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Spearing: Boat, RIB, Dory, Dinghy, Dive Kayak?

Thread Status: Hello , There was no answer in this thread for more than 60 days.
It can take a long time to get an up-to-date response or contact with relevant users.
Dave, are you going to be adding the boats & ski to your website (any idea of pricing...ball park?). Are the skis plastic or fibreglass? Any 2-seaters?

BTW are boat engines all 2-strokes or are some 4-stroke? What do your recommend. I find 2-strokes noisey, smelly, oily & rattley but my brother loves them (incredibly steep power curves often & few moving parts).
 
Hiya

Up until a few years ago, all outboards were two stroke petrol driven motors. You do get the odd diesel driven outboard, but they're very rare. When four strokes came onto the market, they revolutionised the boaters world. They were lighter on fuel, no, CONSIDERABILY lighter on fuel, roughly 30-50% lighter on fuel to a similar sized two stroke motor. They didn't use two stroke oil, so weren't smelly and didn't bellow out copoius amounts of white smoke!! (the bane of all of those who suffers from mal-de-mer/"sea-sickness"). They were more environmetally friendly and they were whisper quite. On the downside: they're EXPENSIVE, are much heavier than a two stroke motor of same power and the servicing costs are expensive.

The two stroke tecnology has also moved in leaps and bounds over the past few years, in response to the four stroke tecnology. You new generation two strokes are virtually smoke free, but still use two stroke oil. The greatest leap forward in the two stroke field has no doubtly been the direct injection fueling systems. They made the two strokes now almost as fuel efficient as their 4 stroke counterparts, but also just as pricey!! The only other advantage was that the new generation two stroke fuel injection models have is that they're lighter than the 4 stroke but still heavier than the old two stroke.

In some countries there is talk of eventually phasing out the old two stroke models, due to emmision egulations.

For your application, a oldish normal caburetted two stroke would work PERFECT. Light in weight, cheap to purchase and reasonably light on fuel. They're also mechanically very simple!! Low on maintance and generally trouble free!!

There are many marques, each with their own followers:
YAMAHA - regarded by most as THE engine on choice. I've been a yamaha fan all my life. The fact that 90% of our commercial fisherman use YAMAHA'S bears testament to their reliabilty. Both their 2 and 4 stroke range's are superb.

Mariner - the early mariner models, especially the smaller 20-50hp motors were actually built by yamaha. You can still see on the older motors, the covers and all the stickers says Mariner, but the vin tag shows built by YAMAHA rofl Haven't heard many bad things from them.

Mercury - some love them some HATE them. Their opti-max (2 stroke fuel injection) has been called OPTI-BOMB becuase of them blowing up!! rofl Seriously though, some users swear by them and others swear at them!!rofl Since i've never owned one, i would know!!

Suzuki - the early two stroke models had a bad reputation here for corrosion problems here in South Africa. I know the American markets regard them very highly. Maybe we recieved a different motor? They did work VERY well in our fresh water applications!! Anyways, the 4 stroke Suzuki's are PHENOMINAL. They're collected basically all the awards a outboard manufacturer can get!! Even the Johnson/Evinrude (OMC) 4 strokes are built by Suzuki and merely rebadged!!

Johnson/Evinrude (OMC) - i'm a bit biased here, as my very first boat had a Johnson that was very old. I had it rebuilt, but it was a major head-ache from day one. How-ever, it was a OLD motor, so that shouldn't be a reflection of the make on a whole. They built OK motors, but a few years back, BOMBADIER got involved with them and they produced the FICHT motors. Fuel injuction two stroke that was as light on fuel as a 4stroke BUT it required no maintance for 2 years (or 300hour i think!!) Once again, most owners LOVE them and i've heard very little complaints about them.

You do get other makes, like Tohatsu, Honda, Yanmar, etc but i'm not very familiar with them. Remember the above are simply MY OPINIONS!!!

Regards
miles
 
The boats and skis will be on the website soon. The skis are fibreglass
Most outboards on small boats (20-50hp) are 2 stroke, since they have a much better power to weight ratio, less parts to go wrong and are quite a bit cheaper. 4 strokes are getting lighter, but you tend to need the next size up engine to get similiar performance to a 2 stroke, just because of the extra weight. If cost wasnt an issue I would fit a new Suzuki 4 stroke 50hp to my C Ski (as cost is an issue I am fitting a used, almost indestructible, 2 stroke Yamaha 40hp)
Any cheap second hand boat will have a 2 stroke engine. On the subject of servicing costs for engines, I know someone who will do a service for about £100, but I choose to use someone who is nearer £200, as you tend to get what you pay for......
I know a guy who uses a pencil duck (called ZapCats here) for spearing, he seems to get on well with it, but never takes more than 2 divers
With any boat, unless you are very good at using transits, get a GPS, it makes so much difference actually being able to find spots more than once!
cheers
dave
www.spearo.co.uk
 
Looks like me and Miles were typing at the same time!
miles said:
In some countries there is talk of eventually phasing out the old two stroke models, due to emmision regulations.

This is happening in Europe at the end of the year (doesn't affect old engines, only those sold after Dec2006)

cheers
dave
www.spearo.co.uk
 
Hiya

as cost is an issue I am fitting a used, almost indestructible, 2 stroke Yamaha 40hp)

Dave, i have to dis-agree with you!! That motor isn't ALMOST indestructable, they ARE INDESTRUCTABLE!!! They've VERY popular with the small commercial boats here. Which one do you have? The 2 or 3cylinder model??

Be carefull of the additional weight of the four stroke models!! That suzuki 50hp 4 stroke wieghs 243lb's (for both 40 and 50hp's) where-as a new 2 stroke 50hp yamaha wieghs 189lb's. As you know, putting extra weight on the rear of a boat isn't good. But then again, the 440 isn't that small either!!!

Send some pic's when you have it rigged up!!

Regards
miles
 
omega3 said:
Here`s the 600...I`m feeling rich haha

http://www.brig.com.ua/e600.phtml


and it makes a great tender for my luxuary cruiser

Nice -- give me a call when the luxury cruiser shows up . Re. the Brig VERY NICE, I want want one! Do both the blonde & the brunette come with it?

Ever get the feeling that life has passed you by, sigh? Nah, me neither:head Cold showerrofl
How much do they sell for, ballpark figure? (Who needs a pension anyway!).
[Did you download the wallpaper images? rofl
Oh Sweet mama!]
 
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Hello Folks

Cool thread... and we all know how much fun zipping out on your own boat for a day is!

Sadly, I'm now selling mine cos I need to buy a new car - boo hoo.

If anyone is interested feel free to mail me and I can give you the full specs: Zodiac Cadet-S 3.1m (3yrs old), 10Hp Mariner 2-stroke (2yrs old), on a trailor, all accessories and fully serviced from new - £2000 ono!

It's a beaut - you'll get 22Kn by yourself, or 15 with two and full scuba kit

Hope we all have a good year!

Dan - email me here
 
miles said:
...You do get other makes, like Tohatsu, Honda, Yanmar, etc but i'm not very familiar with them. Remember the above are simply MY OPINIONS!!!...
Thanks, loads of great info.. I used to be a big fan of Honda products in general (esp. the "bullet proof", smooth, quiet, high-rev'ing 4-strokes motors) but I have noticed a slip in quality recently (borne out by comments elsewhere on this forum) along with significant increases in prices. Consequently, I've gone off Honda.
 
Loads of good info again, thanks. Re. servicing, there is some truth in what you say -- but it isn't quite as simple as "you get what you pay for". I have experience of numerous dealers/garages inc. 3 in our area. Of the 3, the cheapest is undoubtedly the best -- they do a proper service, which is lot more work than the dealers do, they are honest, straightforward & discuss issues openly. Of the remaining two, the middle one I have caught not doing work :naughty (initially they claimed they had done it:vangry but I had marked the parts concerned -- and they eventually admitted they had not...this was the official Honda dealer by the way!). The most expensive one does the least work & the absolute minimum work they can get away with & are quite shoddy:naughty , leaving hoses unclipped, tire pressures all set incorrectly, etc. (again an official Honda dealer). The middle one knows how to read & deal with engine diagnostic codes, the expensive one does not:vangry. When you get a car serviced or repaired -- good luck (mark/seal things that should be worked on or changed & always ask for your old parts back...it is not proof that the work has been done but it makes it a little harder for them to rip you off). Reputable repairers will let you watch them work (many dealers will not...). [Flame thrower off!]

I am not sure what a transit is, but I take the point on GPS.
 

Aaahhh....explains things. Miles, I never picked up on that before. I had an Interceptor 160 once with a Mariner 75 and it never gave any problems. But, knowing all the yammy's in serious action in SA (lifeguard ducks/commercials etc.), that will be me with a Ski-vee when I finally move back to Durban nearer the end of this year.
Can't wait:friday

Regards
 
Jez. I had no idea they weighed anything near that much -- surely that is not a RIB engine?!

BTW Anybody tried this "trim tabs"/"planing system": [ame]http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=7209723008&fromMakeTrack=true[/ame]

...sounds like it might be a really good thing...or a gimmick. Thoughts??

"LIFTERSTM radically improve the performance of inflatable sportboats, increasing speed and acceleration 25% to 45% and planing weight capacity up to 30%, while decreasing fuel consumption by over 25%. Sportboats having insufficient power or carrying heavy loads can now plane or achieve higher planing speeds. Lifters are specifically designed and patented for sportboats with over seven years of development and testing to yield maximum performance with the following advantages:



• Less drag and far superior performance than hydrofoil devices
• Accelerate and plane quickly without moving weight forward
• Stay aft for safer motor control and boat stays level for comfort
• Reduce proposing, hopping and prop ventilation at high speeds
• Plane faster on top of the waves with a smooth cushioned ride
• In the roughest of conditions plane slower for more comfort
• Carry weight aft for greater stability and speed with less spray
• Execute tighter turns while maintaining speed and control
• Eliminate transom engine torquing for more in-line power
• Spray plate eliminates lower unit spray and transom dousings
• Maintain proper engine RPM for less deposits and plug fowling
• Large motors turn freely with partial horizontal swiveling
• Reduce transom turbulence and drag when trolling or rowing
• Increase boat's traveling range while saving on fuel
• Less wake and better transitional speed control
• Less drag when towing empty boat and with motor

• Won't snag on kelp or weeds like hydrofoil devices
• Counteract towline torque for fast controlled towing
• Won't affect boat or motor storage like other devices
• Simple to install and attach or detach in seconds
• Works with wood, aluminum or air floor, all roll-ups
• Can be left in the water and growth wipes right off
• Made of unbreakable UV resistant polypropylene
• Corrosion resistant stainless steel fasteners
• Used as skids to drag up sandy beaches
• Will work with transom wheels "

See the link above for diagrams & explanation of how it purportedly works.
 

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SurfnSpear said:
......Looks like Sands has been doing promos for Brig....see her there on the left.... rofl
I would not be so ungallant as to ask if you recognised the backside in the other image! rofl
 
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Strangely enough that is what attracted me to those boats...I tried to get it to link to the sundeck pic...mmmmmm right time for cold shower.

I don`t think they have been on the market that long as there are hardly any second hand ones and the cheapest I have seen was the 500 for 12K ex demo I think and the 600 for 20K new. Its a while since I looked and can`t remember if that was with motor and trailer and I think it was £.

That "duck boat" looks excellent to do the job. Not seen one of those before.

I have always been a Mariner engine fan but suppose whatever does the job.
 
hey x
i recently got a 2 man inflatable kayak sit on top by sevylor, took it out last weekend to camping area by the red sea, its great, cheap (240$), portable, durable, gives you a nice workout, room to store stuff in, easy to reboard, cool fr taking out the wife for some quality time when youre not fishing
the area was pretty much a huge bay so not too rough seas, i would imagne it to be a little harder in open water on a bad day, but if most of your activity is inshore, go for it.
 
I have a Cobra Expedition (18') and it paddles very well and is more stable than alot of people would seem to think. Sure it cost a fair amount but the maint. costs each year are zero. It is low enough to paddle in strong winds but is a wet ride in those conditions - if you are in a wetsuit this is not a problem. Fine for solo missions.... Ideal for me as I can chuck it on a shoulder and walk it the minute or two to the beach and head off. A rib would not fit in my garden and I dont want the hassle of repairs / driving to the slip etc - I find a kayak suits me and the other kayakers here are a sociable bunch so it is good for non spearing activities... suits me and my conditions...
Ed
 
portinfer said:
I have a Cobra Expedition (18') and it paddles very well and is more stable than alot of people would seem to think. Sure it cost a fair amount but the maint. costs each year are zero....
18ft seems really long (fast & easy to keep straight?) -- however, if I get one, then I will need to put it on a car, so I think(?) 12ft is probably as long as I would want to go...& even at that size, you have to check the weight too (54lb+++ ). I need one that can take 1 or 2 people. I believe stability is at least partially a function of the hull width & shape, many of the OKs are well regarded on both counts.
 
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By the way, anybody using aluminium boats? Seems quite popular in the states. Is it sea-worth -- I know aluminium can corrode somewhat is salt water but anodizing seems to fix that from what I can tell. I wonder if a v-hulled aluminium boat with built with a buoyant (anti-sink) chassis might be a winner. (That sort of thing is often affordable in the US but prohibitively expensive in the UK for some reason).

Also, Miles mentioned that there is no perfect boat & every keeps looking...so any disadvantages to Daves' C-Ski 440 -- it sounds ideal? (Although he didn't mention price yet!).

I've been checking out my drive/garage -- I have room for a boat. :hmm Gulp
(I am far more worried about boat safety than diving...it seems far more dangerous for some reason & combining them...)
 
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