Salvimar pneumatic vs salvimar roller gun?

[Aston.M]

Hi all,
Greetings from NZ. I’m trying to decide between the Salvimar predathor vuoto and the salvimar wild carbo roller gun. Probably in 100cm. I like the concept behind the pneumatic spearguns as I’m a mechanic but I like the look of the roller gun with a few more metal parts and the carbon fibre. I’m 6ft and pretty fit so loading either shouldn’t be a problem. Both are currently the same price from scubastore.com. Which do you guys think is best?

 

[FrostyToes]

Hi there! I'm more than chuffed after using my Cressi Saetta Pro for a month. For me at least, accuracy is unmatched compared to a bandgun - and the fish over here seem less disturbed by the noise it makes when firing (vacuum muzzle). I tend to aim with the sights which seems to save some time lining up the shot, whereas I point and shoot with a bandgun. If I was you I'd wait until Salvimar releases their 2022 line of Predathor, which will ship configured with a 7.5mm 17-4ph stainless steel shaft. That's what my Saetta has and it's tough as shark tits compared to regular stainless. I'm waiting for Cressi to improve their line release, which currently gives a really responsive trigger but gets tangled up in weeds. If they don't my next purchase will be a longer Predathor next year. The power and precision from pneumatics beats anything in their price class from what I've seen...

 

[Aston.M]

Hi there! I'm more than chuffed after using my Cressi Saetta Pro for a month. For me at least, accuracy is unmatched compared to a bandgun - and the fish over here seem less disturbed by the noise it makes when firing (vacuum muzzle). I tend to aim with the sights which seems to save some time lining up the shot, whereas I point and shoot with a bandgun. If I was you I'd wait until Salvimar releases their 2022 line of Predathor, which will ship configured with a 7.5mm 17-4ph stainless steel shaft. That's what my Saetta has and it's tough as shark tits compared to regular stainless. I'm waiting for Cressi to improve their line release, which currently gives a really responsive trigger but gets tangled up in weeds. If they don't my next purchase will be a longer Predathor next year. The power and precision from pneumatics beats anything in their price class from what I've seen...

Thanks for the reply. Yeah I’m leaning towards the pneumatic for it’s accuracy and I’ll be able to mount sightings or a GoPro on it very easily. Waiting for next year’s ones with the new shafts wouldn’t be ideal cause im going on a week long diving trip early January and would like it for that. I’ll buy one or two of the 17-4ph shaft for it once they’re out.

 

[FrostyToes]

No problem. Make sure to pick up a pack of nozzle seals just in case. I spray some silicone lube in the nozzle after every dive. Loading is very much a technique over strength issue. Begin low pressure and before you know it you'll be overpowering the factory specs and shooting spears straight through fish - which may or may not become an annoyance depending on how thick your gloves are and how you attach the shooting line. I'm shooting the same and bigger fish with my 70cm Saetta as I was with a 100cm bandgun, may be down to accrued experience but I reckon one can afford to go down a size with a pneumo.

 

[Aston.M]

No problem. Make sure to pick up a pack of nozzle seals just in case. I spray some silicone lube in the nozzle after every dive. Loading is very much a technique over strength issue. Begin low pressure and before you know it you'll be overpowering the factory specs and shooting spears straight through fish - which may or may not become an annoyance depending on how thick your gloves are and how you attach the shooting line. I'm shooting the same and bigger fish with my 70cm Saetta as I was with a 100cm bandgun, may be down to accrued experience but I reckon one can afford to go down a size with a pneumo.

I ordered it yesterday and yeah I got some a spare damping bushing and o rings. I also got a 17-4ph shaft for it. As for the length of the speargun I was unsure about it as I couldn’t really find any threads on the topic so I got the 100. Hopefully it won’t be overkill.

 

[stefpix]

I only use pneumatics.
I started with some Mako band speargun. The pneumatics have less recoil, more power, shorter size.
My shots are much more accurate with the pneumatics than band guns.

I have had the salvimar predathor 65.. now I use the 55 and 75. I got the 85, but rarely use it.
I can mount a go pro on the tip with a Velcro wrist mount or, better a GoPro large pipe mount. I get closer footage of fish I want to film.

With the 100 you should get wahoo or tuna. I got some 100 cm bass fish with the 55. The fish ends up always on the line. Mostly now I use the 75, but now that there is not much fish I am using the 55 more and I really enjoy it.

The 7mm inox steel shafts for guns longer than 65 have too much flex and are hard to load for me.
So I ordered the 17-4ph steel shafts that are great, they don’t rust and don’t flex.

The 8mm inox steel shafts don’t flex either but are heavier and wear out the muzzle seal quicker.

100cm sounds like a real long gun for blue water fish, or for places where you can shoot only from a large distance.
To load the 65 and 55 I just put the butt of my gun on my hip.
With the 75 and 85 I cross my feet and put the butt on my ankle. I pull with the arm and push with the legs at the end.
You may want to consider also a shorter gun if you shoot fish that is on reefs etc. I believe a 75 cm pneumatic is equivalent to a 100 cm band gun. Also most Salvimar pneumatics are 7cm longer than the stated length. So the 75 is actually 82 cm

 

[Aston.M]

I only use pneumatics.
I started with some Mako band speargun. The pneumatics have less recoil, more power, shorter size.
My shots are much more accurate with the pneumatics than band guns.

I have had the salvimar predathor 65.. now I use the 55 and 75. I got the 85, but rarely use it.
I can mount a go pro on the tip with a Velcro wrist mount or, better a GoPro large pipe mount. I get closer footage of fish I want to film.

With the 100 you should get wahoo or tuna. I got some 100 cm bass fish with the 55. The fish ends up always on the line. Mostly now I use the 75, but now that there is not much fish I am using the 55 more and I really enjoy it.

The 7mm inox steel shafts for guns longer than 65 have too much flex and are hard to load for me.
So I ordered the 17-4ph steel shafts that are great, they don’t rust and don’t flex.

The 8mm inox steel shafts don’t flex either but are heavier and wear out the muzzle seal quicker.

100cm sounds like a real long gun for blue water fish, or for places where you can shoot only from a large distance.
To load the 65 and 55 I just put the butt of my gun on my hip.
With the 75 and 85 I cross my feet and put the butt on my ankle. I pull with the arm and push with the legs at the end.
You may want to consider also a shorter gun if you shoot fish that is on reefs etc. I believe a 75 cm pneumatic is equivalent to a 100 cm band gun. Also most Salvimar pneumatics are 7cm longer than the stated length. So the 75 is actually 82 cm

Interesting, sounds like I might have to get the 65 or 75 as well as I do do a lot of reef diving.

 

[stefpix]

Interesting, sounds like I might have to get the 65 or 75 as well as I do do a lot of reef diving.

What fish do you target?
I think 100cm is long, for clear blue water. I saw a video on YouTube of a guy in Italy catch a tuna with a 100cm, close to shore, rocky.

I am in the USA, NY/East Coast, shore dives. With the 55 and 65 I can get plenty of fish, like striped bass, 10kg/almost a meter long. I get tautog/blackfish. Recently the water got colder, many fish migrated to warmer waters. SO I am using the 55 around the rock.

I got the 85 because I would see bluefish in the distance in the tidal current. But I find the 75 more flexible in use.
It has the power regulator.

But a 100 in around rocks may be overkill.
With the 75 I got Spanish mackerel, bluefish. striped bass.
The 65 on the hip is easier/faster to load.
The 55 is great for travel as it fits in regular check-in bags, so you can have a compact kit.

If you go on a boat maybe the 100 is great. but if you have never used a pneumatic the 55 and 65 are starter points.
The 65 is about 15cm longer than the 55. it is a bigger step than between the 65 and 75.
Also if you ever dive in poor visibility a shorter gun is much better.

It is good to have a spare gun anyway.
I would get the 65 Vuoto that comes with the inox shaft, or the 55 if a small portable gun is something you may like. The basic and plus models come with the crappy plated shaft, that after a few months tends to rust and oxidize. If you get those models you need to upgrade to an inox/stainless or 17-4PH shaft.

Probably the Salvimar 65 is equivalent in length to a Mares/Cressi/Seac 70 or 75.
If you are ordering from Scubastore, it may be worth getting all you need to have combined lower shipping.
The manometer/gauge is also nice to have to know how many bar/atmospheres the barrel is pressurized at and you can make adjustments. Buy also some oil and a spare piston and shock absorber. They are cheap, about $5,. It is good to change the oil once a year or every other year.
Anyway, these guns are nice. I lent the 55 to a friend who collects spearguns and wanted to buy an inverted roller, he got 3 fish in 15 min, never used a pneumatic and loved it. He said it was smooth, without recoil as a roller. But it is smaller and faster to reload.
Goood luck -

 

[marco15499]

Well, a 100 is not a "blue water" gun at all. Total length is like a 75 band gun and the power is like a 110 double banded. I have one that I use in murky water (10-20 ft visibility).
Here in Miami, my every day gun is a Cyrano 120.
Additionally, you have a power regulator that allows you to shoot into caves and rocks.
If you haven't ordered it, get the carbon fiber version Salvimar (Darkside) as it is neutral in the water.

 

[stefpix]

Well, a 100 is not a "blue water" gun at all. Total length is like a 75 band gun and the power is like a 110 double banded. I have one that I use in murky water (10-20 ft visibility).
Here in Miami, my every day gun is a Cyrano 120.
Additionally, you have a power regulator that allows you to shoot into caves and rocks.
If you haven't ordered it, get the carbon fiber version Salvimar (Darkside) as it is neutral in the water.

20ft is very good visibility here.
I have the 85, but I find the shorter ones like the 65 and 55 a lot more convenient around jetties and reefs.

People use the 100 to get tuna. I believe having a spare gun of different length is beneficial.
Shorter is easier to reload, so you can have it at a higher pressure,
I have the metal guns amd I don’t have issues with buoyancy. I attach a go pro at the end with the large tube mount or the Velcro wrist strap.

The carbon fiber darkside looks nice, but would you take it a first gun?€

 

[marco15499]

Everything depends on the visibility. If it is 5 meters or more and fish are big, I'll get the longest gun I can load. Again, a pneumatic is 40 cm shorter overall than its band equivalent and it has the power regulator.
Carbon barrel does make a difference in buoyancy with the Salvimar. I have a Predathor 115 (alluminum) and it is nose heavy. You can balance it with a float, but the carbon (Darkside) version is perfectly balanced.
BTW, I don't know why but Salvimars are 10 cm longer than their competitors equivalents.

And I won't go for tunas with a 100. Never.

 

[NiceGuy27]

I had a Predathor Darkside 100 for 3 years and loved it very much. It was my first speargun and I had no comparison.
I can tell you that the pneumatics are very hard to load. Personaly I would not go over 80cm. Or you will most likely have to load the gun against your feet in the water. Wich causes pain after the second load. Just imagine the power you split when loading tree bands..... you have to load the same energy at once with a pneumatic. so 80cm max is my tipp for you

Plus don't forget... If your pneumatic fails on holliday your fun is pretty much over. There is much less chance that this happens with a band gun.

I love my Pathos Sniper-R and would never change back to the predathor darkside.
Someone said that it ios easier to aim than a band gun.
It is not....
Imagine aiming with a 6cm broad barrel at something that is most likely not 6cm broad. Not good....
With a band gun you most likely have parts of the shafts in eye sight, wich helps very much with getting the right direction.

Cheers boys

 

[NiceGuy27]

if the water is very murky and you hunt big fish.... pneumatic could be the right choice.

 

[marco15499]

Well, I have been using my Cyrano for almost seven (7) years without fails. And the only thing I do is rinsing it with fresh water after each trip. I haven't even changed the oil. When it fails, it's time to get a brand new one as this has already paid itself. I've used it at least 3-4 times per month for 7 years. That's less than 50 cents per use. Simple maths.
Loading is more technique than strength. I can load a 120 cm comfortably (with an extension) and I'm 174 cm tall.

 

[marco15499]

 

[popgun pete]

Never had my pneumatic fail on a holiday and I have no trouble shooting fish with it. The band gun versus pneumatic debate has gone on for decades, but bar loading from the back end of the band gun there is not much practical difference in using them. The energy storage of a pneumatic is much more efficient than any band gun as rubber bands lose energy due to band soak and during the traverse there are no bands to thrum on the barrel of the pneumatic.

Bands have to be periodically replaced, whereas there is not much to do on a pneumatic but change the oil every two years. All spearguns need to be washed after a dive and allowed to dry off before stowing them in a carry bag. Bands need to be checked for damage in case there have been scratches or cuts, but this depends on the underwater terrain the gun has been used in and whether your gun has voyaged to the bottom without you holding it.

 

[FrostyToes]

I had a Predathor Darkside 100 for 3 years and loved it very much. It was my first speargun and I had no comparison.
I can tell you that the pneumatics are very hard to load. Personaly I would not go over 80cm. Or you will most likely have to load the gun against your feet in the water. Wich causes pain after the second load. Just imagine the power you split when loading tree bands..... you have to load the same energy at once with a pneumatic. so 80cm max is my tipp for you

Plus don't forget... If your pneumatic fails on holliday your fun is pretty much over. There is much less chance that this happens with a band gun.

I love my Pathos Sniper-R and would never change back to the predathor darkside.
Someone said that it ios easier to aim than a band gun.
It is not....
Imagine aiming with a 6cm broad barrel at something that is most likely not 6cm broad. Not good....
With a band gun you most likely have parts of the shafts in eye sight, wich helps very much with getting the right direction.

Cheers boys

I aim with the sights and compensate mentally for the offset spear, which on models like the Saetta Pro and Cyrano is pushed up higher in the barrel compared to traditional pneumos like the Predathor. Laser accuracy my man!

Heard from plenty Predathor owners that have practiced enough to become precision long range sharpshooters, so having an offset barrel isn't a necessity. I'll be picking up a Predathor to test the difference myself soon.

We all have our preferences, some folks dig a Harley whilst I'm more of a Goldwing kind of fella. In the end what brings you stoke is what counts...

 

[FrostyToes]

Hey Marco I really dig that setup. 13mm barrel? Is that a salvimar vacuum kit you have there on the muzzle? I am considering a cyrano for a future trip down to South Africa, may just have to copy your style!

 

[stefpix]

I had a Predathor Darkside 100 for 3 years and loved it very much. It was my first speargun and I had no comparison.
I can tell you that the pneumatics are very hard to load. Personaly I would not go over 80cm. Or you will most likely have to load the gun against your feet in the water. Wich causes pain after the second load. Just imagine the power you split when loading tree bands..... you have to load the same energy at once with a pneumatic. so 80cm max is my tipp for you

Plus don't forget... If your pneumatic fails on holliday your fun is pretty much over. There is much less chance that this happens with a band gun.

I love my Pathos Sniper-R and would never change back to the predathor darkside.
Someone said that it ios easier to aim than a band gun.
It is not....
Imagine aiming with a 6cm broad barrel at something that is most likely not 6cm broad. Not good....
With a band gun you most likely have parts of the shafts in eye sight, wich helps very much with getting the right direction.

Cheers boys

I believe if someone never used a pneumatic, it is more fun to start with a shorter one to get used with the loading technique.

I had my Predathor 65 fail after 5 years. There was a little sand in the piston and it was jammed. There was an air leak in the rear after i changed the piston, but that probably was due to some impact damage.

Anyway it is worth to change the oil and possibly the piston every year or 2 if you do shore dives, as sand may get in the barrel. Oil and pistons cost about 5/10 euros / dollars.
Now I converted my Predathor guns to dry barrel, thinner shafts, and less chances of sand entering the barrel.

I put a GoPro with a tube mount on my speargun, so feeling it front heavy is not an issue for me.