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Is Spearfishing a Sport?

Is spearfishing a sport or underwater hunting?

  • Spearfishing is a sport!

    Votes: 17 25.8%
  • Spearfishing is underwater hunting!

    Votes: 49 74.2%

  • Total voters
    66
OP
OP
A

artiz

Guest
Less of the auld please:)

Good job Balpherus but you raise a point that may be worth considering further - Why have these lines of enquiry, or possibly tentative 'first steps' towards formation of a constituted organisation to protect our interest not been taken further before?
I would guess Foxfish hit the nail on the head - there just simply aren't enough of us regularly spearing to form a viable organisation that can influence policy decision makers.
I can't recall what the thread was about ( possibly this very topic, or someone researching a new business idea?) but sometime last year there was a back of the envelope calculation of number of Spearos and it was negligible.
I would be v interested in your findings but, as I think you understand, sensitivity is needed when dealing with authorities regarding highlighting our sport to them. Currently we are classed the same as anglers ie recreational fishermen and we are completely within our rights to spear fish.
I've not seen anything to tell me there are plans or intentions to change this yet I've been hearing the same story for years from people saying we need to form a club to protect ourselves. Really?
Perhaps the subject is a bit of a yawn for many experienced forum users but for me its been the progressive and more frequent examples of legislation in the last 10 years which made me join this forum in the first place. I'm not exactly a social spearo and only dive with my son or alone & wherever possible away from anyone. For the last 37 years I have not felt that spearfishing is under threat... now I do and for me any sanctions, regulations and legislation regarding spearfishing will be 'the straw that broke the camels back'. Administration, regs and sanctions is a British past time/obsession which I abhor... 2004-5ish banned in Holland & Germany & over-licensed in some Med countries, 2006/7ish ban in Wales - successfully opposed/rejected? 2008 European projectile legislation mistake???... more like opposition tester for future legislation and 2011 Ireland Bass and season limits and gun license for pneumatics, 2012 Welsh exclusion zones plus goodness only knows what else in the pipeline that I/we don't know about yet... and here in the UK the British Spearfishing Association (with about 30-40 members and falling) still has competitions where hundreds of fish are paraded on public display in the name of 'sport' or should I say 'blood sport'?... as I said 'sitting ducks' with no informed representation? So my answer is yes we REALLY need an association now which can change wider perceptions of spearfishing and represent modern ecological spearfishing practices before its too late. Without good informative representation in ever increasing consultation processes we'll be on the back foot & wondering what the hell happened.
I also think there are far more people who spearfish than is commonly thought... I definitely seem to be avoiding more than ever before?
A BSA which promotes ecological principles, research assistance to conservation and legislation bodies and all under an ethical perspective could even self-regulate and for me would be ideal... but one look at their web site and pics of stringers full of fish in the name of sport is enough to scare me into thinking that we are very much on borrowed time!
Sorry - Rant over?
Apologies for the auld comment of course!
 
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headhunter

Member
Aug 15, 2011
26
6
18
dorset
Artiz;
What is the point of the poll/ thread? You ask a question, and then argue with anyone who doesn't agree with you.
Hunting, shooting and fishing are sports. Football, rugby, athletics etc are games.
Why the bee in your bonnet about what spearfishing is called?
I had a look at your "Ethical Spearfishing Association" website and am very curious about the "we" and "us" it refers to. Do you have any members, or is it the Royal We? (or does it refer to your imaginary friends or the voices in your head?)
 
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foxfish

Silver Smoker
Staff member
Team Leader
Dec 31, 2005
12,895
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Guernsey, Channel Islands
If the BSA would adopt a more up to date style of competition perhaps like the DB specimen hunt annual competition, then they would probably loose the majority of their old school members (short term) but hopefully gain a new generation of modern day thinking spearos.
At one time we had lots of active BSA members posting on DB but, as we did not support their hunting - competition policy, or at least our members did not approve, we don't have many left!!
 
OP
OP
A

artiz

Guest
Artiz;
What is the point of the poll/ thread? You ask a question, and then argue with anyone who doesn't agree with you.
Hunting, shooting and fishing are sports. Football, rugby, athletics etc are games.
Why the bee in your bonnet about what spearfishing is called?
I had a look at your "Ethical Spearfishing Association" website and am very curious about the "we" and "us" it refers to. Do you have any members, or is it the Royal We? (or does it refer to your imaginary friends or the voices in your head?)
I suppose I could be accused of being over-enthusiastic regarding the subject matter but I think 'psychopath' is a little imaginative to say the least... thanks for your thoughts anyway... clearly another one to avoid!
 
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OP
OP
A

artiz

Guest
If the BSA would adopt a more up to date style of competition perhaps like the DB specimen hunt annual competition, then they would probably loose the majority of their old school members (short term) but hopefully gain a new generation of modern day thinking spearos.
At one time we had lots of active BSA members posting on DB but, as we did not support their hunting - competition policy, or at least our members did not approve, we don't have many left!!
After contacting the Chairman of the BSA I was very impressed with his latest Chairman's report which I believe has just been published (I hope I'm not jumping the gun here?) I get the impression that your comments above may well be up for discussion at the next British Spearfishing Association AGM Foxfish so I wonder if all spearo's are able to attend and voice opinions, that is what AGM's are for after all. I would definitely join if they decided to modernise/update their aims and objectives below. DB specimen hunt annual competition... very cool!

THE AIM
B. S. A. is a non-profit making organisation of strictly civil nature.
The aim of the association is to support anti pollution legislation, and to observe conservation of fish species in a good and realistic manner.
To discourage others from catching or taking from the sea undersized or restricted species.
To discourage the taking of fish by foul means this to include artificial breathing aids.
To encourage and develop the sport of spearfishing.
OBJECTIVES
To have competitions for all classes and age groups and decide annually on British Champions for classes as agreed.
To coach and develop a national squad for international competitions
To encourage clubs and internal competition
 
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headhunter

Member
Aug 15, 2011
26
6
18
dorset
I suppose I could be accused of being over-enthusiastic regarding the subject matter but I think 'psychopath' is a little imaginative to say the least... thanks for your thoughts anyway... clearly another one to avoid!
Are you a politician? You have responded, but not actually answered any of the questions.............
 
OP
OP
A

artiz

Guest
Artiz;
What is the point of the poll/ thread? You ask a question, and then argue with anyone who doesn't agree with you.
Hunting, shooting and fishing are sports. Football, rugby, athletics etc are games.
Why the bee in your bonnet about what spearfishing is called?
I had a look at your "Ethical Spearfishing Association" website and am very curious about the "we" and "us" it refers to. Do you have any members, or is it the Royal We? (or does it refer to your imaginary friends or the voices in your head?)
Are you a politician? You have responded, but not actually answered any of the questions.............
Read the thread properly and you'll find that I have already fully answered your pathetic attempt to belittle me. If you have an interest in this subject state your thoughts without insults and make sure you have read the thread fully first. Informed is so much better? This is hopefully a forum where people can discuss important/critical issues making their point with reason and passion as well as anything else that interests them and your comments/questions in your second ever post above are juvenile, insulting and uninformed and therefore uninteresting. You are getting better though at least your third post wasn't offensive?... on second thoughts perhaps it was?
 
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foxfish

Silver Smoker
Staff member
Team Leader
Dec 31, 2005
12,895
2,962
478
59
Guernsey, Channel Islands
If you guys want to carry on your conversion via the private message system then by all means go ahead but, please, not one more insulting post on this thread, or it will simply not exist anymore.
 

Mr. X

Forum Mentor
Staff member
Forum Mentor
Jul 14, 2005
7,103
1,337
418
Sunny Britain
...
THE AIM
B. S. A. is a non-profit making organisation of strictly civil nature.
The aim of the association is to support anti pollution legislation, and to observe conservation of fish species in a good and realistic manner.
To discourage others from catching or taking from the sea undersized or restricted species.
To discourage the taking of fish by foul means this to include artificial breathing aids.
To encourage and develop the sport of spearfishing.
...
I personally don't have a problem with folk using "artificial breathing aids" - presumably they mean SCUBA and not a snorkel. I don't consider it "foul means". I don't do it myself but after Old Man Dave explained it, I don't have a problem with it - as long as they respect normal conservation & size guidelines. It seems rather self-righteous for freedivers to condemn it - often without due consideration. Be careful about damning or limiting the rights & freedoms of others lest your own freedoms be restricted or removed. [The countryside alliance starting campaigning to restrict canoeing & kayaking a while back, appealing to country landowners I suppose. I pointed out to them that it was hypercritical of them to try to prevent others enjoying themselves while campaigning for similar freedoms themselves. Thankfully, they seem to have dropped it now.]
 
OP
OP
A

artiz

Guest
I personally don't have a problem with folk using "artificial breathing aids" - presumably they mean SCUBA and not a snorkel. I don't consider it "foul means". I don't do it myself but after Old Man Dave explained it, I don't have a problem with it - as long as they respect normal conservation & size guidelines. It seems rather self-righteous for freedivers to condemn it - often without due consideration. Be careful about damning or limiting the rights & freedoms of others lest your own freedoms be restricted or removed. [The countryside alliance starting campaigning to restrict canoeing & kayaking a while back, appealing to country landowners I suppose. I pointed out to them that it was hypercritical of them to try to prevent others enjoying themselves while campaigning for similar freedoms themselves. Thankfully, they seem to have dropped it now.]
At the more official/organisational level spearfishing's major detractors are the BSAC who do not seem to like the BSA very much and are attempting to dismantle BUSA (british underwater sports association) which gets money from CMAS for competitions. So a very similar situation as the one you have pointed out above. Organisations being hypocritical and thoughtless regarding individuals enjoyment and well-being. Perhaps the BSA has no choice now other than to change or fade away?
 
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headhunter

Member
Aug 15, 2011
26
6
18
dorset
Read the thread properly and you'll find that I have already fully answered your pathetic attempt to belittle me. If you have an interest in this subject state your thoughts without insults and make sure you have read the thread fully first. Informed is so much better? This is hopefully a forum where people can discuss important/critical issues making their point with reason and passion as well as anything else that interests them and your comments/questions in your second ever post above are juvenile, insulting and uninformed and therefore uninteresting. You are getting better though at least your third post wasn't offensive?... on second thoughts perhaps it was?
I am not trying to belittle anyone, it just seems a bit "David Icke " to spend a lot of time producing a website for an association that doesn't have any members and attempts to present one persons opinions as some kind of majority view
 
OP
OP
A

artiz

Guest
I am not trying to belittle anyone, it just seems a bit "David Icke " to spend a lot of time producing a website for an association that doesn't have any members and attempts to present one persons opinions as some kind of majority view
The clear focus of this thread is on change at the BSA, an established and recognised body that should already be representing the majority view rather than representing spearfishing exclusively as a 'blood' sport?
 
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headhunter

Member
Aug 15, 2011
26
6
18
dorset
The clear focus of this thread is on change at the BSA, an established and recognised body that should already be representing the majority view rather than representing spearfishing exclusively as a 'blood' sport?
So why is spearing fish different to killing any other animals for fun or food?
I really am at a loss as to why you think it is so important whether spearfishing is a sport or not, and what difference the definition makes anyway
 
OP
OP
Y

Yeti

Guest
I enjoy the sport of the hunt.....and the taste of fish (and pies)? can it really be sooooo complicated? :head
 

grantl

Well-Known Member
Dec 5, 2005
694
315
153
Scotland
I always think of night hunting as a sport but when considering the sport of daytime spearing its probably really actually hunting.
Simples.
 
OP
OP
A

artiz

Guest
I always think of night hunting as a sport but when considering the sport of daytime spearing its probably really actually hunting.
Simples.
I would bet Spearing at night will be the first to be banned like in Croatia and many other countries around the world? Its probably a good idea to read this thread from 2008 when some of the more experienced/informed spearo's came up against a blanket ban on spearfishing in Europe. Its a good example of what uninformed/knee jerk regulation we may be facing in the near future? Its also a good example of almost being caught with our 'pants down'?
I don't bother with guns on night dives, they get in the way! I'm there for the nocturnal's like lobster and crab which is hardly a 'sport'?
 
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