Elios Suits.

[Murat]

yes i also used omer ocean mimetic for some time and used nylon outside suit for this summer and has no wear other than one which is you have to look carefull to see...I don't know if this smoothskin or freedown thing how much increase your performance??? we are not record breaker freedivers isn't it? It does not matter to dive 2 or 3 meter deeper with smoothskin...If the difference is that small

 

[Huan]

Murat
You are dead right we are not competitive freedivers, I think Breathhold is more important than a slippery suit.

 

[portinfer]

It is probably less increased depth distance than that Murat. Well unless you are hitting the depths like 60m to 90m when you need all th ehlp you can get but I think that a normal tough suit would work well and outweigh the benefits of a extra ten centimetres depth !

Better fins would probably more of an impact on your depth diving. (In my humble and inexperienced opinion !)

Elios - kanoko outer / opencell inner / mid density heiwa = nice !

Ed

 

[Murat]

i think nylon will be enough since i am used to wear nylon outside suits with no problems...Its seems only me among the local spearos who has not holes on the suit I am extra carefull about gear when around rocks...Even not single scratch on wood gun But i like to trash the alluminium ones around the rocks

 

[shaneshac]

Murat, i got a yamamoto jacket and a heiwa pants and the suit is awesome.

I take the suit off and i an still covered in soap and my hair is still completely dry.

I got he opencell inside and nylon brown camo on outside. Also got the reinforced loading pad which is good.

Shane

 

[Murat]

it sounds good shane you always makes good choices
What is the density of the neoprene? Is it yamamato S45?

After seeing the prices of the suits i decided to get one for myself too Probably 3mm suit with extra 5mm jacket for winter:hmm

As i remmember you also get benthos/smoothskin..How do you like them are they good for spearing? How much performance increase you observe against nylon outside?

 

[dave]

I use smoothskin/cell suits with loading pads for all my spearing. The advantages are increased flexibility, and more importantly fast drying, which means I chill less when changing spots in the boat. They are also very easy and quick to repair so long as you use the right glue (NOT Black Witch!) I have never really been a believer in the reduced drag argument
I take no extra care (except with dressing), and accept the odd rip as the price I pay for being warmer and more comfortable. I expect to get 2 seasons out of a suit.
I sell a lot of smoothskin suits to experienced spearos here in the UK, but I always recommend nylon outers to beginners as
1) They last longer
2) They are less likely to rip them dressing or undressing.
cheers
dave
www.spearo.co.uk
www.eliossub.co.uk

 

[Donna]

Thats interesting Dave - which glue do you recommend for repairs? I've always used black witch and so far its been ok?

Donna

 

[shaneshac]

Murat,

The heiwa bottom was medium density and the top was yamamoto 45

The smoothskin top is heiwa MD 8mm :O

Very robust for the freezing cold winters of Gibraltar rofl rofl rofl

I ahve only used it a couple of times as last winter was not too cold at all. Water has been colder this summer than it was all winter.

I cannot say i noticed much difference between the gliding of each suit.

 

[dave]

Bostik 2402 is the stuff, Its a two pack (glue and hardener) which you mix up in small batches before use. It is normally available from Chandlers etc as it is used for repairing inflatable boats. (Tivofix 5000 is even better, but it only comes in 5litre tins!)
Clean the tear with thinners, put a thin coat of mixed glue on each side and let it dry, then put on another coat, let that dry then push the edges together and roller, voila, a repair stronger than the neoprene itself!
Black Witch is messy, and doesn't tend to age very well. It also makes it very hard to reglue the rip properly if the repair fails
cheers
dave
www.spearo.co.uk
www.eliossub.co.uk

 

[Donna]

Hmmm, my rip is not so much of a rip but a big hole!!!! I made the classic mistake of trying to pull the tear together to hold it (it tore just below my bum when I caught it and so exploded ) and ended up with a lump of neoprene in my hand!! And so it is quite difficult to get it all to line up properly...

I have asked Elios if they can repair it properly for me and also whether I could have a lining put on the outside at this late stage - probably not possible, but just thought I'd ask. Am waiting for their response.

Donna

 

[Murat]

Originally posted by shaneshac
Murat,

The heiwa bottom was medium density and the top was yamamoto 45

So i assume yamamato has standart density, right? What is the difference between medium and low density? My friend is diving 25-35 meters and elios recommend low density for him:hmm

 

[shaneshac]

Not sure but my buddy just received a full 5mm lined MD Heiwa suit and is really really happy with it.

The density is the amount of airbubbles within the rubber. More air = warmer and softer but more compression at depth and less durable.

 

[Murat]

allright, that was an informative thread thanx all for help

 

[dave]

Yamamoto produce a wide range of different neoprenes, for example;
38; standard dive grade
39; Surface suits (low density)
45; highly flexible
Just asking for "Yamamoto" doesn't really mean anything unless you specify the type you want. Although Yamamoto produce some excellent rubber, they also produce some cheap and nasty rubber!
It is best to tell Elios what the suit is to be used for and take their advise, they are the experts
cheers
dave
www.spearo.co.uk
www.eliossub.co.uk

 

[shaneshac]

Funny how all of a sudden you included the www.eliossub.co.uk URL into your signature

HAHAHAHAH

Only kidding, Elios make some awesome suits

 

[dave]

That is why I am their UK agent I honestly believe elios make the best wetsuits in the World (and I have owned a lot of different suits in my time)
cheers
dave
www.spearo.co.uk
www.eliossub.co.uk

 

[sturgeon]

Murat,

I have a couple Elios suits and my best recommendation to you for what you and your buddy are going to be using the suits for is:

low-density Heiwa neoprene with gold coated open cell inside (very easy to put on without soap and yet still very warm) with elastic nylon outside. This is the configuration I just had a pair of 2 mm pants made that I used in the Nationals this past summer in Hawaii and they were awesome. For my jackets, I always get Smoothskin out. On my 3 mm it's strait open cell in/smoothskin out but for my 2 mm I went with smoothskin out/nylon in. I definitely recommend for your friend, at the very least, get elastic nylon out on the pants. Here's some info Elios sent me when I was asking them about suits for this past summer's Nationals (I believe Option #1 would be perfect for your friend, except in whatever mm he needs):

Hello,
About your request, we can offer you several solutions:

FIRST: in this low thickness, we suggest you to take jacket and pants
with nylon outside and coating inside, because without lining will be
too much delicate!

Options:

1) Suit 2mm Nylon elastic black outside / Gold coating cell inside
(include chest pad) Price Euro 170,00 It's very very elastic, warmth and
aderent to the body (easy to get into without lube)

2) Suit 2mm Nylon elastic black outside / Copper coating smooth inside
(include chest pad) Price Euro 170,00 It's very very slide for get into,
durable and hot.

3) Suit in 2mm, complete of:
Jacket smothskin outside / Nylon elastic inside (very easy to get into,
very very stretch and not so much delicated, max breathing) Panta nylon
outside / Gold coating inside (very soft, warmth and
durable)
Price Euro 152,00 (include chest pad)

4) Suit 2mm Nylon standard black outside / Titanium coating cell inside
(include chest pad) Price Euro 140,00 It's very very slide for get into,
durable and hot. (good only for shallow divings) Neoprene Ecoline

These are some of the better solutions for your needs.
If you want other informations don't hesitate to contact me.

Best regards
STEFANO

I hope this helps.

Scott

 

[Murat]

thanx scott

my choice will be smillar, 3mm heiwa low density open cell inside (since we like to lube the suit anyway) i think that using hot water in winter times is added advantage of opencell outside will be superstrech nylon for dive buddy, i decided that after seeing what he did his OMER mimetics he even managed to rip off the nylon of omer many places, half of the suit become smoothskin

How do you like smoothskin top? Did you notice anyperformance increase or its just more comfy?

Actually i did not decide for me wheather to buy 2mm or 3mm coz in summer here is very hot. Water temp. at the surface 29-30 degree celcius but the bottoms after 20-25 meters gets very cold. This summer i get hot on the surface and freezed on the bottom, actually its not like that evertime but sometimes in someplaces I guess it has something to do with underwater currents:hmm

 

[sturgeon]

Murat,

Once I started using the smoothskin out jackets I just kind of got used to them. Besides, they are warmer when in the wind which is good for me here because in the winter it gets somewhat cold and we are in and out of the water all day and driving on a boat. The 1st Elios smoothskin jacket I got seemed to hold up pretty well so when I had my second one made I just kept it the same. I definitely say though, for any bottom hunting spearfisherman, go with nylon out for the pants.

Yeah, different water temps on the same dive/day can be a pain in the ass. Especially with a good suit like Elios because you'll burn up in the hotter water. For me though, I'd rather be hot than cold.

Take care.

Scott