SWBO Vest discussion.

[Arjen]

I started a new thread, because to start a discussion on this in the thread were it was mentioned was totally not appropriate, but I think a discussion on it is merited, maybe even needed.

Just a few more reasons that somebody needs to get a SWB vest together. Someone mentioned climbing and using a rope, we as freedivers don't have a rope, it's time. This doesn't mean that diving alone is a good thing to do but we have all done it at some point and it would be nice to have a safety net of sorts.

In my opinion, what you are suggesting here will only give a false sense of security and is not an actual safety improvement at all. It will lead to more people diving by themselves, because now they have a safety vest. Even if you were using a properly functioning safety vest and had a SWBO, you will still need someone to protect your airways and help you. You will need a buddy anyway! Vest or no vest.

Further, such a device would not be a low tech, easy to maintain, easy to operate, idiot proof device. At least, I can’t picture a way that it can be at the moment.


And the comparison with climbing and rope is a very bad one, because climbers DO work in teams of two where they are responsible for eachothers safety.

 

[Mullins]

Isn't there already a pretty detailed thread on this somewhere? Terry Maas has been working on a vest like this for some time. I can understand the reservations about a vest tempting people to dive alone, but on the other hand:

- a properly designed vest will float the diver face-up on the surface. Not entirely fool proof but it'd give you a very good chance of survival, not to mention putting you in view/reach of anybody else who might be around.
- the buddy system is far from perfect and a vest would be a good addition, even when diving in pairs. In some of the locations we spearfish it's unlikely a buddy would be able to find and save you if you had a SWB (deep, bad vis, very strong current and usually a lot of surface chop).

I'd probably buy one.

 

[ploum]

I did the climbing analogy and, for me, the whole point of the comparison was that, in each sport, you were working in pair, putting your life in the hand of you buddy but doing it intelligently thanks to a protocol. In climbing, the protocol contains a physical rope that links the two buddies and some knowledge that the buddy has to know. You will never climb if you are not sure that your buddy has the technical knowledge and can handle your weight.

In freediving, it's the same but without a rope and without the weight requirement but with a depht requirement (be sure that your buddy can at least handle a depth not far from yours).

I'm new to freediving but it looks like there are very few important accident (death or permanent disabilities) when the current safety procedures are applied. Most of the accident I've heard about are from people not following the procedure. If this is proven right, then I don't see the need to change the procedure. We have to change diver education but not the procedure.

 

[Lil Dragonfly]

I think if you have a buddy who can't go down as deep as you, a vest is a good idea.

 

[JennyWren]

If your buddy cannot dive as deep as you are diving that day, then you are diving without a buddy.

A vest may be a good backup system, but it is not a buddy replacement.

 

[Mullins]

If your buddy cannot dive as deep as you are diving that day, then you are diving without a buddy.

I have to disagree with that. It’s usually unrealistic to expect a buddy to be able to bring you up from your max depth anyway, even if they can dive deeper themselves. I spearfish in 40m with people who can dive 60m+, but I don’t expect they’d be able to recover me from 40m. Not only would it be very difficult, it’s unlikely they could find me - and if I had sunk all the way back down to 40m unconscious, I would probably be screwed regardless. 0-15m is where you need support. As long as your buddy knows what to do and can effect a rescue in those last few metres their max depth is largely irrelevant.

 

[Narsil]

Dave, not sure that I'd be able to save your ass even at 5 metres, particularly if we were only a few days out from a comp... :naughty

Seriously though, shallow water BO's are where the great majority of issues occur, as we all know. As Mr Mullins states, in our conditions you're effectively diving alone most of the time, even when with an experienced (albeit fatter, older & slower) buddy.

The vest would be great. Haven't heard much about the concept recently, but think it could be widely adopted if the technical 'trigger' issues were sorted, it wasn't too bulky, or prohibitively expensive.

Guy

 

[efattah]

In my opinion a very functional setup in poor vis is to have each of the two freedivers wearing a UDT buddylocator wrist computer. It uses ultrasonic triangulation to point an arrow to your buddy, and also whether he is above or below you. You query him by pushing a button, he then must reply by pushing his button, if not you know something is wrong.

With those devices you will always be able to find your buddy even if you can't see him.

 

[nz676]

i think a vest may make a great addition to having a buddy but not a replacement, diving alone is never a good idea theres more than just swb to contend with.