Personally I do not care where the neoprene is from as long as it works and lasts well. Perhaps Jim and others can give us a good account of the wear and tear of the two suits so that we can judge accordingly. I am waiting for my Diveskin and am seriously considering ordering an elios as well.
-
Welcome to the DeeperBlue.com Forums, the largest online community dedicated to Freediving, Scuba Diving and Spearfishing. To gain full access to the DeeperBlue.com Forums you must register for a free account. As a registered member you will be able to:
- Join over 44,280+ fellow diving enthusiasts from around the world on this forum
- Participate in and browse from over 516,210+ posts.
- Communicate privately with other divers from around the world.
- Post your own photos or view from 7,441+ user submitted images.
- All this and much more...
You can gain access to all this absolutely free when you register for an account, so sign up today!
More Elios questions
- Thread starterMKDVR
- Start date
Thread Status: Hello
, There was no answer in this thread for more than 60 days.
It can take a long time to get an up-to-date response or contact with relevant users.
It can take a long time to get an up-to-date response or contact with relevant users.
There is nothing wrong with Niam long neoprene per se, it is used by the many of the big suit manufacturers.
The issue is that it is (approx) half the cost of Heiwa neoprene, and that Diveskin feel the need to lie about what materials they use
cheers
dave
www.spearo.co.uk
The issue is that it is (approx) half the cost of Heiwa neoprene, and that Diveskin feel the need to lie about what materials they use
cheers
dave
www.spearo.co.uk
Elios use it on their cheaper suits, and are quite open about it.
What they dont do is claim to use expensive neoprene, then actually use cheap stuff!
cheers
dave
www.spearo.co.uk
What they dont do is claim to use expensive neoprene, then actually use cheap stuff!
cheers
dave
www.spearo.co.uk
Correct. Elios uses Nam Liong as the supplier to produce that particular wetsuit, just as stated on it's web site.
http://www.eliossub.com/html/en_pesca.html
http://www.eliossub.com/html/en_pesca.html
The olive green is high density heiwa. Elios use neoprene from a range of suppliers, including heiwa, Yamamoto, Sheico, Rubatex and Nam Liong.Murat said:
The Neoflex range is made from (mainly) Yamamoto or Heiwa, whilst the cheaper Ecoline range use (mainly) Sheico or Nam Liong
The main advantage of the Neoflex neoprenes is longer life, as they stand up to repeated compression/expansion cycles much better than the cheaper softer neoprenes. They also compress less with depth. This is at the expense of some flexibility, but on a properly cut made to measure suit this is not a problem, as they are still stretchier than skin
Most consumers do not really have the knowledge to identify which neoprene is best for their purpose, and would not recognise it anyway.It seems an unscrupulous manufacturer is taking advantage of this.
Asking just for a specific brand of neoprene is a bit like asking for a Ford car without specifying the model, as all neoprene manufacturers produce many different types of neoprene, and are constantly coming out with new types. It really is best to be guided by an expert who is doing this all the time
At the moment, for a smoothskin outer suit, Heiwa medium density is probably the best choice. For a nylon outer suit things are not so clear cut. Heiwa medium density is very good, but so is Yamamoto 38, and there are a couple of others I would be equally happy to use!
I am a bit of a trainspotter about this stuff as I worked in drysuit R&D for nearly 10 years, and my business partner was a designer for a major surfing wetsuit brand
cheers
dave
www.spearo.co.uk
As a side note, but regarding Elios wetsuits:
I recently ordered a custom suit from Elios, for my wife. With her curves, there was no way she was going to fit an off the rack suit! Elios shipped the suit 12 days BEFORE their estimated ship date. And Chronopost (or something like that) delivered the suit in 4 days, to my door in Ventura, California.
The suit was exactly as ordered, down to the color of the stitching. 7mm, 2 piece, attached hood, knee pads (for ?!), "jersey" nylon exterior, open-cell inside with metalic (Ti?) coating.
She tried it on last night, and it's a perfect fit. The construction appears to be quality, and I like the fact they use a more abrasion resistant, nylon 2 (both sides) piece of neoprene for the beaver tail. I also like the reenforced materials and load distributing pattern in the front and back adjacent the beaver tail.
The suit does not have the thinner neoprene wrist, ankle, and face seals, the way some of the Picassos do. Perhaps I could have specified these if I wanted? But the neoprene is very good quality.
The suit is not anatomically formed to the extent that Picasso suit are. The pants have a slight knee bend, but the arms are rather straight. Perhaps this is due to its being a custom suit, I don't know.
However, given the pricing and the choices available, I would certainly consider having Elios make a suit for me in the future.
Safe diving,
Seacidal
I recently ordered a custom suit from Elios, for my wife. With her curves, there was no way she was going to fit an off the rack suit! Elios shipped the suit 12 days BEFORE their estimated ship date. And Chronopost (or something like that) delivered the suit in 4 days, to my door in Ventura, California.
The suit was exactly as ordered, down to the color of the stitching. 7mm, 2 piece, attached hood, knee pads (for ?!), "jersey" nylon exterior, open-cell inside with metalic (Ti?) coating.
She tried it on last night, and it's a perfect fit. The construction appears to be quality, and I like the fact they use a more abrasion resistant, nylon 2 (both sides) piece of neoprene for the beaver tail. I also like the reenforced materials and load distributing pattern in the front and back adjacent the beaver tail.
The suit does not have the thinner neoprene wrist, ankle, and face seals, the way some of the Picassos do. Perhaps I could have specified these if I wanted? But the neoprene is very good quality.
The suit is not anatomically formed to the extent that Picasso suit are. The pants have a slight knee bend, but the arms are rather straight. Perhaps this is due to its being a custom suit, I don't know.
However, given the pricing and the choices available, I would certainly consider having Elios make a suit for me in the future.
Safe diving,
Seacidal
Just keep things in perspective, I have an Elios ecoline suit & can't fault the material*. It's very warm (even in January), stretchy, soft & strong (nylon outer is effective).
Re. anatomical cuts Picasso vs. Elios, the Elios website talks about why they do that. Also, I notice the arms on my suit include a diamond-shaped gusset, which might explain why arm movement is not a problem. [By the way, I know a trained pattern cutter & they critiqued some of the shortie wetsuits I looked at before I got my spearo suit. They commented that you need to have a reasonable number of panels to get a good fit; some cheap shorties do & some don't. It strikes me that Elios suits do not have many panels but they do still manage to be a good fit -- & looking at Jim's photo's the Elios suit looks more tailored of the two to me. The prices are reasonable too & there is much to be said for simplicity.]
*The only thing I am not too sure about is the beaver tail (regardless of manufacturer). I find it sometimes too warm (10mm of v. warm neoprene) at the part of your body that should be coolest - it can bring on nausea when conditions are not so good. Strangely it seemed more of an issue in the winter. I saw a spearo suit recently (Seacsub) that had no beaver tail, it simply had a big piece of velcro to hold the jacket to the trousers/pants - seems like a good idea if it works (actually, my jacket stays in place fine even with the beaver tail undone).
Re. anatomical cuts Picasso vs. Elios, the Elios website talks about why they do that. Also, I notice the arms on my suit include a diamond-shaped gusset, which might explain why arm movement is not a problem. [By the way, I know a trained pattern cutter & they critiqued some of the shortie wetsuits I looked at before I got my spearo suit. They commented that you need to have a reasonable number of panels to get a good fit; some cheap shorties do & some don't. It strikes me that Elios suits do not have many panels but they do still manage to be a good fit -- & looking at Jim's photo's the Elios suit looks more tailored of the two to me. The prices are reasonable too & there is much to be said for simplicity.]
*The only thing I am not too sure about is the beaver tail (regardless of manufacturer). I find it sometimes too warm (10mm of v. warm neoprene) at the part of your body that should be coolest - it can bring on nausea when conditions are not so good. Strangely it seemed more of an issue in the winter. I saw a spearo suit recently (Seacsub) that had no beaver tail, it simply had a big piece of velcro to hold the jacket to the trousers/pants - seems like a good idea if it works (actually, my jacket stays in place fine even with the beaver tail undone).
Jimdoe, last month, I received my Oceanos wetsuit from Greece; manufactured, shipped and delivered to the US in 3 weeks from date of order. Custom made. That thing is nice! It only cost 150 bucks + shipping for the 5mm slickskin, and fits like a glove. I also have a JMJ which cost 3 times as much and took 2 months to deliver. The JMJ looks and feels more expensive but I don't see any practical difference. The Oceanos came with a hooded jacket. For warm water, I've ordered a spare tunic without the hood. It is so cheap ($75), why not? Spiros must work 24/7. I have gotten immediate replies, in detail, to Email that would have arrived at his office in the middle of the night.
Last edited:
Agreed.
I am not knocking Diveskin one bit. I think they offer a very good value. The difference I clearly notice and pointed out previously was in the cut.
By no means is my Diveskin uncomfortable (Spiros does nice work), for me the Elios just feels more comfortable.
Jim
I am not knocking Diveskin one bit. I think they offer a very good value. The difference I clearly notice and pointed out previously was in the cut.
By no means is my Diveskin uncomfortable (Spiros does nice work), for me the Elios just feels more comfortable.
Jim
Attachments
Last edited:
Yesterday I got to finally got to dive the suit (green). Went into a dry spell right after I got it. Keeping in mind this is my first open-cell suit I am impressed. To answer the flexibility question the neck of the incorporated hood (5 mil) seemed a little stiff if you turned your head more than 45 degrees either way. Other than that I didn't notice any problem. Again, I have no other suit to compare it too.
This suit is easily the best I've ever had. The fit was such that it seemed to take the "wet" out of "wetsuit". Wrestling in and out of it is a chore but worth it. I got to dive under the conditions I intended it for. 73 is cold by my standards. I was cool after an hour but never got uncomfortable in it. In a scuba suit I'd be shaking after 45 minutes. I think I could dive half the day in it.
On the diving end I had to call it early due my own stupidity. I was a little careless about equalizing and guess I popped a vessel in my right ear. Didn't start equalizing until it was a little late and not often enough. Had 4 short dives and 2 longer ones. I started having problems getting past 30' before I noticed my right ear throbbing a bit. Later I got out to take a break and started spitting blood. Feel fine now and expect to stay dry for a couple of weeks to be sure.:naughty
This suit is easily the best I've ever had. The fit was such that it seemed to take the "wet" out of "wetsuit". Wrestling in and out of it is a chore but worth it. I got to dive under the conditions I intended it for. 73 is cold by my standards. I was cool after an hour but never got uncomfortable in it. In a scuba suit I'd be shaking after 45 minutes. I think I could dive half the day in it.
On the diving end I had to call it early due my own stupidity. I was a little careless about equalizing and guess I popped a vessel in my right ear. Didn't start equalizing until it was a little late and not often enough. Had 4 short dives and 2 longer ones. I started having problems getting past 30' before I noticed my right ear throbbing a bit. Later I got out to take a break and started spitting blood. Feel fine now and expect to stay dry for a couple of weeks to be sure.:naughty