Train alone or take a course?

[Combat Diver]

I have been diving for 8 years,but never really looked at freediving until recently.

I don't plan on trying to shatter any records,but would like to maximize the time of my holds, to supplement my Navy SEAL/Combat Diving training.I also think it could help me with Rescue swimming(especially if someone is trapped deep underwater.)

I currently can get near 1:30 and near 2 min if I push it but get a little light headed when I get near 2min.

The problem is I travel around a lot doing some form of Combat,Rescue,and Survival training or doing marathon runs and swims so my schedule doesn't really allow for me to take on any more courses and I am wondering if it would be possible to train this alone or should I wait and try to find a freediver instructor when I have more time?

I will have some time freed up in about 7 months where I could do this,but not sure if there is anyone in Michigan that I could train with.

I know it would be better to train with an experienced person(for technique and saftey reasons) but,I'll admit I am a little impatient to wait 7 months before I start doing some freediving conditioning.

any suggestions would be appreciated.

 

[MKDVR]

I have been diving for 8 years,but never really looked at freediving until recently.

I don't plan on trying to shatter any records,but would like to maximize the time of my holds, to supplement my Navy SEAL/Combat Diving training.I also think it could help me with Rescue swimming(especially if someone is trapped deep underwater.)

I currently can get near 1:30 and near 2 min if I push it but get a little light headed when I get near 2min.

The problem is I travel around a lot doing some form of Combat,Rescue,and Survival training or doing marathon runs and swims so my schedule doesn't really allow for me to take on any more courses and I am wondering if it would be possible to train this alone or should I wait and try to find a freediver instructor when I have more time?

I will have some time freed up in about 7 months where I could do this,but not sure if there is anyone in Michigan that I could train with.

I know it would be better to train with an experienced person(for technique and saftey reasons) but,I'll admit I am a little impatient to wait 7 months before I start doing some freediving conditioning.

any suggestions would be appreciated.

If nothing else you'll have a kick as pool to train in at the RTC.

 

[samdive]

Don't even think about training alone, light headedness is one thing, black out on your own in a pool, or even the bath and its all over pretty quickly.

Do a course if you can, if not at least find an experienced buddy to help you get started - check out the buddy page on this forum and see if there is anyone in your area

 

[fatboyjim]

the girl at the seal sanctuary said seals can hold their breath for a hour

 

[samdive]

wow.. what on earth were you doing at the seal sanctuary!!

 

[monofin_diva]

i used to work at the marine mammal care center we have here over in san pedro (i also used to work at the southern california marine institute)..

weddell seals can hold their breath at least an hour and can also dive to depths of about 600m or perhaps a bit more. they also exhale before a dive rather than diving on a lungful of air. it is also purported that weddell seals can hold their breath for up to 7 hours (if they can't break through the ice or whatever).. but that's unsubstantiated.

but back to the initial question.. i'm trying to increase my apnea times as well. i can do about 1:45 static and about a minute dynamic. it's hard to get training in because i don't really have anyone experienced to "spot" me. so trust me.. i feel your pain

 

[donmoore]

If training alone, you should do your statics dry (out of the water) and maybe dynamic walking. In the pool and you feel you absolutely need to practice dynamics, it should be just in form and technique with time less than ½ of walking dynamic time. For a beginner, one lap with a turn at the end and then surface is all you need. If the pool has a shallow end surface at that end so you can stand up.

Form and technique is very important and you do not need to come anywhere close to your limit to gain valuable improvement. You can tell when you are using less effort and still going the same distance.

When you are ready to push dynamics or statics (or just go above 50% of your ability) you need a competent spotter. Lifeguards are not competent Freedive spotters! They are trained to save people who drown from swallowing water, hyper ventilating, etc.. These people still have lots of oxygen stores in their tissues and blood. Freedivers use up these stores and don’t have time for a lifeguard to see them, decide if they really need their help, jump of their platform and swim to them.

In the case of dynamics a diver needs a spotter swimming at the surface over them so the spotter can pull them up in seconds. The spotter should have a swim board so they can hand it to the diver when he surfaces (hopefully on his own). Remember it takes 10 to 20 seconds from the time a person takes a breath to when the O2 reaches the brain, so for a person doing a breath hold, their lowest O2 at the brain happens after they take their first breath, which means their greatest danger of passing out is 10-20 seconds after surfacing. This is the reason the majority of black outs happen at the surface.

In statics the spotter should be right next to the diver and paying close attention. Most people (but not all) exhale when they pass out. Some times if their head is slightly tilted to the opposite side of the spotter, the spotter will miss the bubbles. This has happened to me twice!! Even though it’s not the rules anymore for AIDA, the spotter and the spotter should be signaling every 15 seconds when the diver is approaching their maximum time. No one should be passed out under the water for more than 15 seconds. The signaling usually consists of the spotter tapping on the back of the diver and telling him the time and the diver raising a finger. If the spotter doesn’t get a response or a doesn’t see it he should immediately tap and say “Signal!”. Fingers and variations should be agreed upon ahead of time.

When rescuing the first thing is to get the airways above the water. Then tell the person to breath. Sometimes a person will hear even though they are passed out and will respond. Remove the mask and blow on the face. If they are still out slap them a little and if needed pull them out of the pool and start CPR.

Monofin diva, if you’re doing a 1 minute dynamic (either wet or dry, but I hope not wet if you don’t have a spotter) then you still have some room to improve your static. Most people who can do 1 minute in dynamic are doing statics of 2:30 to 3:30 (rough guess). You are probably letting your mind get the best of you. In dynamic the movement keeps your mind occupied so you’re not having that problem. Try relaxing and zoning out as much as possible in your static. You have the ability already.

Combat Diver, Fondueset a deeper blue member lives in Michigan. Get in touch with him if you can. His member profile where you can pm or e-mail him is at [ame="http://forums.deeperblue.net/member.php?u=3323"]View Profile: Fondueset@@AMEPARAM@@View Profile: Fondueset</title>@@AMEPARAM@@Fondueset[/ame].
don

 

[monofin_diva]

thanks for the tip don! i was trying to figure out a way to work on my dynamic while out of the water. i'm going to try the walking, i wonder why that never occured to me before :duh

i know my problem seems to be while i'm swimming, although i need a breath i can go WAY longer before it feels uncomfortable if i'm swimming than when i'm just laying on my bed. i do precisely what you said. i take one lap u/w then make a turn.. swim back on the same breath and surface in the shallow.

i'd like to increase both times by 30seconds perhaps by this fall.. hopefully that's not too lofty of a goal. when i practice static i tend to use visualizations a lot. i know it sounds silly, but i just envision myself using every bit of oxygen in my cells. it helps me increase the time a bit that way. i try to picture my body breathing inwardly and using up the oxygen.

sometimes i have to remind myself when i'm underwater that even though i'm not ACTIVELY practicing on increasing my dynamic time i still need to pay attention to the possiblity of blacking out. i like to sometimes just cruise around in my pool and before i realize it i've been under for over a min.. then the urge the breathe just rushes on me very suddenly. so i usually surface rather than trying to extend that time while i'm alone


that was a very informative post don.. thanks

 

[Combat Diver]

Thanks for the advice everyone,I'll try and get a hold of Fondueset,he lives about an 1:30 away or so from me.


fatboyjim:LOL at first when you mentioned seals holding their breath for an hour+ I thought you meant a Navy SEAL haha.

I don't think i'd make a good SEAL if that was the case


If I do dryland apena exercises(and use a Powerlung) would it increase my hold time without me having to push it underwater and risk blackout?

Although It's always easier to have longer holds above water for me and the colder the water the shorter my hold time.I did about 2min+ easy in a hot jacuzzi,but could only do 1-1:30 average in cooler water(65-70F).

 

[cdavis]

Combat Diver,

I've done both a course and trained basicly alone. Don is right about training alone in the water, be very careful. Completely aside from the safety aspects, the course will teach you stuff that is almost impossible to learn on your own. That said, apnea walking, co2 tables, o2 tables all can improve your underwater hold time. Use the search function and you will find a huge amount of information.

Connor

 

[quasimoto]

elephant seals can do dives in excess of 5000 feet, and can be up to 18 feet long. Think about that, thats a friggin huge seal that i would not want to have pissed at me

 

[Combat Diver]

A walrus can be pretty nasty too.

I wouldn't want any large sea mammal pissed at me lol

sharks don't bother me,except a Bull Shark...I have swam in great white infested waters no problem but won't go near bull shark territory.Not unless I have some heavy artiliary with me haha

 

[monofin_diva]

that grouper story i read in one of the other threads was pretty intense. it even snatched that guys diving gear off and he had to surface.

the killer (no pun intended) is that it's not even a story that you can tell anyone without getting laughed at. it's not like you got attacked by a shark and say you survived..naaah..this is a huge grouper!

can you get bragging rights after being attacked by a grouper? i guess i'd rather get attacked by a grouper than an elephant seal. i've seen them before when i worked at the mammal care center. we got a lot of elephant seal pups that are damaged from getting rolled over on by a big bull male.

 

[deepdive]

Hi, all,

Back to the topic: Train alone or take a course. In my case it is difficult to take a course. I use freedive techniques for my underwater projects, but all freedive courses are based at typical disciplines - and not for my underwater projects. In the beginning I was a member of AIDA Netherlands, but now I train myself.

In that case I can say I train alone. Sure, I follow every new technique and I translate it for my projects, but I tried it out without instructor. There is no instructor who understand my way of freediving...

Kitty.

 

[monofin_diva]

KITTY!!!.. :wave

welcome to the forum.. you're my memaid heroine.. i admire you so much.. you don't even know.

 

[deepdive]

Hi,

Yes, I registrated here a few years ago under my old name (before my transformation), but I never post something. Nice to meet you here, monofin diva! I really appreciate it that you admire me...

Oh, yeah - to prevent misunderstanding: training alone means in my case training without instructor, not without a buddy.

Kitty.