Rigging a sit-on kayak for spearfishing?

[bgill]

I just bought an Emotion brand SOT Kayak called the "Fisherman". I won't be doing too much hook & line fishing with it. I mainly got it as a freedive/spearing platform.

It was regularly $699.00 at Cabelas. I picked mine up on sale for $309.00!!!!

I just COULD'NT pass that up! What a steal! Anyway I thought this post was supposed to be about rigging up Kayaks for SPEARFISHING. It sounds like you guys are talking more hook & line fishing .

I'd love to see pictures of some of you guy's Yaks. I'm off to the garage to "stare" at my kayak for awhile & contemplated customization jobs on it. Then I'm off to the lake to try it out!!!!:t

 

[Lockedin]

Are any of you using an anchor?
What size?
How is it rigged?

I was out this weekend (bad vis, so I angled a bunch of short Halibut), and the wind and current were so strong that my buddy & I put our 5 gallon buckets in the water as sea anchors, and rafted together to slow our drift through the kelp bed. Eventually, I used the kelp and a surfing leash to tie off to a few thick strands of kelp. I don't know if an anchor would have worked in this current / wind combo, but I have been looking into getting an anchor for a while now.

 

[Mr. X]

Are any of you using an anchor?

Hi Locked in. I still haven't dived from my yak - just kayak around usually trolling a handline. However, I do have an anchor and some thoughts about it -- others will probably disagree. Each to they're own.

My anchor is a cheap but good 1.5 Kg K&S folding anchor (grapnel style). I have equipped it with a stainless steel shackle, a weak-link (but tied so not currently "active" -- weak-link: good for angling bad for diving), a short galvanised chain (from a very big shark hook) and a good quality but inexpensive (3 or 6 strand?) sinking, nylon rope - around 6-8mm. Can't recall how long the rope is but its pretty long 30-60m. At the boat end I have a thick bungee the same diameter as the rope (like your surf leash), as a shock absorber -- I had it hanging around for several years. I also have a lobster pot marker buoy (salvaged from the beach) on the end.

HOWEVER, that's OTT and I usually don't carry it because it's too big & too much hassle. That's not good. The usual recommendations for boat anchors e.g. get a big one, use a strong, long rope & chain if you can are all still good -- but I think you can & should scale it down, quite a lot, for a kayak - depending on your plans (if you prefer heavy seas, big heavy yaks, deep dives, etc. adjust accordingly).

Here's what I would do different if I were starting over:

- get a smaller anchor (I certainly would not go any bigger than my 1.5Kg one, which is plenty big enough). The common 0.7Kg size might be a bit small though.

- I'd use a thinner rope, possibly shorter (as I don't dive deep & rope can take up a lot of room). Mil-spec. nylon parachute cord is very strong for its diameter. Miles mentioned you can get a marine version (he used 3mm on his reels). Or RAs cheap, strong poly float line. Something strong & cheap around 4-6mm is probably ideal for a kayak IMHO.

- forget the chain, shackle & buoy (& possibly the bungee), just tie directly to the anchor on with an anchor bend & check the end regularly. This greatly simplifies the rig, reducing bulk, weight & cost (good if you have to abandon it). You can use you buoyancy aid or spearing float instead of the marker buoy, if you need to leave the anchor in place for some reason.

- get a small stuff sack to store it in (e.g. kids swim bags from Tescos £1, or something smaller).

The main advantage of the above would be that it would greatly increase the liklihood that I would carry the anchor & therefore that I would use it.

Just my 2 cents worth.

 

[portinfer]

Bad ears so took the yak out last weekend for some spinning. Set a small trot line with mackerel (thanks Dave) before I went plugging ... just in case I didn't have any luck plugging.

Didn't achor - just drifted around the reefs plugging with a floating one but no luck after an hour - pulled the trot and had a nearly 6 pound bass and a fine pair of bream ! Doesn't beat spearfishing but does provide some fish.

Bought some other lures too but seem to be happier with surface floaters... can see where they are.

 

[Mr. X]

I didn't know what a trot line was but got the basic idea from your post & some of OMD's last year. I found this: How to Make Your Own Trot Line

Did you stick a big float on one end and a heavy weight on the other?

BTW the Maria lures cast very well, I've yet to try my new Maria Angel Kiss 115cm mackeral lure but I have high hopes for it (it glows in the dark!). I lost a Maria BW last year -- the shallower Angel Kiss should be harder to loose:
https://www.veals.co.uk/acatalog/Sub_Surface.html

Shakespeare have come out with some really interesting, inexpensive lures for less than half the price of the Marias e.g. a J-11-like lure that is heavier & holographically patterned but less than half the price of the original - although it is brittle plastic rather than balsa - so more likely to break. They also had a small, heavy popper, not unlike the Grauvells in shape.

Fishing from a kayak, you can at least move towards a snagged lure, with some hope of being able to free it. Have you considered trolling any Eddystone eel? Cheap & relatively snag free.

 

[portinfer]

Yes - got some good advice from Tom on spinngin kit and bought a couple of plugs from Veals - went for a Yo-Zuri Mag popper in blue colour - 5 inch / 1 oz... works well and is nice to look at too !
Got a blue Maria ANgel Kiss and a J-11 and a Bass Bandit - all from Veals.

Didn't get time to try them today from the kayak (water supply to house required) but did have a 45 min plugging session after work on Friday from the rocks - no results but nice to chill out.

Might try an eddystone but am scared that there will be too many thinkgs to think about ! Happy to paddle out - set a trot - do some pluggin - pull the trot and heas home

 

[Mr. X]

...Might try an eddystone but am scared that there will be too many thinkgs to think about ! Happy to paddle out - set a trot - do some pluggin - pull the trot and heas home

Sounds good. Trolling the Eddystone eel has become almost automatic for us, we just let it out & forget about it, its pretty snag/maintenance free. Just be careful coming into shore near mooring ropes or bathers, otherwise leave we leave it out & recoil it on the winder after landing (caught a pollock like that once).

Tried the Maria Angel Kiss 110mm mackeral yesterday, it cast well for such a small lure, although perhaps not far as the slightly bigger BW. I switched to a bigger, deeper diving lure (from SeaFishIreland/ebay) as I was at Chesil, which is deep & is relatively snag free, especially this time of year. Caught nowt but only fished for 20mins before diving -- all the fish were at one end of the beach I discovered & then only small pollock.

 

[portinfer]

Mr x - This is something I've noticed. I went diving where I go plugging.

The shore cascades down over kelp covered boulders and then onto coarse sand with the occasional clump of kelp. The weed/sand edge is about 10m out from the shore (underwater) and then the depth is about 8m to 10m.

All the fish are at the bottom around the weed/sand edge.

So if I am plugging I want to be fishing 10m out and 10m down.

I can get the horizontal distance either by casting or by using a kayak but the depth ... hmmm the depth... 10m is deep for the plugs I have !

Any ideas ? Rapala Sliver ?

 

[Mr. X]

Funny, I've been thinking of ways fishing deeper recently. As mentioned above, I tried a v. large, big lipped floating diver which worked well at Chesil (although probably intended for trolling from a boat). I could feel it drag along the bottom when I wound it too quickly, which also caused a very noticeable increase in drag. Letting off tension allowed it to eventually float back up, so you can control the depth. Something smaller might catch more. I think there is a big-lip version of the new Rapala X-rap lures. I have a regular X-Rap 10 and it dives quite well - not super deep but much more than the Marias.

The big lip lure mentioned about is something like a sliver but bulkier (intended to look like a small mackeral) & not jointed. I have been thinking about getting a sliver - it was the first lure I saw last year but was £17.50 in Beer which put me off!! (I recently saw them for sale on the web for £7 or £8, which is more reasonable). I think they look a lot like the bait fish I see all the time so would probably work very well. Not sure how heavy they are though. I think they were intended for trolling behind a boat, so you might need some supplemental weight if casting them(?).

The other thing I have but have yet to try are some cheap but very cool looking gel lures in various colours/patterns than come with a 30g-ish weight in the head and a single hook coming out of the top (so it shouldn't snag). I was wondering if this might be something to try for flatties; perhaps with a trolling mark or some white beads. They might be too big though(?). I know v. little about flatties.

I have also been planning to try an AtomicHaggis-style flattie rig & my father-in-law is keen to use bait. Getting fresh bait is a problem for us though, being far from the sea. I'll probably spear something for him to use as bait next time we go somewhere. We both have spinning rods rated for 10g-60g, which is very light for seafishing with bait but probably just about usable. I've been thinking of getting a slightly heavier rod, maybe 2.5lb TC? (I think that's the next size up from our current spinning rods but could be wrong) that could handle spinning & bait, no hurry though (fishing advice from Guernsey always welcome!).

I think predatory fish might like to attack fish above them though - so maybe somewhere above the bottom is better? I saw a pollock launch itself up toward baitfish at the surface once. I also notice bass are sometimes hooked on the middle treble of lures - suggesting they came from below (although most pics I've seen feature poppers & shallow divers, so perhaps that is inevitable).

Any chance of some details on your trot line - for example how do you anchor it & mark it? Do you use different baits and/or fish at various depths to help vary the catch? Use big hooks/bait to deter smaller fish? Is like the one shown at the link above?

 

[sunfish]

I've been thinking of setting a trot from my kayak too. How do you deal with all those hooks in the confines of a kayak Portinfer? I know about the box with slots for hooks but could you explain the exact setting and lifting please. eg.Do you take each hook from the slot by hand or does the first weight you drop star pulling them out automatically? If so, do you tilt the box? Are the hooks baited in advance? Are crabs likely to strip the baits?

 

[Mr. X]

...could you explain the exact setting and lifting please..

I too am curious as to how you retrieve this thing. With multiple fish, including a near 6lb bass, I would imagine things could get quite interesting.

 

[foxfish]

In some ways the smaller, lighter the craft you use to set a long line the better. However setting long lines is a potentially dangerous pastime & I am not sure if I want to encourage it on an open forum? Ed has had fist hand knowledge at setting trotts from several people before he began setting his own. There are also conservation issues because although more selective than nets they can still kill a lot of unwanted fish! This can be avoided to some extent by selecting bait & placement.
Great fun when it goes right but very dangerous if you get it wrong.

 

[portinfer]

I am tending to lean towards what Mart just said. But I guess people may try this anyway so this is what I did - make up your own minds.

The first time I set it was in 10m to 15m of water in a place I know well from spearing (as far as I am aware I am the only person to dive there so wasn't too concerned about other divers).

I had 15 size 4 hooks set at about 6 foot apart (a two arm stretch).
I baited with mackerel strip.

I went out mid afternoon with a swell of 1ft (magic seaweed stats) and 0 knot wind. Sea was glassy and I knew which way the currrent was going.

I had made the line up before by rolling it around a piece of foam offcut. (You need to reverse the hook snood wraps from the main wrap as you wind on - same when picking up).

I attached a 4 pound weight to the end of the line and baited the hooks as I laid the line. I think I baited about 4 hooks when the weight hit the bottom. From that point you really need to pay attention to the side the line is going out and the drift from the current. With a tide over 2m (ie 2.5m or 3m plus) the drift in that area will not pull the kayak more than you can just hold. i.e. no need for any stop device on the side of the kayak - however you would be well advised to have one so as to avoid being pulled in by all the rest of the hooks / being pronged by a hook etc etc

But then again if you have a shallow sided yak you may be capsised by this method. As you can see this is a serious and potential accident waiting to happen either way !

Anyway, once all the hooks are baited you should be drifting away from the original set spot and the likne should be stretched out over the sand (only sand will do... DO NOT set over rocks).

I tied the end of the line to another weight (6 pound) and then from here attached a line intended to rise vertically to a float.

I left it and went plugging for a short period - picking it up is a matter of picking up the float - winding in the line (reverse the wind for the hook snoods). Take the bait off as you wind. Again this is ONLY possible if the drift is less than the weight of the boat. I cannot itterate the importance of this - if you get it wrong you will be trying to pull a line of 15 plus hooks with it slipping through your hands... not good and potentially lethal.

As the fish come up I pulled them directly into the boat and put them straight onto a stringer attached to the yak. THen I unhooked them and carried on. A 6 pound bass is fine but I was dreading having to deal with either a large ray or a conger or a dogfish.

I don't think it would be possible to deal with these fish and then you have either the option to cut them off the snood at the hook (if they haven't pulled you in by then) or do something else equally unfriendly.

Once the last weight comes in I had the fish on the stringer and the line re-wrapped on the foam with the float line on a separate winder.

Now this was ideal tides and weather. And even then it wasn't easy. Much easier from say Mart's 18 foot (or is it longer?) dinghy as you still don't have much weight but you have more room to work in and you can attach a safety board stop to the side of the boat. Also you are not likely to be tipped over.

I only tried it cos I had bad ears and couldn't dive.

I tried it again last weekend or the one before.... what a change.

I set it on the high tide, got the drift wrong, hooked my leg three times, dropped it on the reef and not the sand, the swell was scary and it was getting dark. THe tide was much stronger and I found it very hard to set.

I decided to leave it overnight and so went to pick it up the next morning at fist light.... I do alot of kayaking and the seas were high with a cross swell of about 4 foot. No fun at all and I was on the point of being pitched several times. I couldn't get out to the line. I tried several hours later when a reef was protecting the place I dropped it. Managed to get to the linebut even at relatively slack water the current was too strong and I couldn't keep my place and pull the line.

You need three or four arms in a situation like this and I wouldn't advise trots unless you are very adept with your kayak and know the currents.

I don't think I will be trotting again until I know that the seas will be glassy smooth with no wind(summer) and even then might reduce it to 10 hooks which kind of negates the point of trotting.

Like Mart says you can end up killing alot of fish unecessarily.

I wanted to try it and am glad I did but like I say maybe a few times was enough. Live and learn.

 

[sunfish]

Thanks for that Portinfer, sounds a bit hairy alright. Like you I do a fair bit of kayaking but in swell like that I wouldn't want anything to do with hooks.
It's a bit off the subject of kayaks, but when I lived in N.E. England, I used to set one on the beach at extreme low tide on spring tides. I used worm, mussel or razors for bait and would catch codling, dabs and other flats. I used 10 or 12 hooks and mostly caught 2 to 4 fish. At each end of the line I had two 8oz grip leads, buried in the sand, and I usually ran a further 20yds of line back up the beach and buried the wooden winder. This meant I could haul the line before the tide went all the way back. If there were any dips in the beach, where sea coal and debris collected, this was a good place to set. Likewise any areas of wormcasts.

 

[Mr. X]

Excellent posts Foxfish, Portinfer & Sunfish. I take your warnings seriously. If I try something sometime in the future (and there is a good chance I will not!) it would no doubt be scaled back considerably & under mill pond conditions. Hopefully I'll get some first hand instructions from you guys at some point


6lb bass on #2 hook - interesting. I thought 0/2-0/4 would be the hook size to use for medium to big bass.

I was thinking bricks & partial bricks might make suitable weights cheaply (the ones with holes in perhaps). I like Sunfish's idea of using grip leads as I often recover them while diving and they are way too big for my light spinning rod. Perhaps setting from a beach during a low Spring tide would be safer way to start. How did you find your line afterwards -- did the you have paracord laying ontop of the sand? I suppose you leave it overnight (10 or 12 hours?). I don't think I've ever had the opportunity to do that. Although I know a cottage that would offer the ideal opportunity.:hmm Alt. perhaps a campsite on a beach.:hmm

 

[sunfish]

I layed the cord on the sand, buried the winder, then knocked an old cricket stump through the centre of the buried winder. The winder was made from two 18inch lengths of 2 by 1 and two 1ft lengths of thick broom handle, screwed into a square shape. The spider leads were 2 at each end, and buried 1ft deep.
House bricks would be too light-the sea would roll them. My uncle set a longer length and used the fishplates intended for joining lengths of railway line.(No, he didn't unbolt them from railway tracks!)

 

[Mr. X]

Great info. -- that probably saved me at least two failed attempts.

The fish plates idea is interesting. Mountaineers sometimes use flat aluminium plates, particularly in Scotland, called "deadmen" or flukes, which they bury at an angle as a belay anchor. They are quite light but bury easily & securely. They look like a pointed shovel head with a loop of steel cable coming out of the middle. The idea is that it will resist tension in the line &, if it moves, will gradually be pulled down further into the snow/ice/peat becoming increasingly a more solid anchor. I think they used a giant one on Top Gear a while back to rescue Jeremy Clarkson's Land Rover 3/4 of the way up a Scottish mountain. Perhaps it would be possible to make something similar out of a flat piece of steel, old shovel (come to think it, I have one).

 

[sunfish]

The fishplates were used because of their weight and didn't need burying. If I remember them right, they were about two feet long by six inches wide and one inch thick and made of steel. They may have been a little less but they were heavy to lift anyway. You wouldn't be hauling those up a beach. I suppose they were chosen because they already had holes in them, and in those days of coal and heavy industry there were plenty of them laying around.

 

[Mr. X]

The current issue of Total Sea Fishing magazine has an article on kayak fishing for bass. Not very indepth but the pictures of the kayak fishing gear was interesting e.g. huge handline-style winder used for the thin anchor line & chain, drogues. Also, the suggestion of using a condom as a waterproof case for cellphone/VHF radio (cheaper than an AquaPac).

Also, I notice Veals are selling a rod specifically intended for Kayak fishing: ABU Diamond Crest Boat (kayak special) £17.99

Interesting tip for cheaper kayak hatches in the section on rigging an Ocean Kayak Malibu 2: Kayak fishing

 

[the_milkman]

This thread is really extensive, and a lot of this has already been covered, but thought I'd share my spearo kayak experiences from last summer. The yak is a Malibu Pro2Tandem.

1. Buy a cart - I wanted to save cash and didn't bother, but kayak plus all your gear, weight belt, food, water are easily lugged to the beach by one person with a cart. I bought a 'Scupper Pup' from the States and lash it to the back of the yak when I'm out spearing. It's awesome and breaks down very small.

2. GPS is not essential but really, really helpful. Not only as has been discussed is it a great backup / safety device, but just awesome for logging marks, wrecks, etc. Also very useful in helping you gauge distance / speed / time esp if there is a current running. Also can set an anchor alert so if the anchorage slips and you start drifting, you can hear it. Very useful if you leave your missus on the kayak whilst you spear!! lol

3. Rod holders are awesome for trolling, and also for using the yak when viz is shite, you can still fish. But tie the rods on as well! I lost 2 rods this year when some friends capsized my yak in relatively calm seas (broadsided by a freak wave). In fact, lash and stow anything that moves. As I learnt the hard way, it's not IF you capsize, but WHEN.

4. Comfy seats! Do it! First long paddle and you won't even be thinking about how much they cost every again! Also great for adding additional storage on the backs that saves deck space / clutter.

5. Dive flag - don't bother - too much faf, gets in the way, I lost mine after a couple of days. I tie my float to the back of the yak, and use the alpha flag on that to indicate I've left the boat. The type of people that are a danger on the water to the kayaker / spearo don't know what the flag means anyway... (I'm thinking here of a specific incident at Old Harry Rocks last summer when a 40ft sunseeker type thing chock-full of t*ssers made a half mile deviation from its course to power past me at full tilt, 10 feet from the yak and wave - makes my blood boil just thinking about it!)

6. Velcro paddle holders make great fixing points for spearguns. I got a whole load from TopKayaker.net

7. I lash my weight belt to a length of 4ft para cord and stash it in the rear tank well of the yak. That way, I can suit up, slip into the water, retrieve the belt and put it on, but if it slips it doesn't sink to the bottom. I stash mask and snorkel in the rear pouch on the back of my seat. I wear the long johns from my diving suit with a waterproof but breathable top for the paddle, and place the top half of the wetsuit over my seat for extra padding! Fins get lashed in the front tank well.

8. Anchoring - hardest thing in the yak. I so often had anchorages slip, or snag, nearly capsized trying to retrieve etc. etc. By far the easiest and safest way is to dive down and place, then retrieve when finished.

9. Using the yak to go spearing ROCKS!! Just make sure you allow yourself the whole day you will want to stay out!! You can move spots with the tide, sunbath and picnic in between dives, get to very secluded spots...

New addition for this season - portable Marine VHF - am doing the operator's licence soon. I want to get a bit more adventurous, but you need to take kayaking as seriously as any other boating...