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Help on Shaft Mettalurgy Question ..Plz

Thread Status: Hello , There was no answer in this thread for more than 60 days.
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Iyadiver

Mr. Long Post
Apr 22, 2002
998
72
0
Some of u probably know I have the 850 Cyrano pneumatic which I have always wanted to change the original can-rust shaft with Riffe Hawaiian shaft. I just realized that my original shaft is having a little bend in the middle. I recalled no fish have damaged this shaft before. Therefore I am sure my fast loading was why it got a bit bent. Of all my ex pneu guns, I also recalled 8mm was the original shafts but this Cyrano get 7mm.

The local Riffe dealer has no Hawaiian shaft in stock, so I bought a 9/32 ( 7.1mm ) x 48" threaded which I will cut to remove the wishbone tab and sear end. I also bought a flopper to be installed. So I will make a Hawaiian shaft on my own. My question is :

Does anybody know if this superior metal is actualy more superior in terms of permanent bend resistance compared to the kind of Inox steel ( so they say ) used on my Mares. I know a few of you have Euro guns that do NOT use 17-4 Riffe type spring stainless steel but come with normal corroding steel spearshaft, I suppose must be Inox or equivalent. If you know the loading method of pneu, it subject the shaft to real bending. Can anyone Euro owner or mettalurgist help ?


Second question :
Since I will cut my 9/32 shaft where the wishbone loading tab is, I just realized that I will have a very short shaft of about 6" or 15 cm. I been wondering all this time about recoil. How much recoil do rubbers/bands hitting the muzzle during a shot contribute to overall recoil of a gun. Since a 6" x 9/32 shaft is so light, I am thinking to fire it out on my 124cm teak gun with 4 x 9/16 bands. Whatever recoil I get, I suppose it will be 80% by the rubbers, the rest by the shaft weight. Anyone ever try this crazy
experiment before? I am afraid my teak gun track will be damaged by the test even though I can machine this short shaft to have a smooth front part. Another possibility I might get hurt by the shaft going crazy during a shot, unless I use an enclosed track.:confused: I won't have enclosed track kit till another 60 days. I have a Metal Tech spare plastic track if I ever damage any MT series track up to MT3. I can always use my MT#0 for this test but I want longer guns to show the significant recoil of the rubbers. Any crazy or normal idea appreciated. YEP, I will start with 1 rubber and add one and add one and see how it goes.
HELMET ????


Always Crazy,
IYA
 

icarus pacific

Human-in-training
Nov 7, 2001
2,880
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I looked through a metals book I used to use asa teaching aid, and the metal labeled as INOX has only one thing going for it- the surface is harder- than conventional unplated carbon steel, and even then it's not as corrosion resistant as a mild grade of stainless. The 17-4 that Riffe uses is stiffer, more corrosion resistant and has an overall better ability to not deflect under the torque associated with being a projectile. Plus, it machines well. I have to guess that the air guns use the INOX for it's surface finish and as a matter of expense.

I'd also suppose that the bulk of the recoil will be from the rubbers heading forward with the shaft, before they smack the muzzle, if they hit the muzzle at all. As a Riffe wood gun :inlove has no muzzle and they still kick, it goes to prove that the stationary shaft suddenly getting the ooomph to head off is the source of the recoil, you can't push out something, without pushing off something. uh oh...:ycard And 4 9/16 bands is a heap of oomph for that shaft.

And I've been happy with 6 inches for 40-some years... some haven't, but I lost their numbers anyway.:D


sven
 

andrsn

Just visiting...
Aug 26, 2001
1,213
75
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Originally posted by icarus pacific
I looked through books I used as a training aid, and the one thing going for it- the surface is harder than normal, but even then it leaves a mild grade of stains on the couch. The 5.4 that I have is stiffer, and has an overall better ability to not deflect under the torque associated with manual pressure. Plus, it handles well.

I'd also suppose that the bulk of the recoil will be from the rubber heading forward with the shaft, before they smack her muzzle, if they hit her muzzle at all. It goes to prove that the stationary shaft suddenly getting the ooomph to head in is the source of the recoil, you can't push out something, without pushing off something. uh oh...:ycard And 49lbs of gluet contractions is a heap of oomph for this shaft.

And I've been happy with it for 40-some years... some haven't, but I lost their numbers anyway.:D

sven


come again? :t
 

Iyadiver

Mr. Long Post
Apr 22, 2002
998
72
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ha ha ha ha....:D :D Anderson, I thought U r only good with Photoshop, I didn't know u r also good with Word.:eek:
 

Aquiles

King of the Kup KK04'
Sep 19, 2001
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Hey there Iya,

If you have a pneumi why don't you just buy a spring stainless steel shaft for the gun of adeduate length. I know that you want to do all of this experimentation cause you are the mad scientist type but will it really be worth it. I have a 133 cm pneumatic gun. This is a pneumatic beast! It is the mares sten... It shoots an 8 mm shaft that drops a punch like Mike Tyson. I was tired of the shaft rusting and I just dropped the cash and bought the adequate spring stainless shaft. It was 55 bucks. Im sure with all of the typing you do you can find something, somewhere on the net.

I have both the riffe shafts and the regular stainless shaft for pneumatics and I don't think that there is a significant difference.

Also remember that if you scratch the inner barrel of the gun that you will break the O ring seal and loose your air over time.

By the way the 133 pneumatic is for sale if you are interested. It has a reel, sst shaft and has only been used for a season. Good gun big cannon.

Also remember that no matter what the metal, over time the fish or the rocks will sooner than later bend any shaft.


Aquiles
 

Iyadiver

Mr. Long Post
Apr 22, 2002
998
72
0
Thanks Aquiles,

In my country, no one sells spring stainless steel shaft, I mean steel shops. The size do sell is only 2 or 3 mm at most, which they probably use for making spring. 304 and 316 SS available but very soft and make permanent bend easy. So custom shaft out of question.

The only available gun/shaft dealer is JBL or Riffe, so I choose Riffe cause I like their 7mm / 9/32" Hawaiian shaft. All I need is to cut and machined an adaptor end. The Mares shop here don't concentrate on speargun, mainly scuba gear, so nothing extra to offer except my Cyrano in its basic form. I can't buy shaft from the US unless I buy in volume, shipping doesn't make sense ( US$50 is minimum, plus 30% tax based on goods + shipping ......die die die ).

I was getting impatient so I bought that Riffe 9/32 threaded at 48" length where I need to cut it its end, machine a pneu shaft butt, install the flopper and sharpen the threaded end to become pencil point. I paid US$49 for the shaft and US$7 for the flopper and those are already in my city. Machining all mentioned requirement will cost me no more than US$10, cause labor is cheap and the machine shop loves me. So for US$66, I get a Riffe Hawaiian shaft and an extra 6" shaft left over to experiment as how I have always wanted....... OK right ???

I had 3 Sten long time ago and 2 Scubapro, all pneu, all damaged bye-bye for good. All under 100 cm cause me short can't load above 100 cm comfortably. I am already loading with my foot shoulder now even at 85 cm. Loading pressure I don't mind, my hand can't reach long ones. I recalled my Sten uses 8mm steel and the Scubapro 8mm spring ss. The Scubapro was better built, piston not plastic and trigger push rod adaptor stronger. New Sten I don't know. Thanks 4 the sale offer but pneu I will always buy brand new cause it has short life span and most importantly I can't load a 133cm. I am sure it is powerful, only if I can load it...my my.

I just bought that Cyrano for old time sake cause I have always loved a pneu but now I am falling in love with Riffe-s. Can't be a complete hunter if I don't own all sort of guns. A nice Euro will be next but I am still figuring out which, I won't use the Euro often anyway so I can wait. With my latest 81cm Riffe Metal Tech #0 which I just tested a bit yesterday, I think the Euro can wait much longer.

Buying a speargun is easy for me. Importation permit by the police Arms & Explosive division, tax and shipping is what will kill me, if they are sourced outside of my country. Speargun is grey area here. A very funny country indeed.

Tell me about that Rabitec........:D :D

Thanks
IYA
 
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