as far as I know, the c4 falcons come in all different types of footpockets. I think I've seen like 4 different brands of footpocket with the c4's. I guess it just depends on which one fits you the best. Have you ever tried an omer fin or picasso fin? if you like the way the footpocket feels then I would just rock it! I'm pretty sure that the performance in the blades would be the same, but the fitting factor is what I'd be sketchy on. I love the Omer, Cressi, and Picasso footpockets. I'm also thinking of hookin up on some c4's. I've also heard that they fit in alot more footpockets as well. hope that helps. peace.
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Need help C4
- Thread starterGHOSTS
- Start date
Thread Status: Hello
, There was no answer in this thread for more than 60 days.
It can take a long time to get an up-to-date response or contact with relevant users.
It can take a long time to get an up-to-date response or contact with relevant users.
thank you everyone for your support in working this out for me.
Now from reading all this i am still confused :head , i know its about technique most of the time but i think you need to have the right gear to balance it out.
I have posted up my swimming style can some have a look and tell me what you think if its me or the fins.
[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UIQqx5O0JPI]YouTube - Dive training[/ame]
Nata here is your answers
a) Where are you from?and where do you usually dive ? Sydney Australia , i dive from a boat most of the time, i go to the queensland also the depths of the reefs are anywhere from 10m to 35m there. there are a lot of deep caves that i wont to get too and till have bottom time, i wear an open cell wetsuit 3mm and have about 12-pounds i think of lead
b) How tall are you and what do you weigh? 6,3 191-cm 92-kg
c) Are you an experienced diver? been spearing for 2 years dive around the 15m if i have a good breath up i can do around 20m
d) For which type of dive do you use them ( apnea, spearfishing, snorkeling ecc) ? spearfishing
Now from reading all this i am still confused :head , i know its about technique most of the time but i think you need to have the right gear to balance it out.
I have posted up my swimming style can some have a look and tell me what you think if its me or the fins.
[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UIQqx5O0JPI]YouTube - Dive training[/ame]
Nata here is your answers
a) Where are you from?and where do you usually dive ? Sydney Australia , i dive from a boat most of the time, i go to the queensland also the depths of the reefs are anywhere from 10m to 35m there. there are a lot of deep caves that i wont to get too and till have bottom time, i wear an open cell wetsuit 3mm and have about 12-pounds i think of lead
b) How tall are you and what do you weigh? 6,3 191-cm 92-kg
c) Are you an experienced diver? been spearing for 2 years dive around the 15m if i have a good breath up i can do around 20m
d) For which type of dive do you use them ( apnea, spearfishing, snorkeling ecc) ? spearfishing
yo ghosts, check it. from what i see, you seem to have the short burst type of kickstroke. If the c4's are what you're after, then the 15's are the ones for you, cuz they're soft. long, smooth kickstrokes are required for the 30's and 40's. even the Omer bat 25's seem like they would be more your style. I just got my Omer Pegaso(hard) fins in the mail the other day and they are insane. With long, smooth, even strokes I've obtained ridiculous lengths in the water. I have yet to take them in water that I can descend in.....cuz I've only used them in the pool a couple of times. But with short, powerful bursts, similar to your finning style, I'd go with soft to meduim stiffness of blades. But PLEASE try to experiment with some before you make a purchase, if it is possible. Again, I hope this helps. And if all else fails........ fuck it. Go with your instincts man. Peace.
Quite a narrow kick, and the movement you do have seems to come mainly from your knees bending. I reckon those fins of yours would be great if you used a wider, slower kick from the hips. Again, easier to do this in the sea than in the pool because you might find your fins hitting the surface or the bottom.
Hi
I'll agree with mullins on this one. i'm 6'4" and weigh around the 80-85kg mark and own a pair of DiveR mediums aswell as the OMER Pegaso mediums (a little softer and shorter than the DiveR) i find my self much more comfortable and more efficient with the softer fin however the DiveR has more than enough grunt when needed, have used C4 once and they were very nice but i know for a fact that i can dive as deep as my friend with C4 with my DiveR blades without a hassle so i doubt you'll get much of an improvement.
The fins arent your limiting factor they dont appear to be over flexing, i'd slow down your kick cycle and increase the amplitude, kicking more from the hips and thighs than from your knees, i think you'll find the stroke much more effecient and the dive more enjoyable.
My 2c worth
DD
I'll agree with mullins on this one. i'm 6'4" and weigh around the 80-85kg mark and own a pair of DiveR mediums aswell as the OMER Pegaso mediums (a little softer and shorter than the DiveR) i find my self much more comfortable and more efficient with the softer fin however the DiveR has more than enough grunt when needed, have used C4 once and they were very nice but i know for a fact that i can dive as deep as my friend with C4 with my DiveR blades without a hassle so i doubt you'll get much of an improvement.
The fins arent your limiting factor they dont appear to be over flexing, i'd slow down your kick cycle and increase the amplitude, kicking more from the hips and thighs than from your knees, i think you'll find the stroke much more effecient and the dive more enjoyable.
My 2c worth
DD
Is there a store in Los Angeles area that sells C4's ? I'd like to take a look and try on a pair before I gamble with US$500.0+ ....
I have EU 40 (US 8) size fairly narrow feet and find that OMER and SPORA footpockets of the right size are way too wide for me (even with 3mm socks) and the smaller size are ok width-wise but too short (my toes stick out of the opening in the footpocket).
Would love to try the new C4 foot pockets (mustangs?)
I have EU 40 (US 8) size fairly narrow feet and find that OMER and SPORA footpockets of the right size are way too wide for me (even with 3mm socks) and the smaller size are ok width-wise but too short (my toes stick out of the opening in the footpocket).
Would love to try the new C4 foot pockets (mustangs?)
ghost, my 2c if i may:
1. your kick is asymetrical (relative to your body position)
your propulsion vector is not in line with your direction of travel (your body's centre line), meaning you kick behind your body instead of symmetrically below and above (ie down and up-kick). you can see that your down-kick is only going as low as your body's centerline, and your up-kick is well behind your body. in this way your kicks actually propel you at a slightly downwards directed angle rather than straight forward.
weight yourself neutral and adjust body position and you will find kicking to become more relaxed and symmetrical.
if you weight yourself neutrally buoyant (neckweight) you would have less of a problem with that since you don't need to kick yourself "down" to avoid floating to the surface.
also, your arms overhead position shows somewhat limited shoulder flexibility. not being able to keep the arms overhead AND stremalined in a relaxed manner leads to a compensation whereby the lower back is arched as you can see in the movie. this in turn makes kicking symetrically more difficult
your head position is slightly overextended. if you keep your arms at the side and drop the chin some more you wil have a less arched lower back leading to a more relaxed and symmetrical kick.
2. your kicks are shallow and fast
as has been mentioned. try slower and wider kicks without too much knee bend. you will have better fin control as well as less turbulence and drag. make sure your kick is symetrical and that you use the up-kick to counter the down-kick.
changing kicking style will certainly feel different as muscle effort is shifted to other groups and it will take a while to familiarize yourself with the new variation. don't take that initial impression as a sign of "inefficiency". remember, that your current style is something you are very accustomed to over many years of experience.
one thing that helps is to film yourself on ascent as this is usually the most naturally relaxed, balanced and symmetrical body position. compare your kick and body position on ascent with your descent and dynamic. ideally there shouldn't be any difference in form.
3. some thoughts on arms-overhead
drag increases exponentionally with speed. swimming with arms at the side will allow better upper body relaxation (o2 conservation). if you swim rather slowly anyways the o2 saving will be more beneficial than the extra little bit of streamlining as you don't disturb the water much anyways. if you sprint, on the other hand, you want to be as streamlined as possible, but it will cost you a lot of o2 to maintain a tight and streamlined body position.
seeing that you primarily spear you'll probably look for better dive times. extra relaxation in that case will probably be more beneficial for you.
4. what fin?
about your fin question, i'd always go for something softer rather than something harder. softer fins allow much better movement control with the benefit of great output from better technique. also, you'll be more relaxed in the upper body which gives you better o2 conservation and divetimes. hard fins are probably more for sprinters and real men
i'm primarily diving with bi-fins. even though i have c4 80's i usually use some old cressi gara ld's (the soft ones) as they are just fine. comfortable, reliable, care free, cheap and definitely good enough for easy, repetitive dives in the 20m range.
hope that made some sense
thoughts anyone?
roland
1. your kick is asymetrical (relative to your body position)
your propulsion vector is not in line with your direction of travel (your body's centre line), meaning you kick behind your body instead of symmetrically below and above (ie down and up-kick). you can see that your down-kick is only going as low as your body's centerline, and your up-kick is well behind your body. in this way your kicks actually propel you at a slightly downwards directed angle rather than straight forward.
weight yourself neutral and adjust body position and you will find kicking to become more relaxed and symmetrical.
if you weight yourself neutrally buoyant (neckweight) you would have less of a problem with that since you don't need to kick yourself "down" to avoid floating to the surface.
also, your arms overhead position shows somewhat limited shoulder flexibility. not being able to keep the arms overhead AND stremalined in a relaxed manner leads to a compensation whereby the lower back is arched as you can see in the movie. this in turn makes kicking symetrically more difficult
your head position is slightly overextended. if you keep your arms at the side and drop the chin some more you wil have a less arched lower back leading to a more relaxed and symmetrical kick.
2. your kicks are shallow and fast
as has been mentioned. try slower and wider kicks without too much knee bend. you will have better fin control as well as less turbulence and drag. make sure your kick is symetrical and that you use the up-kick to counter the down-kick.
changing kicking style will certainly feel different as muscle effort is shifted to other groups and it will take a while to familiarize yourself with the new variation. don't take that initial impression as a sign of "inefficiency". remember, that your current style is something you are very accustomed to over many years of experience.
one thing that helps is to film yourself on ascent as this is usually the most naturally relaxed, balanced and symmetrical body position. compare your kick and body position on ascent with your descent and dynamic. ideally there shouldn't be any difference in form.
3. some thoughts on arms-overhead
drag increases exponentionally with speed. swimming with arms at the side will allow better upper body relaxation (o2 conservation). if you swim rather slowly anyways the o2 saving will be more beneficial than the extra little bit of streamlining as you don't disturb the water much anyways. if you sprint, on the other hand, you want to be as streamlined as possible, but it will cost you a lot of o2 to maintain a tight and streamlined body position.
seeing that you primarily spear you'll probably look for better dive times. extra relaxation in that case will probably be more beneficial for you.
4. what fin?
about your fin question, i'd always go for something softer rather than something harder. softer fins allow much better movement control with the benefit of great output from better technique. also, you'll be more relaxed in the upper body which gives you better o2 conservation and divetimes. hard fins are probably more for sprinters and real men
i'm primarily diving with bi-fins. even though i have c4 80's i usually use some old cressi gara ld's (the soft ones) as they are just fine. comfortable, reliable, care free, cheap and definitely good enough for easy, repetitive dives in the 20m range.
hope that made some sense
thoughts anyone?
roland
Hi roy,
I ask to my USA distributor, he said:
Blue Water Hunter in Santa Barbara www.blueh20.com
Or directly on www.c4-usa.com
Ciao,
Natalia
thank you Natalia.
Blue Water Hunter website isn't coming up. Is there another source in my area that would have a pair to try on before purchasing ?
Blue Water Hunter website isn't coming up. Is there another source in my area that would have a pair to try on before purchasing ?
Nata has a typo in the link. It spells blue-h-twenty, not blue-h-2-o
This one works: Freediving and Spearfishing at the Blue Water Hunter - Deep Thought Custom Wet Suits
This one works: Freediving and Spearfishing at the Blue Water Hunter - Deep Thought Custom Wet Suits
Here is my new tech, you were right i feel heaps better in my kick and keeping my arms there relaxes me much more not putting strain on my lungs.
Thank you to all who helped me ,know all i have to do is just perfect it i will say the difference from before i was doing around 75m and after a couple of goes im hitting 87m rofl
[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3KjlGkPDW6Q]YouTube - dive training[/ame]
Thank you to all who helped me ,know all i have to do is just perfect it i will say the difference from before i was doing around 75m and after a couple of goes im hitting 87m rofl
[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3KjlGkPDW6Q]YouTube - dive training[/ame]