Yet another post asking for wetsuit advice...

[smellsfishy]

Hey guys and gals !

I'm hoping you can help me narrow down some choices for a new wetsuit.

I'm a freediver and a spearfisherman in the Northeast. I currently dive with a 5mm Picasso apnos wetsuit that is old and has seen better days. I freedive primarily in a quarry in Pennsylvania and spearfish in the ocean in NY and NJ along rocks and mussel beds.

At the quarry I dive in temps from about a low of 55 surface temp to about 75. At the bottom of the Quarry it can get down to the upper 30's low 40's depending on the season. The apnos seemed to do well in that range but got cold after an hour or so in the lower end of the range

Last season I dove when it was 50 degrees and only lasted about 20 minutes. I was way too cold, one of the problems was the fact that I didn't wear socks with my fins. I've since ordered a pair of fins and socks so that should help this year. But I would like a nice warm suit to be able to have the option of diving earlier in the season.

That said, I was checking out the options online and reading deepblue and I'm quite confused with all the options.

Here's what I would like:

- Nice warm suit (I tend to be on the cold side)
- Easier to put on (no lube ?) (Coating ?)
- Not fragile (I spearfish along the rocks)
- Not too expensive

So it would seem that Scubastore has some really cheap suits. As low as $139. Can anybody tell me about the materials used in the Cressi apnea / world comp / tecnica suits ? Are they good suits ?

Everybody swears by Elios so I want to price that out as well. If I go with a custom from Elios what should I get ? Heiwa / Yamamoto, Linings ? Exterior ? Seals ?

Do linings really eliminate the need for lube ? Do they compromise the warmth of the suit ? Should I just forget my dream of a lubeless entry ?

Does anybody know what materials are used in the Picasso Apnos ? (which doesn't seem to exist anymore)

Thanks in advance !

 

[spaghetti]

So many detailed questions! (and I'm busy at work with the boss lurking around).
My advice is: get a combo. Stick with a 5 millimeters PLUS, for the coldest days, buy a neoprene bermuda shorts and and a 2 mm undersuit ( a neoprene shirt you wear under the jacket).
The best compromise for warmth and durability in rocky bottoms is a wetsuit with open cell inside and a stretchy nylon coating outside. You'll have to slighlty lube it for putting on an open cell inside, but it's the type of suit that will keep you warmer than anyone else.
There will come some of the coldest days in which the 5 millimeters won't be enough to stay warm for long. In tis case, wear the undersuit shirt under the jacket and the bermuda short over the trousers. This will give you an additional thickness and close the way-in's to cold water.
I recommend the 5 mm + bermuda + shirt "combo" better than a ready made 7mm suit, that will be way too thick for spring and summer.

 

[foxfish]

Smellsfishy, you need to read this thread http://forums.deeperblue.com/wetsuits/80555-question-about-lined-suits.html

 

[smellsfishy]

Foxfish I read that thread before posting. It got me more confused

Spaghetti, thanks I hadn't thought of layering. I'm definitely going to look into that. But I'm still stuck on what suit to buy.

I think it would definitely help to know what neoprene my picasso suit has.

Also, anybody here used both an open cell and a coated inside ? I want to get a handle on the difference there.

thanks again !

 

[nz676]

if you go to the elios site they have a form you fill out in what you want need warmth,comfort,flexibility,durability ,price in a suit fill it out and probably within a few days took them 2 for me they will send you a email with multiple design choices and even give great advice based on the questions you ask the suits in general are 163-200 plus euro

 

[foxfish]

Foxfish I read that thread before posting. It got me more confused
!

Yes well I can understand that
OMD bought a nylon lined custom suit from diveskin but we are still in the depths of winter so he has not given the suit a proper test as yet. (no vis rough sea etc)
I think my next suit will be a lined suit as well, I like the idea of extra robustness & ease of putting the suit on without lube.

 

[smellsfishy]

Thanks NZ, I'm going to post to Elios as soon as I have somebody take my measurements.

Foxfish I'm wary of the nylon lined suit as I get quite cold and most people swear by the open cell. That's why I think I want to try the coatings. I'm leaning in that direction now....

Thanks for your help guys

 

[Mr. X]

A 5mm Elios Ecoline suit would meet all of your requirements except the lube one - you'd definitely need lube (or sea water or talc) to get it on. However, I suspect that will be the case with a most/all coatings too. A nylon lined suit would not normally need lube but then you'd loose the warmth of open-cell against your skin.

Why not use lube though? I've been using a big bottle of Tesco Apple shampoo price about 45p for several years, smells great & hair is shiney afterwards. I dilute it a lot and so don't use much. However, I plan to look for something with less chemicals this year.

BTW Take measurements on both sides of your body for arms, legs, wrists, etc. -- they can vary a lot. Also, consider taking each measurement several times (e.g. 3x) at different times of the day/temperatures, and then average them after discarding any way out measurements. Follow the Elios instructions exactly, don't try to second guess them, and you should be pleased with the results. Be careful round the neck - it mustn't be too tight as that can force some kind of choking reflex (or so a SCUBA instructor once told me). I found the beaver tail a tad short, perhaps it is meant to be that way, so take care measuring length too. That all said, I was amazed at how good a fit mine was and is.

 

[smellsfishy]

Thanks for the advice Mr X.

If at the end of the day I have to use lube, I'll be ok with it. But it's a bit of a hassle and if I can eliminate it with a coating and not really compromise warmth then why not ?

 

[peacenluv]

fyi, elios informed me about new Stone Yamamoto 45 exclusive to them and i asked:

For the Stone Yama45, what is the difference between the open cell inside and gold coating inside? Is the gold coating warmer?

Their reply:
Hi,
The Gold coating is very very slippery to get into (without lubes) and it's warmth like the open cell.
Wait your news..

I currently have the elios red yamamoto 45 open cell inside and the heiwa medium density greyish coating inside and the yamamoto is a bit warmer than the heiwa. and need to lube to get into both, though easier to get into the greyish heiwa coating for sure..

but am curious about the yamamoto gold coating.. as warm as open cell? no lube to get into? hmmm... anyone tried it before?