RA Caranx: 2 x 16mm rubbers or 1 x 20mm? Open or closed muzzle?

[giddyuptiger]

I'm looking at the 1.1 Rob Allen Caranx and have the option to either run 2 16's or 1 20mm rubber. My thoughts were to run just one 16 and keep the other as a spare on the float.

I know it's a 7mm shaft but in oz they're running all RA guns on 7mm and both the sparid and scorpia only running one 16mm so my thoughts are the caranx will work fine with a 16mm.

My theory is I'll be doing a bit of rock hopping with less viz and smaller fish (2-3kg) for half the time so the 16mm seems like it would be more apt and then on the occasion when i'm on a boat chasing kingies then i could run both 16's?

The other question I have is open vs closed muzzle, I've read a bit about this on the forum but wouldn't mind some fresh insights.

Nb, I had posted this in the meet and greet section before realizing this is where it belonged.

 

[stingaree]

a single 16mm, 60cm rubber band is all you need for your 110cm gun with a 160cm shaft, it will get kingies with no worries, as well as all reef sp. I found a 160cm shaft works the bestest with that rubber combo, the shorter shaft (which is sold with the gun) needs a longer (weaker) rubber, otherwise looses accuracy and weaker rubbers = less power. Closed or open? Well it is just what you get used to really.

 

[giddyuptiger]

I found a 160cm shaft works the bestest with that rubber combo, the shorter shaft (which is sold with the gun) needs a longer (weaker) rubber...

why would a shorter shaft require a longer rubber? wouldn't you want a shorter rubber on it to increase power?

thanks.

 

[stingaree]

why would a shorter shaft require a longer rubber? wouldn't you want a shorter rubber on it to increase power?
thanks.

you overpower the gun and your shots will end up too high or missing the target, very frustrating - been there. Some say they learn to compensate by aiming bellow, not sure, I prefer to hit exactly where I aim, only taking the distance and fish speed into account and for that I found a single 16mm/60cm rubber powering 160cm/7mm shaft to work best for 110 guns (rubbers cca. 1/2 the barrel length + 5cm for shafts with approx. 40cm overhang from the end of the muzzle). I would only put stronger rubbers (twin) if using 7.5 - 8mm shafts.

 

[johnnyp]

yea, stick with the single rubber, either 16 or 18/19/20.

2 rubbers sounds good in theory but its a pain in the ass having to load. just get used to loading a tighter single one and its quick and easy.

not sure what the other fella was talking about longer spears. if your gun is accurate for you, then good. its more about consistency, so if ur gun shoots the same everytime, get used to the trajectory of the shaft and you'll be accurate.

as for open/closed, i started with open because i like how the shaft is 'locked' into the rail and it offers a nice clear sight line. i have since started using a closed muzzle now as it is quicker and easier to load. also, you dont have to fully rig the shooting line to shoot, just thread the shaft, load and shoot. but again thats personal opinion.

 

[Unclejake]

Agreed. With a RA1100 a single 16 rubber is fine on kingfish and is great on reef fish.

I would not have an open muzzle again. They take longer to load than a closed muzzle - especially if there is a bit of swell (I have both open and closed guns).

EDIT: What Johnnyp said

 

[giddyuptiger]

thanks guys, really appreciate your help. i can now trust that i'm making an informed decision and can't wait to get my hands on an ra 1.1!

 

[Unclejake]

Just one more observation Giddyup: I bought an alloy RA1100 last year and found it a bit nose heavy. I am really, really lazy so the slight pressure on my hand (trying to keep the gun pointed horizontally) bothered me.

I went back to the retailer suggesting that we shorten the shaft a touch, but the retailer suggested we re-barrel the gun with carbon fibre.

I like simple, strong things and had believed carbon to be a bit of a gimmick, but I agreed to the change and the transformation is noticeable. The gun is better balanced and much lighter.

I am certain I could have achieved similar balance results with some careful ballasting - but if the cost difference is not prohibitive then consider moving directly to a carbon RA1100. In hindsight that is what I should have done.

Regards,
UJ

 

[SpearAddict]

Good choice
Like everybody I also think you should get the 16mm bands.
I got 2 RA 1300mm and 1600mm who each have 2x16mm bands.
works terific.
Bring the two bands and just unload one when you get to close from the rocks.
Once you get a good reloading routine, it's no big deal. If you interrested i'll explain it to you.

But I really think you should have an open muzzle on a SG that is more than one meter.
As far as i experienced it, it is a way faster to reload longer guns with an open muzzle. And RA got a really good open muzzle that allow you to pass the string on both side of the muzzle, so it dosen't matter on which side the string went while you reload. (so important)

have fun

 

[giddyuptiger]

But I really think you should have an open muzzle on a SG that is more than one meter.

Thanks mate, indeed I've decided on a 1.1 (jack of all trades) open muzzle RA rail gun. I'm not sure which one it is because from all the distributers/retailers and general folk I've spoken too none can tell me the difference between a sparid to a caranx to a tuna.

The guys who i'm gonna get it from (who have been great re customer service) say i'm technically getting a caranx but the gun has a "tuna" sticker on it so go figure? At some point I heard that the trigger mech was different as you went up the scale (less plastic or something) but if these guys can switch stickers out on their guns then who knows what your getting).

Might I add, that on no US sight did I see any RA gun identified as either a S, C or T. They just all say rail guns.

Anyway, final spec's will be 7mm shaft, 1.1m, 2 x 16mm bands plus 1 shortened 16mm band thrown in for good measure (the owner of the store is pretty awesome).

Thanks so much for all your help, I've gone from knowing absolutely nothing about guns to just a little.

 

[johnnyp]

sounds like ur getting a mix of a tuna and caranx.

the tuna as 2x16mm rubbers and a 7.5mm shaft
the caranx has 1x19mm rubber and a 7mm shaft.

i started off with the same setup as your getting, but moved to a single 19 for ease of loading. once you get used to loading back a 19mm its not hard and it gives similiar power to 2x16's without extra loading time and tangle potential.

nice choice on first gun tho, you'l have a ball. have you visited spearoz.org?
btw, well done on the kingy.

 

[giddyuptiger]

johnnyp,

waiting to get accepted on spearoz, applied about 3 weeks ago! re gun, as long as they have the same trigger mech (apparently the caranx goes to metal or something over the sparid?) I'm happy.

I wont use the dual 16mm, will take one off, start with that, then move to the shortened 16mm and once i've gotten used to loading those will move to an 18 or 19. I spoke to RA and he said the guns were designed to be used with a single 20mm rubber. I just need to build up the technique to load it (after the sea hornet that's gonna take some getting used to). In saying that i might switch out to the shortened 16mm if i'm just playing around the rocks for blackies or what not. Not point in overpowering the thing.

Btw if you guys are interested in joining the St. George Spearfishing Club on Facebook, here's the link. It's just been set up.

St. George Spearfishing & Freediving Club | Facebook

 

[johnnyp]

yea, spearoz is having a few probs with their server atm i think...

as far as i knew, all RA's had the same mech. however, recently they released a new mech which may only be available in the tuna. (i think theyre discontinuing the caranx).

utube loading a euro gun. makes it heaps easier if you have a loading pad on your sternum. if you dont have one there, just glue a piece of rubber on the front where you normally load.

 

[giddyuptiger]

utube loading a euro gun. makes it heaps easier if you have a loading pad on your sternum. if you dont have one there, just glue a piece of rubber on the front where you normally load.

just got a new cressi w/ loading pad. look forward to trying it out. checked the vid's looks easy enough, just gotta switch from loading off my hip to my chest.

thanks, mate

 

[mundial]

if you use 7 mm spear use 2 X 16 mm
if you want 1 sling use the 6.6 spear
i am talking from experience with RA guns
i am using RA 120 carbon 7 mm spear on 2 X 16

 

[giddyuptiger]

if you use 7 mm spear use 2 X 16 mm
if you want 1 sling use the 6.6 spear
i am talking from experience with RA guns
i am using RA 120 carbon 7 mm spear on 2 X 16

even if you're hitting 1-2kg fish? If so duly noted.

 

[mundial]

even if you're hitting 1-2kg fish? If so duly noted.

well i will explane myself
first the rubbers or slings have nothing to do with the fish targeted
this is pure ballistics
if you use 7 mm spear on this gun 16 mm 1 band will be very soft & not strong
if you use a 20 mm band this will be better to use
but you can also use a 6.6 spear with 1 band 20 mm
or a 7 mm spear with 2 X 16 mm bands that will be perfect to this gun

if you use it in reef than you will need a 90 cm gun not a 110
why to use a 110 gun for small fish on a reef?

about RA models
i understood that
CARANX is aluminium barrel 1 X 20 rubber & spear 7 or 6.6 sizes 90,100.110
Tuna is aluminium barrel 2 X 16 rubber & spear 7 mm sizes ,110,120,130,140
the carbon models called Shanti & ZULU
good luck mate
in any way RA is a great choice

 

[foxfish]

I am with mundial on this one, in fact I think I already told you pretty much the same thing.
As it happens you do seem to have some supporters of a single 16, 7mm spear on a 110 but, personly I just cant see how that would be a very efficient combination?

 

[giddyuptiger]

Yup, I definitely agree, wont be going for anything less than 2x16 and when I get the hang of that I'll go to 1 X 18 or 19. From what I hear the 20 is no easy feat to load.

Thanks for all your help, indeed it often takes hearing the same thing a couple of times before it sinks into my thick head.

 

[foxfish]

20mm can be a tricky band to master but, its just about technique & commitment.
I am looking forward to when you first try out the double 16 combo