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How hard/flexible should a spear be?

Thread Status: Hello , There was no answer in this thread for more than 60 days.
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Leander

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Oct 17, 2017
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I have a MVD gun here, which sadly came with a slightly bent spear and reel thanks to the great folks at the courier service, who used this package to block the rest of the cargo. Somehow they must have missed the dual-language+symbol stickers marking the package fragile.

When I straightened the stainless steel spear I was quite unimpressed with how easy it was to bend it. It bends so easily that whenever I shoot something and the spear only so slightly brushes against a rock, even with the minimum rubbers loaded, the spear needs straightening again. Same for when a fish decides not to die and starts fighting. It's definitely not a spring steel. It behaves more like the steel used for concrete constructions.

I haven't met anyone so far with complaints about MVD, so I'm sure either this is normal behaviour for a spear (my first gun, so can't compare), or as in my tradition I again got the one-in-ten-thousand dud.

How hard/flexible/springy should a good spear be?
 

Mr. X

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Name and shame the courier?

As to spear hardness, they should be hardened to 1600n/mm and Rockwell HRC44 (about the same as a traditional, sharpenable saw), at least that's what my Turkish(?) Apnea spears are hardened to:
PHOTO_20200807_132241.jpg


Turkey 1, Greece 0?
 
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xristos

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Sep 5, 2013
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Sorry about that it was from must dive shop? Did you call them? To me they shipped shaft inside a small diameter pvc pipe and shaft was protected.
 
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Mr. X

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I've never had to straighten a spear yet. I tend to hide among rocks and shoot away from them. But I used a tough 6.6mm RA spring steel spear for my first several years(y) But thin, light 6.3mm Omer stainless steel spear since then. The latter seem to absorb dings quite well, only honed the tip gently once, after getting it caught between rocks.

Haven't really used the Apnea spears much yet but they look very good :).

 
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Leander

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Sorry about that it was from must dive shop? Did you call them? To me they shipped shaft inside a small diameter pvc pipe and shaft was protected.
I ordered directly from MVD. They shipped with the gun rolled in bubble wrap and multiple layers of thick cardboard. Pvc would've been better, but the way they packaged would normally be good enough, unless you use it to brace the rest of the truck's load of course. 'Hellenic Post', so Elta and whatever subcontractors Elta uses.

I received the gun last December already, only used it a few times so far as I normally focus on the lionfish. I did mail some with them, but tbh I had no interest in the whole hoop-jumping, so I simply bent back the spear and the reel. Got the gun with a 30% Black Friday discount anyway.

But when the moment comes that the spear gets too wobbly to fix, then I want to know what to look for in a good replacement spear and I'll change this one into a murena-spear, see how it bends then! :ROFLMAO:
 
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Leander

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Oct 17, 2017
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I've never had to straighten a spear yet. I tend to hide among rocks and shoot away from them. But I used a tough 6.6mm RA spring steel spear for my first several years(y) But thin, light 6.3mm Omer stainless steel spear since then. The latter seem to absorb dings quite well, only honed the tip gently once, after getting it caught between rocks.

Haven't really used the Apnea spears much yet but they look very good :).

Thanks, I will watch those videos tonight. So far I read about rolling the spear on a flat surface to check where it bends, but the only truely flat surfaces here are the graves on the cemetery down the road. Don't want to do that! So I now tweak it by eye. It hits very well even at range, but I just cannot imagine that a spear should be so bendable and without flex-memory.

I think I have a curse. Ever since I left for my never-ending tour, I am plagued by faulty equipment. There's almost nothing I haven't had to repair or return.
 
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popgun pete

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Jul 30, 2008
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Spring stainless steel is your best bet, it has a brownish colour from the heat treatment. Stainless steel, such as 316 is virtually rust free and has a very silvery appearance due to the high chrome content, but bends easily once subjected to a high bending load. MVD spears appear to be Inox, a form of stainless steel.
 
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Leander

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Oct 17, 2017
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Stainless steel, such as 316 is virtually rust free and has a very silvery appearance due to the high chrome content
It's a very good chance they used 316 or similar alloy. Some use that steel in diving knives as well; good for people who like sharpening their knives every five minutes. :)

Any good brands for the spring stainless steel? Mr.X mentioned Omer already. Are there any others that have a good tried and tested reputation?
 
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DiveHacker

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Jun 17, 2020
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I gotta say this is another one of those topics I am mystified by. Why don't more people use the spring steel? It seems aesthetics via rust is the only real problem. I suppose many do use rob allen shafts so many are using them.

I ordered a Picasso Gold shaft from Scubastore. That seems to be one of their "this item is in stock... psych - it is gonna take three weeks to ship"... items though. Maybe it will turn out there is a bunch of stuff I wont like about the shaft, but for now i felt durability is my main concern as a backup shaft so I went with it.
 

Leander

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Oct 17, 2017
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I wonder if it was bent from the factory?
Nah it was the courier for sure. The reel's arm was bent as well, so they either used it to block the load or some of the load fell on it during transport. I worked for different movers companies in the past, and everywhere I saw this being done. When we arrived at the destination we would always open the truck vveeerrryy carefully and preferably without the client anywhere near. :ROFLMAO:

It wasn't bent like 20° or so, but it had a noticeable curve. Stupid quality and care issues like this can break a brand, so I hope they now ship their products with a little more protection.
The gun itself was fine, but then again, a 28mm aluminium tube is quite a lot harder to bend than a 6.5mm inox rod.
 

Mr. X

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Maybe the courier closed a door on it. Rob Allen did another video like the one above for an Oz dealer. He mentions the need to check even new spears in case of damage during transit.
 

Andrew the fish

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Oct 17, 2010
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I haven't met anyone so far with complaints about MVD, so I'm sure either this is normal behaviour for a spear (my first gun, so can't compare), or as in my tradition I again got the one-in-ten-thousand dud.

How hard/flexible/springy should a good spear be?

no, this is not normal, though I had my share of cheap shafts, and this is what you have. Like mentioned above, good shaft doesn’t bend easy, neither it flatten the spear tip even when you hit the rock. When shopping for your second and third speargun, always check in description what they say about shaft. If shaft is good it will allways be mentioned in a very specific terms. Ask questions about shaft from sales people, it helps, though often online shop would have a dummy for a sales rep who doesn’t have a clue.
 
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