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benefits of "apnea suit" over traditional wetsuit for diving in 72 degree water

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spike

New Member
Jun 11, 2004
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I agrea you can definately train for the cold. When I was in the military we regularly did ocean training for hours on end in the middle of winter. Initially we had alot of hypothermic cases however over time the decreased and we all "adapted" to the new paradigm.
I still find now I'm quite resistent to cold however my hands especially get cold easily these days. Maybe some weird side effect of adaptaion that decreases circulation at the slightest cold? it is anoying to say the least.

I'm pretty new to this forum and wow, every new thread I look at takes hours to digest.. I'm very interested in some of this yoga stuff as I've never heard of it over here. We seem restricted to more mainstream yoga's.

cheers!
 

Erik

Well-Known Member
Jan 21, 2001
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Welcome to a good forum Spike. My hands get cold fast too, and that's what'll send me out of the water.
A good example of cold adaptation is the Ama divers of Japan/Korea. They use wetsuits now, but for many years they didn't: they still spent 6 hours in cold water every day.
Cheers,
Erik Y.
 

shaneshac

FIN TRASHER
Oct 8, 2002
1,874
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HEHEHHEE Erik

Is that why there eyes are like that?

Cringing their face from the intense cold :D
 

efattah

Well-Known Member
Mar 2, 2001
3,294
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Anyone who wants to awaken kundalini should read the book 'Kundalini Tantra' by Satyananda Saraswati, available from amazon.com. I have read many kundalini books, and this presents by far the safest and most complete method. Don't skip steps or you may end up in an insane asylum (or worse).

Once you have awakened kundalini, then (and only then) does the tummo technique work (or so I've read). The tummo technique is described in many books, but most omit the fact that the exercises will have no effect unless kundalini is already awakened. One book which describes the tummo technique is 'Occult Tibet' by J.H. Brennan.


Eric Fattah
BC, Canada
 

Erik

Well-Known Member
Jan 21, 2001
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Originally posted by shaneshac
HEHEHHEE Erik
Is that why there eyes are like that?
Cringing their face from the intense cold :D

Yikes...Shaca you're going to get into trouble! I'm going to tell my Indonesian wife that you said that
:D
Cheers,
Erik Y.
 

shaneshac

FIN TRASHER
Oct 8, 2002
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Hey Guys,

Whoever gave me some negative Karma for coming up with a theory why Asians eyes are like that, can stuff it.

If you can give me the real reason why they are like that i will take my comment back.

I don't think that stating an typical asian trait is going to offend anyone!

I live in a multi-racial community and I myself am offended that someone will consider me a racist for making a funny suggestion.

Sign your name on the Karma message and I will not have to bore the rest of the DB members with my crap.
 
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Pablo

Breather... so far!
Mar 9, 2004
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Originally posted by Jon


One thing I have played around with on cold nights in Wisconsin is to simply do a couple of breath holds to contractions to warm when I am cold- it works! Not as much fun as shared body warmth, but it still does the trick.;)

Jon

Jon:

I do the same, but stop just before the contractions and still get the warm effect. But since I don't have contractions I'm wondering where from came the heat?
The same with pranayama exercises... my metabolism seem relatively constant, or even decrease, but exothermia get me boiling rapidly. Most of the times my hands/feet stay cold and the warmth seem to be "inside" and towards the head... even after a moderate session of empty lungs with plenty of contractions.


Shaca:

One of the good thinks about you is that we never get bored... ;)

Got once the same reaction at a racial comment, but after PM he end up on good karma! I found polite and fair to sign karma, negative or positive...


efattah:

He may be too late for the asylum... but I will try the book!

Are you Kundalini awakened?
 

cdavis

Well-Known Member
Jan 21, 2003
4,009
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Warmer when freediving??????

Jon,

This differs a little from my experiance and I am curious. Do you have a theory on why you stay warmer freediving?

Connor
 

Pablo

Breather... so far!
Mar 9, 2004
347
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I too get warmer when freediving

Lower bottom times where the water is colder.

The overall energy expense is, on my case, higher during freediving: I swim more, faster and use more muscle groups. When diving my vertical moves are passive (vest, lung volume), and all the rest of necessary movements are slow to spare air. Using the current you could do a good dive with out make any real movement...

The air coming out the tank is cold and dry... but the bubbles warm and humid!

I'm not sure if the blood shift could be a factor??? maybe the freediver looses less heat...

Just look at the general body shape of freedivers in relation to the divers... you can see who spend more energy!!!

I don't see much divers at the moment... the water must be too cold for them :D :D
 

ramstam

New Member
May 9, 2003
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I think eric has it right, i'm not mr iceman or anything but i
am always the last person to be cold and if it's over 70F
in the house i start to sweat. my normal body temp is 96.7,
i threw away several therometers before figuring out it's me.
strange stuff.
 

portinfer

Aquatic shopper...
Jul 3, 2003
1,327
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Eric - do you or have you practiced Kundalini excercises ? I know you have read the books but I was just curious like Pablo as to whether you have put the ideas into practice and how far you had got.

I have only read the very basic generalisations about Kundalini - maybe you could explain why it is dangerous. The asylum reference sounds scary - I thought yoga was meant to be safe and body/mind balancing - is Kundalini an exotic branch of a type of yoga ?

Shane - if you were Kundalini awakened you might have to watch the magnetic attraction to your head from metal things - be careful with all those spear shafts you have, eh.

Cheers
Ed
 
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Erik

Well-Known Member
Jan 21, 2001
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Originally posted by shaneshac
Whoever gave me some negative Karma for coming up with a theory why Asians eyes are like that, can stuff it.
If you can give me the real reason why they are like that i will take my comment back.

Lighten up on Shaca people. My stepfather is Chinese, I have twin half-brothers that are half Chinese, and my wife is Indonesian. I make jokes about driving and getting on and off escalators all the time.
My theory about the difference in the eyes is that it comes from being a Northern race, where the sun is very low on the horizon. The Inuit up here in Northern Canada share the same feature as the Koreans, Siberians, etc. You can even see it in some of the Northern European people too. I've dated a few Irish girls that looked half Asian, but weren't. If you have never found yourself on a bright winter day in Canada with snow on the ground, I assure you that your eyes will squint to the point where they are almost closed. So, it's just Darwinian really.
"This is my theory, my theory about Brontosauruses, which is mine, and is mine too. Mhhmm.....All Brontosauruses are very, very small at one end, much, MUCH bigger in the middle, and then smaller again at the other end." - the first person to name that quote gets some FREE KARMA! (signed as always)
Cheers,
Erik Y.
 
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Alun

Well-Known Member
Oct 5, 2001
763
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ooh! i think i know this one....!!!
is it from Monty Python? i can imagine Michael Palin saying something like that!
 
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DeepThought

Freediving Sloth
Sep 8, 2002
2,334
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ARRGH!
(db loads slowly on my computer today for some reason)
I was about to say monthy python as well.

But Alun deserves the big prize anyway, since I googled for it.
(cheating? :ycard, I promise I would've mentioned it)
Though I love them, I don't rmemeber that sketch (which rules out a few of their movies which I remember by heart).

Anyway, nice theory about the eyes, sounds plausable...
Or maybe it is because they live in the east, which is where the sun rises.... :duh
 
Last edited:
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unirdna

tropical wuss
Sep 16, 2002
1,016
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rofl

Yes, I believe that was Mrs. Ann Elk, who said that. Wow, had to reach deep in the 'archives' to find that one.

And don't sweat the karma thing shane. If you'll notice, you had 2 blue thingys. Then I gave you a pos hit - that would overwhelm all neg karma and set you spiraling towards the land of three :D
 

bevan dewar

Well-Known Member
Sep 26, 2001
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i'm interested in donmoore's question, that kirk krack told him a high fat diet is to be avoided. anyone got an opinion on this?

would that be saturated fats as opposed to unsaturated? but eric recomends EFA's and coconut, one being unsaturated and the other very saturaterd?

the reason i ask is that i tried diving today without a suit. very pleasent indeed. but i got cold after 10 minutes(in 24 degree water). so i'm thinking i need more fat.
cheers
bevan
 

Jon

Dairyland diver
Supporter
Apr 7, 2001
4,080
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Bevan,

I remember Kirk saying the same thing whne I took the clinic. I think that it'd even mentioned in the IANTD advanced freediving book, but I'd have to double check that.

I also believe that it involved saturated fats. I know that in the summer time Ihave nothing but Gatorade before a day of freediving, bu eat like a horse when I'm done. In the winter time, especially when ice diving, eat a good breakfast so that I can stay warm in the cold water.

As far as staying wamer while freediving, that is due to a few different things.

First, we stay above the thermcolice while doing our breath-ups when freediving. That means I cn recover in 70 degree water before I plung back down into 40 degree water for a minute or two. Being able to rewamr my self in that wamr water makes a huge difference.

Second, my suit is only compressed for that minute or two while I'm under, but goest back to it's full thickness while a do my surface interval. In scuba diving your at max depth all the time and your suit is compressed the whole while your under- unless you wear a membrane drysuit.

Third, I move more when freedivng as compared to scuba. If I really need to cover a large distance while on scuba I use a scooter, which really cools you down as was mentioned in a previous post.

The dry compressed air does take it's toll on you as your body must moisten and heat every breath- although this is not the case when diving a rebreather, but all of the other conditions still apply.

Whenever I start to chill all I need to do is swim a little ways on the surface to warm up- this is especially true if using my arms. When scuba diving, espeacially during deco, there's no real chance to suddenly start swimming real hard to warm up unless you want to suk your tank down really quickly- again, not as much of a problem with certain kinds of rebreathers.

In the end I have ended up using my 3mm suits much more often than I would have thought possible given the climate in which I live. I also find my new Elios suits to be so warm that I wish I would have opted for a 5mm suit as a winter suit instead of a 6mm. It should be really interesting to see how much longer I keep outlasting Ted with my new suit compared to his Picasso Commercial come next winter.;)

Jon
 

ruddyduck

New Member
Mar 24, 2003
30
3
0
What a thread!
111- my free advice is get the best suit you can afford, and get it soon so you can stay in the water longer. My next suit will be hooded, but for now I use a 3/2 surfsuit from a sale at the local sports discount store. I really just need it 3 months of the year on the Texas coast, but I use it in fresh water year round. I'm a lot more comfy with a suit up to about 85 degrees F, plus the bouyancy is a safety factor for those of us who sink. In the winter I add gloves,bootys, and a 7mm hood over my bald head, and in the summer a 1mm beanie keeps the sun off my delecate pate. It's a draggy outfit compared to a good apnea suit, but it keeps me in the water longer than without ! And it's sturdy enough for surfing and wade fishing.

Eric- You sure can get conditioned to cold , but I prefer to equip for it as well. I used to coon oysters in 55 F water up to my chest for hours on end wearing jeans and long johns without much problem, but it really wore me out by the end of the day. Back then I was much more tolorant of cold than folks who avoided cold water.All that energy to keep you warm has to come from somewhere, even the electrical kundalini stuff in your gut. Cold water stimulates the diver reflex, but you still have to keep your core warm.

Shaca- another theory about the evolution of asian eye folds : they are an adaptation to the loess dust of the northern plains of the ice age.

Fat eaters- I eat a lot of fat, especially before diving. Animal fat is my favorite, but olive oil and tropical nut fat will work, too. Slurping down heavy cream doesn't seem to clog my throat like milk does, and it's my favorite enrgy drink. Fat seems to give me a consistently high level of energy and warmth. However, mixing fat and carbohydrates seems to make me sluggish and cold. Those of you who avoid fat may do better just loading carbs and staying away from grease.

Ruddyduck
 

ramstam

New Member
May 9, 2003
227
11
0
I like a 5mm hooded vest under whatever wetsuit I wear
7mm or 3/2. Helps to keep the unchin spines out of my face.
 

The111

Shallow Water Whiteout
May 29, 2004
155
29
118
Originally posted by ramstam
I like a 5mm hooded vest under whatever wetsuit I wear
7mm or 3/2. Helps to keep the unchin spines out of my face.

Do they make normal (i.e. not "open cell") hooded vests? I can't stand having that open cell stuff touch my hair and face, it has too much friction...
 
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