Solo Pool Training...

[naiad]

Aida should never condone or teach a best practise or series of solo safety limits. It is wholly correct only to teach Never Dive Alone and therefore we never need die alone.

I agree that AIDA should never condone or encourage solo diving.

The contradiction in this thread seems to be that we want to find some rules for the rule-breakers. The rule being broken would be 'never dive alone', but according to another thread, more than 80% of us do dive alone:

http://forums.deeperblue.net/forum12/poll91.html

It is understandable that none of the experts want to go any deeper into this matter than repeating the rule, and it is important to emphasize the dangers of training solo, yet apparently neither novices nor experienced divers are detered. Obviously, we are freediving solo.

Now rather than denying this, perhaps here is a good place to discuss it. What is the safest way to be unsafe? What can we do to not freak out other people in the pool? If you only have very limited pool time, say an hour, what's the best stretching routine, what kind of build-up can you do? How many times a week is beneficial, when does it become counter-productive?

I also agree that although the rule is 'Never Dive Alone', many freedivers break this rule sometimes. Therefore, given that this is a fact, and one that is unlikely to change, we should be able to discuss it openly. It is a fact that no kind of solo diving is ever going to be completely safe, but of course some things are much higher risk than others, and this is why discussion is a good thing.

Beginners should never be encouraged to dive alone, not only because it is against safety rules, but because they may not know their limits. When I went to my first pool training session, I had to read the safety booklet about what to do about a samba or blackout. I remember thinking "That would never happen to me! How can anyone not know they are going to pass out? I would always know when to stop!" A few weeks later I had a blackout. I know now why it happened, and it was totally avoidable, but at the time I was sure it wouldn't happen to me.

Lucia

 

[fcallagy]

There has been and always will be a hotly contested debate similar to this in scuba circles and solo scuaba divers are often looked at by others as mentally challenged as freedivers. I think the more experianced the diver the greater the sense of ability to get out of problems. Obviously you may have spare air/ reg etc. A lot would say if as an experianced diver and am buddied with a trainer then in effect you are diving alone. But BSAC stats of fatalities would show that most occur to solo divers or divers that lost/got seperated from buddies. as i said in a previous thread I dont think AIDA is collating these or anybody else or if its feasable to do so.

 

[cdavis]

A very pertinent thread.

I don't think any official organization can have any position other than "don't dive alone, period." None the less, most of us do it sometimes. Its good to talk about it. Much food for thought.

I agree totally that newbies should not dive alone at all. There is so much knowledge available to them. Combine theoretical knowledge with so little real world understanding of how their bodies work and you have a more dangerous situation than many of us older divers faced when we learned (mostly alone).

I speared alone for many years. Oh, I had buddies in the same ocean, but the reality was "alone." Pool practice is alone now. However, as the repeated warnings on this site and a PFI course slowly sank in, I have modified much of what I do to be much safer. Diving in salt water is almost always with a close buddy system. Deeper than 40 ft, always. In pool practice, I've learned from Glen Garrett to actively involve the guards in my dynamic practice. This actually works pretty good and feels safe, if it's done right. Mostly there are very few other people in the pool. For those who haven't followed older threads on this subject, "involving the guards" means they are watching you specificly, know when you start and react to eye contact when you surface. Glen goes through a complete competitive protocol, which is probably better than what I do. If conditions aren't right (too many swimmers, poor guard, etc) I don't do any distance.

None of this is perfect. I much prefer a real, live, trained buddy, all the time, but will take some risk for what I love.

Connor

 

[fcallagy]

Hi Connor,
Unfortunately I seem to remember that most fatalities occur not to newbies but to qualified/experianced divers who are taking "calculated" risks. I might be wrong about that but seem to remember something about it. A false sense of security or a feeling of we know our bodies etc so can tailor our training to suit how we feel if having an off day. It obviously only takes one mistake and theres none of us infallible except for me and the pope and I,m not sure about him. talking about reality is definatly better than pretending it doesn,t happen as it does. i don,t know was there ever a poll to see how many people here train alone and if there was how many of these are trained professionals or just practicing fools like myself .

 

[dannybuoy]

While i do understand AIDA's position on training or diving solo, i think a point could be made about why they should provide guidelines to the lone diver. Please allow me to play devil's advocate, or in this case, AIDA's prosecutor:

Part of AIDA's goal is to "set the standards for freedive education", worldwide. They do not approve of diving alone, and consequently do not include in their educational programmes any instructions for diving alone, and leave it at that. But as the worldwide organization, they operate in the real world, in which more than 80% of the sport's practitioners do dive alone. The reality AIDA has to face is that the rule -one they cannot possibly enforce, by the way- is being broken by a vast majority. As diving solo is an entirely different beast from diving with a buddy, with an entirely different set of rules and standards, those different rules and standards ought to be part of the education, along with all the valid reasons why one really shouldn't practise alone.

This isn't entirely contradictory or unhread of. Here in the Netherlands, for example, XTC is illegal, yet hords and hords of partying youth are taking the drug, and because it is illegal, many manufacturers of the drug aren't exactly upholding to the standards of what one would wish from one's MDMA, were one inclined to take such chemicals. As a consequence, some bad tabs are on the market, which are far more dangerous than the real thing. Now the government could have stuck to the priciple of it being illegal, but for once they were wise and sent testers to parties, so now you can have your pills tested at these parties and know what you are taking. It is still illegal and probably stupid, but there are a lot less fatalities thanks to the testers.

So AIDA's education standards are perhaps understandable, but there is an ostrich aspect to it that causes problems. The reality remains that we do dive alone, will keep diving alone, and would do so more safely if they'd just acknowldege that and include it into their educational program, so we can all benefit from shared knowledge. Diving solo certainly isn't ideal, but we don't live in an ideal world, now do we? AIDA is trying to set a standard that simply isn't, and will never be, a standard.

 

[jome]

It is very dangerous to think that just because you did something x times and nothing happened, there is no risk in it. There is always a risk in everything we do! We just make the decision of how we deal with it and usually ignore small ones.

There are 3 ways to react:
1. Be overwhelmed and decide to avoid the action that would lead to the risk
2. Get educated, understand the conditions, minimize the risk and then take the action (recommended way)
3. Ignore the risk and take a "leap of faith" (most dangerous)

Now with freediving, there is elevated risks. I mean you are ceasing a body function absolutely crucial to life support. Anyone who is stupid enough to kill them selves by not breathing truly deserves their Darwin award!

The key to not becoming one of those people is minimizing the risk. Like in most areas of life, this means using common sense. Just getting a buddy that is aware of what you're doing already eliminates a great portion of the risks involved. It does not get much easier that that and costs nothing...If you absolutely must dive alone, fine, but be aware that you will be taking huge risks if you ever dive even close to your limit. The harsh reality is that if you flirt with your performance limit when diving alone, you are flirting with a very stupid way to kill your self. It is obvious you MUST leave a huge margin for safety.

The dangerous thing about flirting with risks is, that if they don't realise, you will naturally start thinking that they don't exist. If you constantly take "leaps of faith" and survive, you will start to think nothing about what you're doing is dangerous. I'm sad to say, but a lot of freedivers fall into category 3, rushing into depths, performances and situations headlong without any reasonable self preservation, drunk from the beginners development curve...Diving against your instinct, being scared to death, but coming up alive and high on adrenaline...The thing is, from an evolutionary point of view, this makes sense. If you are confronted with a life threatning situation (signalled by extreme fear), and you come out of it alive, you will get a "reward" from your body (endorfins etc), so you are taught "you did something right, because the situation did not end up in your death". Repeating this many times will condition your mind and body to think that you are safe in what you're doing, but it just goes against common sense and knowledge.

There is in my mind no safe way to practice "performace freediving" alone. There simply isn't. But there are reasonably safe ways to train alone, if you break your performance down to components and concentrate on each individually, like has been suggested here...Train the apnea part dry, train technique and fitness in water...

Hmm, what an unstructured ramble that was...Well, anyway...

 

[cdavis]

Hi Feargus,

Put me in the "practicing fool" category, too. Traditionaly (I could be wrong) newbies just didn't normally have the skills to get themselves in serious trouble, except maybe in wet statics. I and many of my buddies went through a period of improving skills that led to a few sambas. Luckily nobody died in my group before we got the invincibility scared out of us. As we got better, and more cautious, no more sambas. As spearos get really good it gets dangerous again. Today, newbies can learn so much technique from the internet, etc. Several new DBers have reported BOs and sambas very early in their diving history. I think the rules for newbies are different today. The rules for me are different than they used to be, before DB and Performance Freediving. I know how to push my body far beyond what was possible before. I'm comfortable with far greater times and depths. But the truth is, the safety margin is less. More safety is a requirement, and much, much more caution if diving alone.

Danny, your points are well taken and imminently logical. However private organizations don't have the cover that governments do. Its too bad, but hard to avoid.

Simo, maybe a little ramble, but very well said.

Connor

 

[dannybuoy]

But does AIDA need the cover? If a member of a shooting club ends up killing a bunch of people and/or himself, do we hold the club responsible? The person who taught him how to handle the weapon? The one who sold him the weapon? No, we don't. When we get into an accident we don't go back to our driving school and complain, do we? If AIDA were to teach how to freedive solo, under the motto "they're doing it anyway, at least let them do it as safe as we know possible", they'd probably be legally in the clear. I don't think AIDA's standards are a matter of legalities, or corporate responsibility, but one of morals. And i question those.

 

[jome]

Reading my previous rant. Sheesh, what a load of...Anyway, I guess what I'm trying to say is:

The subjective feeling of "being safe" doesn't have much to do with actually being safe. Even less so when you're diving alone.

So if you choose to do so, use as objective measures for safety as you can.

 

[Mr. X]

There is a similar issue with solo rock & ice climbing. Although it is not really controversial as it is assumed participants are well aware of the risks they have taken on. There are distinct advantages & disadvantages to it and it is a different experience. Some of the risks of freediving are not obvious though e.g. SWB, blebs,...

Re. experience I have met several climbers that are no longer with us. They include novices in an organised, roped group making a very basic mistake, a famous solo rock climber wearing trainers on an easy route, an intermediate climber using new techniques in much bigger and more serious surroundings than they had experienced before and a client with an experienced guide. It is probably a mistake to assume experience will protect you. It may provide additional "tools" to help you -- but you will probably push it more.

 

[Spaniard]

I have speared 'alone', in the sense that no-one is in close proximity, all of my spearing life. Here in the UK it is rare to have to go much deeper than 30ft to catch fish; last year my biggest bass was shot in 15ft. I guess I have learnt to dive under these conditions and because I never stay down too long or get distracted untangling line from kelp etc. I have never had an 'incident'. Most places I dive even if I chose to dive deep, a partner could not 'spot' from surface as the vis is not good enough. I don't know if anyone on the board has SWB statistics from UK but I wouldn't be surprised if they are much lower than areas where deep, clear water is the norm.

 

[Haydn]

There was a childs school situated at the top of a steep, narrow and dangerous road that wound its way for miles up a treacherous mountain track. Each day the children took the bus to the school from the village at the foot of the mountain. One day, the bus driver retired and the school governors went through the usual interview process to select a new driver to transport the daily precious carge of children. " How close can you drive to the edge of the mountain, can you drive" asked one governor to a candidate. "Oh I often drive within 12 inces of the edge" was the reply. The same question to another candidate was replied with " I always drive within an inch of the edge, it hones my skills" said the second candidate. The third candidate replied "I never drive close to the edge".

We should never dive close to the edge. Its just not fair to our loved ones. When things go wrong in freediving you dont get the chance to exercise your superior skills to get yourself out of trouble. You simply die, or pot luck you might survive. Either way, you probably wont get a chance to take actions or make decisions that might effect the outcome. A buddy will safe your life, you wont save your own. You are literally as exposed as the climber who climbs free without ropes. You fall, you die. Having said that, we remain free to choose. Unsupported solo sporting efforts have their own unique worthiness but in undertaking these, we should not have the seriousness of the outcomes artificially diluted by any degree of acceptance by our governing body. The concern is that by teaching additional safety principles to the solo frediver, it might be seen as Aida condoning the activity to dive alone. It is not Aidas job. Aida is not the vehicle to cover solo freediving. Independant discussion is probably better.

 

[Morg]

Hey I have been training in the pool solo. I have taken the advice of everyone and I am not training really at all.

The only thing I am workin on is my form.

One problem that I am really having is my heart rate. It is always fast. I was doin belly breathing with low exhales and it lowered it a bit but it was still pretty fast. Also as soon as I start off my heart beat picks up again.

Should I be constantly thinking about a peaceful environment or something like that? I have tried doin some small statics to help lower it as well but nothing seems to help.

The pool is a tad on the cold side so I am not sure if thats what is causing my heart beat to be so fast.

Any ideas how to keep a lower heart rate?

 

[matrixed82]

Any ideas how to keep a lower heart rate?

I'm not sure but maybe more cardio.

 

[Morg]

I'm not sure but maybe more cardio.

I am doin quite a lot of cardio as it is, I believe anyways.

I run like 2-3, sometimes 4 miles every night.

 

[Lehmann108]

I am doin quite a lot of cardio as it is, I believe anyways.

I run like 2-3, sometimes 4 miles every night.

It's hard to know exactly why, but you may not be recovering enough between cardio workouts. Also, how old are you and when you say it beats too fast, how fast is it? What is your resting heart rate?

 

[Morg]

It's hard to know exactly why, but you may not be recovering enough between cardio workouts. Also, how old are you and when you say it beats too fast, how fast is it? What is your resting heart rate?

I am 20 years old and I am 6" 1/2 - 2. I weigh like 165 pounds.

My heart rate at a rest is like 72. I find that number extremly high. Before when I was doing my statics I had to mentally control my heart rate. (Example: Slow your heart rate.....) I would say that in my head to slow it down.

I had around the same rate when I had already done a few light dynamics. I also found that when I would start off I could get my heart rate at a reasonable rate but mid way though I monitored my heart rate and it jumped back up. This is somewhat understandable because I was at rest when I had a slow rate and I was just moving when I took a second reading.

I guess what I am trying to find out is:

Is that heart rate normal? Or do I need to REALLY focus on something to keep it a lot slower?

 

[Mr. X]

...My heart rate at a rest is like 72. I find that number extremly high. Before when I was doing my statics I had to mentally control my heart rate. (Example: Slow your heart rate.....) I would say that in my head to slow it down.
....
I guess what I am trying to find out is:

Is that heart rate normal? Or do I need to REALLY focus on something to keep it a lot slower?

Your heart rate sounds pretty normal. USCF used to recommend taking your resting heart rate after you awake while still led in bed -- I never tried this but I suspect your HR would be lower under those conditions.

An effective way to control your heart rate is with your breathing -- obviously not real practical under the circumstances (breath holding)!

Caffeine can be a powerful heart rate stimulant. A former colleague told me about an experiment a teacher did for them, placing caffeine directly onto the heart of a living but opened up frog -- apparently the heart rate shot up. [Don't try this at home kids]. If you drink coffee, tea, coke, mountain dew, red bull, jolt, pseudo ephidrine,... you might want to try giving them a miss. I have never heard sugar mentioned as a heart stimulant -- but if you see small kids after a high sugar intake you have to wonder!

 

[efattah]

My resting heart rate is also around 72, and it doesn't affect my diving. My longest dives and statics (8min+) were done with heart rates over 100. Sure, my heart rate eventually slows to the 60's near the very end of a hard breath-hold, but during most statics it is over 100 for the first 5 minutes at least. During my breathe-up it is usually in the 80-90 range.

So I wouldn't put much importance on it.

 

[Morg]

Thanks Eric for that information. I thought my heart rate was really fast.