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End of Pool Turns

Thread Status: Hello , There was no answer in this thread for more than 60 days.
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bolts

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Just wondering....how does everyone here handle turning once the end of the pool is reached during a dynamic performance? Anyone have any video clips available??

I always feel so frickin' ungraceful and clumsy turning :hmm ...I'm sure I'm wasting a lot of energy doing this. I'm hoping someone can help out.
 

ggarrett

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Bolts,

When I first started multiple lengths of dynamics almost 4 years ago, I found alternating lengths face-up then face-down allowed me to turn with the least resistance and he least expenditure of energy. So, swimming into the wall face-down, touching the wall, leaning back, planting the feet, and then pusing off feels quite effortless compared to turning around always facing down or on one's stomach. I admit it's unorthodox but it works for me. For what it's worth...

Peace,
Glen
 

Pablo

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Fell the same for while... but this last two weeks things have improve a bit.

It helps to relax and don't try to push hard against the wall. I find out I was adopting a bad position when approaching, and trying to do the turn too fast.

I measure the middle of the pool, drop a weight and start the interval training from the middle... this way I always have at least one turn on each dynamic, and week after week things get better.

When diving down a rope I just use the face up/down technique, but on a vertical plan... I may try on the pool!

I still need to see two divers doing the same turn... you may need to find what ever works for you.

Maybe filming yourself could help?
 

bolts

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ggarrett said:
P.S.
Video clip of World Record holder, Stig Åvall Severinsen:
http://www.planetfreedive.dk/default-eng.htm
Scroll down to World Record 166m to find the videos
GG

I see this is without fins....looks like his turning technique is extremely efficient, but I don't know if I could do the same move with fins on. Anyone else have suggestions? Manouvering with fins seems to be my big problem.
 

Hana

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It is possible to execute the same kind of turn with fins on. (However please note that I'm a swimmer/swimming coach, but I've tried this myself when fully underwater, the mechanics are very similar to competitive fly/brst turn)

As someone sort of mentioned, if you don't worry about the angle your feet hit the wall you should be fine. You'll waste a lot of energy though if you try and push off with your feet pointing straight down and flush against the wall. One of the reasons you may be having trouble is that you are getting too close to the wall and cutting down the space you have.

As one hand taps the wall, the other is being pulled down to the side to initiate a turning movement. This should be done keeping the arm close to the body, almost elbow first, follow it with your head and look back down the pool over the shoulder that isn't on the wall. As your elbow pulls back, the opposite knee should come up and plant against the wall so you are almost on your side (with the hand that you touched with travelling over to meet the other). As you start to push off you will find that you have enough room to bring your other foot onto the wall so you use both to complete the turn and gain some momentum off the wall.

That didn't make a whole lot of sense when written and with no visuals. Sorry!
 
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iceselkie

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Hi, this is just the info I'm looking for myself. Actually, specifically with regards to a monofin. I was reading a thread where the diver mentions not being able to connect with the wall very well, due to a suctioning effect. I experience the opposite with the fin-- If i try to do the breaststroke/fly turn- touch the wall, swing my legs around and push off, I get a compression of water that actually makes the fin slide around but never connect with the wall. Hard to describe, just imagine trying to put the same polar ends of a magnet together. It's frustrating because you lose SOOO much momentum and streamline. Whenever I can I just cheat and swim the perimeter of the pool, but often this is not possible. Going to have to confront this one with a workable solution!
 

X-Fins

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Hi every body!!!

it's pretty complex to explain aquatic movements, at least for me and inclusive in my lenguaje but one of the keys in all aquatic movements it's never face the fluid perpendicularly, you must penetrate the fluid not shock the fluid.

To make turns you must spin with the imaginary axle out of your body, you can look for
a support putting your hand in the wall. And, important, while you turn face the water with your heels, the fins should cut the water in the same direction as your body spin.

I expect to help you, i don't know if I help or I complicate you .....

best regards, Luis
 

ggarrett

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bolts said:
I see this is without fins....looks like his turning technique is extremely efficient, but I don't know if I could do the same move with fins on. Anyone else have suggestions? Manouvering with fins seems to be my big problem.

Here's a link to some videos of Peter Pederson and Stig doing DYF:
http://www.danskfridykkerforbund.dk/11doc/doc_uk.htm
Scroll down to "Videos" and you will find what you're seeking.

Peace,
Glen
 

bolts

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^Above link doesn't seem to be working right now.... :hmm
 

Peter P

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http://www.glennvenghaus.com/freediving/index.php

This should work...

The thing about the turn with a mono, is that many tends to make the turn to quick. Some times I´ve seen people do almost like a fast "snap".

I would say -If you are relaxed during your swim, you should feel the same way while making the turn. Allow yourself to make it last a little longer. It will use alot less O2 than a "snapturn"...

Peter P
 

subaquaticus

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ggarrett said:
P.S.
Video clip of World Record holder, Stig Åvall Severinsen:
http://www.planetfreedive.dk/default-eng.htm
Scroll down to World Record 166m to find the videos
GG

The record you mention is without fins ! Without fins, it is much easier to turn... Fins make it more clumsy and energy wasting...

That's why records without fins are generally broken in 25 m pools...
 

subaquaticus

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bolts said:
I see this is without fins....looks like his turning technique is extremely efficient, but I don't know if I could do the same move with fins on. Anyone else have suggestions? Manouvering with fins seems to be my big problem.

Here is my personal technique (for what it is worth...)

1. I arrive face down close to the wall ;

2. 3 to 5 meters before the wall I do a rotation of 90° along my longitudinal axis to the left : I am now looking towards the left wall ;

3. I fold my body around my hips and do a rotation aroud the axis determined by my hips... Since I was looking left (and no longer down) this rotation is a mouvement in a horizontal plane ;

4. My heels should land exactly on the wall if I started my second rotation at the right time ; my final position should then be my upper body heading towards the new direction and my legs folded with my feet stuck on the wall and ready to push ;

5. I push with my heels (not too violently in order not to waste too much oxygen...)

6. While pushing I do a third 90° longitudinal rotation in order to "unscrew" and arrive face down ;

7. I try to take advantage of the gliding before I begin moving my fins...
 

ggarrett

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DNF vs DYF

subaquaticus said:
That's why records without fins are generally broken in 25 m pools...

Indeed. 25m pools favor DNF; 50m pools favor DYF. DNF depends more on form and energy conservation. DYF adds the element of speed. In DNF as much as 25% to 35% of the distance can come pushing off the wall. In DYF turns may retard the performance and slow it down thus consuming time and energy. DNF utilizes upper body; DYF utilizes lower body. DNF connects the body directly with the water; DYF connects the body indirectly through the fins. DNF muscles adapt to the water; DYF muscles adapt to the fin. In a lot of ways, DNF and DYF are different disciplines.

Under current rules, the ideal DNF pool is 25m as Subaquaticus noted.

The ideal DYF pool might be 300m, considering possible future advances. In Vancouver there's a 137m pool at Kitsilano and it would be interesting to know if anyone up there has taken it on and what it's like.

Peace,
Glen
 

Budho

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Hello everybody!
I am a freediving instructor from Slovenia, Europe. Right now I am training for national championship and selecton for AIDA world individual championship.
Everything went well until I had a very hard training session. Since than I feel burned out. It is one month before the competition now so. Does anybody has any sugestion or experience with similar situations. So what to do next?
:hmm
 

subaquaticus

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Budho said:
Hello everybody!
I am a freediving instructor from Slovenia, Europe. Right now I am training for national championship and selecton for AIDA world individual championship.
Everything went well until I had a very hard training session. Since than I feel burned out. It is one month before the competition now so. Does anybody has any sugestion or experience with similar situations. So what to do next?
:hmm

Just a remark taken from my - very limited - experience of freediving...

I experienced different other sports in competition... running, swimming, roller skating...

I felt that there is something special in the "apnea" fatigue, which is quite different from "swimming" or "running" fatigue ;

after a "purely" apnea training, I feel as if my lungs were burning...

maybe you might make your training sessions more healthy if you mix "apnea" training with more "aerobic" training (swimming, running, cycling,...)

if you train to hold your breath, it is good also to train to breathe...

In Pelizzari's book, he speaks a lot of other "cardiovascular" sports among them first swimming (good for the chest and rib cage expansion) and finswimming (good for the thighs and abs...)

Asa conclusion, do not be too polarized on "pure" apnea... do things which make you breathe, and then you will increase your capacity to hold your breath....
 

subaquaticus

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ggarrett said:
Bolts,

When I first started multiple lengths of dynamics almost 4 years ago, I found alternating lengths face-up then face-down allowed me to turn with the least resistance and he least expenditure of energy. So, swimming into the wall face-down, touching the wall, leaning back, planting the feet, and then pusing off feels quite effortless compared to turning around always facing down or on one's stomach. I admit it's unorthodox but it works for me. For what it's worth...

Peace,
Glen

your post is interesting and I faced the same problem...

between face-down and face-up, you have face-side !!

I do my length face-down ; 2 m close to the wall I rotate longitudinally towards the left : my face looks towards the left ; the I can fold my body in a horizontal plane ; when I push with my fins against the wall I am still face-left ; and then I rotate my body towards face-down...
 
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