Diving with epilepsy

[Phil Mc]

Hello everyone!
I am new to freediving (and this forum.)
I am very keen to freedive and have been practicing static apnea for past 6 months. I have tried to join a freediving course/club, but because of my epilepsy (although very well controlled, last fit was 4 years ago) the club or trainer seem unsure and tell me they dont want to risk it. My doctor is the same. Has no knowledge therefor does not want anything to do with it.
It seems like im at a dead end.
I just want to learn to freedive with others!

So, im basically asking...Is there any way i can dive? Does anyone out there dive with epilepsy or know people with experience or have knowledge on health issues such as this?
Any info would be so helpful.

Much appreciated,
A keen learner,
Phil

 

[Apneaddict]

If you live in a litigious country and the organization makes you sign a medical questionnaire... You may be SOL, if you answer honestly.

I think pool freediving with VERY CLOSE supervision would be much safer than depth diving.

The problem, is that no one can stop you from going out to open water with a buddy and dive... but it is much more dangerous if something should happen at depth and out at depth.

Hopefully someone with more relevant, direct experience will chime in.

All the best and hope things work out for you!

 

[Phil Mc]

Thank you for quick response apneaddict.
Yeh ive been told to stick to pools. the problem is, i have nobody to dive with out in the ocean, the only way i can do tht is by joining a club, which i am not allowed

Hopefully my luck will turn.
Thanks again mate

 

[tuekappel]

My initial thought on this was: What's the difference between a deep BO and an epileptic seizure? Competitive freedivers risk BO's quite often, in training and competition. Therefore the extensive safety measures; lanyard, Counter-Ballast System, etc.

In other words, what's the absolute worst-case scenario for an epileptic seizure under water?

And then, when i get to think about it, it gets a bit more scary. As you probably know, a freedivers underwater BO is in its near-worst case easily treatable with surface resuscitation; "blow-tap-talk", etc. That is primarily because no water has entered the lungs during the BO, due to reflexes keeping mouth and larynx shut. (please, someone with better knowledge of this, feel free to correct me.) So far, so good. But what about a seizure?
I know nothing of epilepsy, but can you assure me, that an epilepsic seizure under water doesn't involve you opening your mouth and inhaling water?

Remember, that safety measures are there not only for your sake, the freediver. They are also there to protect your buddies against risking their own lives trying to rescue you from depth, performing rescutation in open sea, etc.

I hear you assuring everybody that it's been 4 years since your last seizure. Good for you. Do you drive a car? Why not? If you think it's safe to freedive, why not safe to drive a car?

The potential damage you can do to yourself and others, while freediving with epilepsy, is equal to the one you can do with a car, therefore i would never dive with you. Even if they took all liability upon them.

 

[Phil Mc]

Hi tuekappel.
Thank you for replying.
Yes i do drive. Its strange that a doctor can tell me im ok to drive on a busy highway whenever i want, but is unsure about letting me dive now and again.
I totaly understand the reasons you mention. Its a risk. I understand. The possibility of a seizure in deep water would result in certain death.
I just wanted an explination. Controlled epileptic or free of epilepsy, that person is at risk. Like i say, i drive a car. No one who rides with me feels unsafe or questions it.
Is there evidence of increased risk of seizure in deep water?
I dont know

 

[FreeDivingJake]

I don't know anything about epilepsy, what triggers a seizure, and I certainly know nothing about the safety of an epilepsy/freediving combo. Personally, I'm not really afraid of blacking out as I have competent buddies and the safety systems put in place leave me free to push myself a little bit. But, most of us have all these systems put in place so we don't black out. We dive a certain way and know our limits. Black outs can be prevented, but, can seizures? What if something triggers a seizure at 25 0r 30 meters (or any depth)? Is that certain death? I just feel that this subject is extremely unexplored and there's probably not a doctor out there that can give you a definitive answer as to whether it's safe or not. Diving with the chance of a seizure is a lot of pressure to put on a buddy, because chances are they won't have any clue what to do. Most of us know standard black out rescue. Put them on their back, put their mask on the forehead, tap on their face, blow on them and say their name (correct me if that's not right). But you can't really do anything for someone having a seizure but let it run it's course, right? So if that's underwater it just sound like a disaster. Keep asking around and see what you can find. I wish you the best of luck, but remember, freediving isn't worth your life.

Jake

 

[leolutz]

Hi!

What triggers your seizure? Stress, bright lights?
Black outs are actually the opposites of seizures. I'm not a free driver but oxygen deprivation can cause the brain to "pause and sleep". In most seizures however, there is an over-abundance of signals hence some involuntary jerking of muscles, loss of consciousness etc.

What kind of seizures do you suffer from? Have you explained to your doctors the relaxation and yoga practiced by freedivers which can potentially help seizure? Did your doctors tell you reasons why you have seizures (imbalance, tumor/mass)? What kind of seizure is it?

This could be a great discussion but I would personally not risk it unless there is a full understanding of the nature of your case.

 

[creg]

Hi Phil mc, I am new to the forum also but your question got my attention.
I have known persons with epilepsy and they all seems to know when it's about to occur, is it the same with you?
And if it is, what's the time span between knowing it's about to occur and it actually occurring?
I know how you must feel because I would never give up spearfishing but then again if my life depends on it then I might as well do.
Seek for answers but take your time, I hope someone with experience share more.
Good luck..

 

[cigarlung]

4 years sounds like your Epilipsy is controlled well. Perhaps you even have some predromal indicators blurred vision, headache,fatigue or strange smell. I say train hard dive deep and hard if you seize you will learn from it. Forums are great places for opinion! So perhaps talk with your MD see what he thinks and or go with your gut feeling.

 

[Phil Mc]

Thank you so much for all the input. This community sure like to help each other!

If I remember correctly, 10 minutes before I have a fit I get small shakes. That's my warning. I only ever have epilepsy if I have had days on end of no sleep and am overly exhausted, it seems to build up over a week then it hits me. Like I say, I've learnt my triggers and am sensible and medicated. 5 years free... Surely I'm ok.
I will continue to hassle doctors to let me dive, it's all I can do.
Thanks again for all the input guys, really kind.
Phil

 

[Roman Castro]

Phil,
I am moved by your passion to pursue this sport. I have a story and some advice for you.
I appreciate that you are honest with the instructors/clubs about your condition. It is very noble of you. A senior member of our local club took out a new diver for his first blue water trip and the poor guy had a seizure. The new diver didn't tell the senior member about his condition. It was just the two of them out at sea and he went stiff and fell overboard. The senior member had enough training and skills to stop the boat, dive down (where he was sinking fast), and swim him back to the surface where the new diver went combative. The guy made it but probably wouldn't have if he was with a less experienced diver. Full story
If you are going to do this I would recommend getting a Freediver Recovery Vest. They are about US$1,500.00. You can set a depth and time trigger in case you have an issue and sink out. This way at least your buddies have a better chance of saving you. It might help ease to worries of other divers too and make it easier to find buddies willing to dive with you.
I hope that helps. Good luck and be safe.

 

[ellenhighwater]

Hi Phil. You say you are medicated. This could also be an issue as side effects from some medications are known to dramatically increase at pressure and it appears that most meds used to treat epilepsy can increase the effects of narcosis, impair judgment etc.
http://divermag.com/epilepsyseizures-and-diving/
http://www.diversalertnetwork.org/medical/faq/Epilepsy
Obviously both the above are geared towards scuba rather than freediving, but there is a lot that overlaps. Find a good doctor who is familiar with dive medicine and be safe