Weight issues! (Spearfishing)

[tam154]

Weight issues!

Hi there, help, was wondering if anyone could give me an insight to rough weight needed - starting to think that something is not quite right!

I have just bought a new Omer mimetic 5mm wetsuit which is great but the amount of weight I need to keep neutral boyancy at up to 5 metres is more than what I took down today - 12kilo's! (26.5 pounds apparently according to the converter - am English)

My other 3mm shortie is now too cold for the Med around Italy but neutral boyancy was with 4-5 kilos.
The areas I dive are only around 5 metres but is going to more than 12 kilo's on a weight belt normal????? I am starting to think that I am going to need to take a forklift to the beach with me for my equipment......

Cheers....

PS I am only around 75 Kilos (11 stone, 165 pounds or 0.075 of a tonne)!!!!!

 

[hudasmt]

Wow i thought i was the heavy one in the same depth, im using 16 lbs to be neutral at 4 meters with a 3.5 mm wetsuit. Them i'm negative after 4.5 meters. I too have the same problem in carrying my gears. I bought a bag with the wheels but the wheels is not as good in sand so i end up carrying it also. Now I bought a mountaineering bag with good back paddings and its much more comfortable carrying the weights and gears. Try reducing the weight by 4 lbs at a time and increasing it by 2 lbs. I used to carry 20 pounds of weight. Just carry at least 2 lbs extra just in case a change in buoyancy occurs. I'm not an expert for these but with my experience, this is my formula. its a short process but a pain in the ass of changing weight for i'm doing shore dive. Im out about 500 meters out so for me to change weight,you can just imagine if you dont have a weight formula. I hope that helps, just try lighter weight from where you at now then take it from there if you can still go lighter than heavier.

 

[scottwilson]

It took me a while to figure the right amount of weight to use. Im lucky enough to live in an area where scuba divers train so im always finding lead weights left behind by them roflrofl



I took what I thought was the right amount of weight with me on my belt and then loose weights. Found a good sandy spot with the right depth (5-8 meters) and just held the weights in my left hand until I was comfortable at those depths. then added them to the belt later when I got out the water .it worked out to be around 40lb ( im a big chap)

I carry my weight belt like an ammo belt ( see pic) and then hold the rest of my gear in my hands. its the most comfortable for me so im happy

 

[spaghetti]

Tam, I'm 75 kilograms too (5'11" tall) and use only 8 kilograms for shallow dives with a 5mm wetsuit. I don't know how much experience you have but maybe it's just a problem of technique? Try to start your dive with a "duck dive" movement, very vertical or oblique, letting the weight push you down, then turn to a horizontal position when approaching the bottom, grab a rock or a weed with your free hand and wait a couple of seconds with your muscles all relaxed. Tell me if this might work?
However 12 kg all on your belt (or even 8kg) will kill your lower back. Get a weightvest (it will be a great investment!) and fraction the weight: 5 kilograms at the belt and 3 or 4 on the vest, to be worn on your upper back. I also use 500 grams each ankleweights sometimes, it helps a bit too.

 

[azapa]

a new suit will require about 20% more weight than an equivalent old one (lets say a year old). as it compresses, you'll get gradually colder, and need less lead.

lung size has a lot to do with things. Although its probably too much to experiment now, try to inhale just a little less on very shallow dives. Practice only well accompanied as the "oh dear i'm sinking" feeling is not nice if you mess up.

I weigh 68Kg and need about 10Kg to be neutral at your depths (5M) in an old 7mm suit on a full inhale. back pain!

PD. full agreement with Spago, a bad duckdive and you've messed up the dive before you have started. Bend at the middle, head down, raise the one (or both) legs, the weight of the legs should start to sink you. take a full deep pull (breast stroke style) with your free hand, place hand on nose and tuck elbow in. I extend the gun/arm out over head. Once two fins are bellow surface take slow powerfull strokes, not too wide.

 

[blueface]

I guess I'm not the only one with weight issues. Without a wetsuit and about 6 lbs. I sink like a rock just past 15 ft. or about 5 meters.

With a 3 mil. (2 pc. farmer John) I use 12 pounds and I'm super bouyant from 8 meters or 24 ft. You might say there is nothing wrong with that but the problem is when shallow diving to spear dolphin near the surface, I cannot inhale at all! If I want to stay at 5 meters and hover I must exhale dive. Any suggestions? should I just work on exhale dives? or add weight?

I already have 12 pounds on and I'd hate to add more. 12 is great for diving deep and laying on the bottom. Coming up is easy. It seems my wetsuit can float an anchor!

 

[tam154]

Hey guys, Thanks all of you for the info.

I have quite a bit of experience freediving and diving and never had this problem before so unless I am losing my technique - grabbing hold of rocks and weed to keep you on the bottom is not my normal technique, but it has its advantages as the fish are stopping to look at the prat that is trying to spear them!!!

I think I have come up with a couple of things that may be the reason, as 12kilo's of weight I am sure is far too much weight to take down for my body mass (and if I get nearer 10 metres then I may drop like a rock! - dont worry though I wont be doing this with anyway near this much weight on!) - which one do you reckon?

- I am just a very boyant person...
- The wetsuit has air trapped in it, which is keeping me more boyant than usual.
- The Ionian / Med is very salty this time of year
- This could be the weight needed for me and there is nothing wrong with 12kilo's

Like the weight vest idea and I am glad that someone else is using a fair amount of weight as well!

PS Have decided scrap the forklift idea and go with a Donkey as I am told they are better over sand...

Cheers

 

[Old Man Dave]

Most shallow water UK divers use a fair bit of lead. We mostly use 5mm suits with long johns and seldom pass 8 or 9 metres. Many other parts of the world especially the Med and the tropics have deep divers (to 30 metres) and thin suits, so they need less weight.

I use 21lb for general UK diving with a 5mm long john suit and have neutral bouyancy around 7 metres. In the shallows I add another 1 or 2 lb by using ankle weights which apart from the extra weight give you a better posture for shallow water work.

Most divers reduce their weight with experience. Something about your breath hold and general performance seems to mean you need less lead on year 2 than when you're a novice. Not a lot but a bit.

Spaghetti is spot on as usual with his comments. After using a nylon weight belt of 20 - 25lb of "H" weights for years, I now use 14lb of comfy bullet weights on a rubber belt and 7lb of lead plates in a comfy neoprene weight vest plus 2 off 1lb ankle weights worn over my socks but tucked under the bottoms of the legs of my long johns. What a difference this makes, especially to an old back like mine.

Dave

 

[flying_spanner]

Hey there guys, I'm just on 6 foot tall and 65kg heavy, I wear around 8kg's of weight on a 4.5mm suit.

I am positively boyant from around 7m and shallower.

Diving in 5m of water is just blody hard work for me as I just end up fighting my boyancy. I prefer to dive deeper and am quite comfortable in 12-17m. I just start to become negatively boyant, (start sinking) around 13m.

The reason I dive weighted like this is so if the worst were to happen and I suffer a Shallow Water Blackout on my way up, I should float to the surface. After all the greater pressure differential of that last 10m is the most dangerous.

The negative to being weightesd like this is I need good "duck dive" technique in order to be able to be on my way to the bottom.

But I'd much rather play it safe and work on my technique than the other alternative.

Just my five cents

 

[blueface]

Very interesting. I just recently increased weight to avoid having to fight to get past the positive bouyancy barrier. It's okay but I also started blue water hunting and the targets are shallow so sometimes I must exhale to get down and hover. I could stay longer if I was neutral at about 7 or 8 meters on a 25% inhale. I don't like carrying too much weight either way. I guess I do need to work on my "duck dive" so I can get down better.

Sometimes I get a good one and my descent is quicker according to my D-3. I heard that a good rate is 1 meter per second. For me that's full blast! Can you tell me if 1 meter per 1 second is realistic if I'm just spearfishing in 20 to 30 meters?

 

[azapa]

lung volume is a big player here that is hard to factor in using the size/weight/suit thickness ratios.

Spanner: we are about the same size and weight, depths too. I also use the same weighting criteria but it is tiring leaving the surface. I'll bet your lung volume is around 7 to 7.5 Litres (VC, non packed). I use a oldish (compressed) 7mm that probably floats like a new 5mm now. Try to do a 3/4 inhale on shallower dives. There is very little penalty on the Dive and recovery times are shorter.

 

[azapa]

Sometimes I get a good one and my descent is quicker according to my D-3. I heard that a good rate is 1 meter per second. For me that's full blast! Can you tell me if 1 meter per 1 second is realistic if I'm just spearfishing in 20 to 30 meters?

I am always slower than that. see attached from last weekend. 20M takes me about 30 seconds and I'm not hanging around.

 

[blueface]

Awesome! I really need to get the plug in so I can see my dives on a graph like that. My descent speed is about the same and so is my ascent. I'll experiment with 75% breath hold to see if it helps. With 10 lbs. and a 2-pc. 3 mil I have to kickto 30 feet. I weigh about 200 pounds.

 

[Mr. X]

Hi Tam, I'll be controversial and go out on a limb and say I think you are probably carrying to much weight. I am considerably larger than you and carry just 22lb, all on the belt, after a couple of years of tweaking. I could probably add an extra 2lb if I wanted to nail myself to the bottom but this feels pretty good to me diving in water 1 - 8m deep.

There are a lot of variables, not least how deep do you plan to dive? Less weight needed at greater depths. More weight needed for shallow dives. Things like body composition (how much buoyant fat you carry), hydration level and the amount of air your retain in your body/suit during your tests. It can vary from day to day. The salinity of the water (you'll be more buoyant in saltier water). Also, your suit will gradually become less buoyant with use.

I think it's safer to start a bit light and gradually add weight over time. If you are having real problems and dive deep, perhaps a supplemental pendulum weight attached to your float-line and carried in your hand or hooked to your belt for the upper part of the dive and released lower down might be worth considering? I don't dive that deep though.

 

[spaghetti]

I am considerably larger than you

Put this way, it makes me think of...but I know it's not like...

 

[hudasmt]

^^^roflroflrofl

Nice one spag!!!

 

[flying_spanner]

lung volume is a big player here that is hard to factor in using the size/weight/suit thickness ratios.

Spanner: we are about the same size and weight, depths too. I also use the same weighting criteria but it is tiring leaving the surface. I'll bet your lung volume is around 7 to 7.5 Litres (VC, non packed).

Pretty close, just over 8 litres I believe.

 

[Mr. X]

Put this way, it makes me think of...but I know it's not like...

Feels like it too sometimes