hi Tyler - glad you are finding the info useful. One note on yoga - I never did full yoga sessions before any depth diving, depending on the type of yoga you might find that tiring indeed. I did do easy pool freediving sessions after a full yoga class and really enjoyed them as I was really relaxed.... But the rest of the stretches above should be ok to do before depth diving and I think most would agree that they're good practice. some people from our club always take their yoga mat even when we do open water dives and do a few rounds of sun salutations and some other yoga poses before diving...
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