The best breathe up for spearos

[fishimani]

I recently posted a thread about a tingling sensation i expecience occasionally with my current (now ex) breathe up. I thought it would be nice for some more experienced freediver/spearos to share thier breathing patterns prior to shallow or deep dives so that we can shed some light on this topic. The more specific the better in my opinion. Please share!!!

Thanks,

Pete

 

[cdavis]

Glad it's and "ex" breathup.

The breathup you use is much dependent on what you are doing and there are more than a few schools of thought on it. Here's mine, but yours may need to be very different.

Most of my diving is very low exertion, I don't swim around much most of the time. Also I'm diving frc, almost entirely. After much experimentation, I've gone to a very minimal style breathup, come up, take a few recovery breaths, then 2 or 3 minutes of very small, diaphragm breaths, about 1/5 of a full inhale, pause a couple of seconds on the inhale and 3 or 4 seconds on exhale, about 5-6 breaths a minute, then 2 full inhales diaphragm only, 4 more minimal breaths, 3 fairly full diaphragm only breaths and go. This gets me 1:45-2:15 dives in 70-80 ft. If I'm doing something more energetic, like spearfishing, I will breath deeper and go with more total inhale, also stay down shorter times.

Pattern is the same, shallow or deep, I just stay down longer shallow.

Connor

 

[demasoni]

I try to breathe as normally and as relaxed as possible most of the time. This also means that I respond to my body's needs. If diving recreationally, and I have just kicked 150 meters to get to another spot and I prepare to dive, of course my breathing will be deeper and faster because that is what my body asks. If I'm just floating motionless or barely kicking, then my breathing will be calmer and more shallow.

It's funny because back when I first started freediving and I took a course in 2005, I was taught ventilation breathing - 3 seconds inhale, 10 seconds exhale through pursed lips. This way you reduce your heart rate and now I know, you also reduce CO2. To top it off, perform 2-3 purges then one normal inhale and exhale and then a maximal inhale and dive. I did it this way for years, why question it? I never BO'd from it and it seemed to work well enough. During the course, I made significant improvements in a 3-day span in static and depth and I was super excited about continuing my training and exploration of freediving.

Then I came across Deeper Blue and met other freedivers from around the world... I must say, I was also quite defensive about all these different theories I read on this forum telling myself, "That can't be right, that's not what I learned!" I paid $XXX for my course! How can these guys just tell me that!" Things such as FRC diving, exhale diving, no warm-ups, no mask or wetsuit dives, no structured breath-up dives, contractions are your friends... "Are you kidding me! Where did all this come from!" Very much against the grain from what I knew, but interesting tools for the toolbox, I couldn't leave them alone.

Compared to the way I used to dive, my "unlearned" breath-up of basically not breathing-up usually brings contractions earlier, but they are less severe and I can actually feel bloodshift and vasoconstriction occurring. I try to focus now more on my pre-dive mental state and I try to let go of as much ego and expectation as possible and try to dive in the immediate moment. I also try to kick in the dive response as much as possible and I still do a facial immersion, flood my suit, and do all this and a warm-up without my hood if possible.

I'm still evolving of course, and as much as I'd like to tell you I have a certain breath-up routine, I actually don't, but it is much mellower than before and I just try to listen to my body as conditions dictate.

 

[SinglerM]

Great thread.

This is something I've been wondering about also. What the most efficient or productive breath-up routine for spearfishing. I'm guessing that freedivers have a variety of different approaches to this, but I've always wondered what would be best for spearfishing or freediving with different levels of exertion.

Thanks,
Mitch

 

[jimy286]

I know there are lots of different methods but when spearfishing i dont stay down longer then 1 min. It is also interesting that the world champs dont stay down any longer then 1 min!

 

[Erik]

Demasoni's post makes lots of sense to me.
Relax and make sure you're rested before your next dive is all. I generally double the time of my last dive for my breathe-up ie: 1 minute dive means a 2 minute breathe up. When it's colder or I feel as if I've exerted myself I triple the time up to a max of 5 minutes breathe-up.

 

[Spear0Joe]

jimy where did you get this 1 minute from? diving 30 metres average breath hold 1.30 - 2 mins

 

[gmata]

1 meter per second, 30 sec down 30 sec up. i guess

 

[Broseidon]

1 meter per second, 30 sec down 30 sec up. i guess

Which would leave precisely ZERO seconds to spear any fish rofl

 

[jimy286]

I have only got this ifoe second hand from a couple of people on here witnessing it first hand in the world champs and also on SB. I can say that from watching some of the top spearos first hand it is rare that they do more then 1min.
Also it seams to me that if a fish dont come in around the 1min mark it is very unlikely it will at the 2 min mark.
Also it is a common theory that the fish become used to you diving up and down in their area and start to get more inquisitive.

I agree with you that you would need longer on a 30m dive but 99% of spearos on this board only hunt in 10m of water sometimes even 5m

 

[Erik]

For reference, I will dive to 30 metres hunting on the west coast as will Colin (Amphibious), if that's where the fish are. 30 seconds or so to get down, then hunt for a minute+ on the way back up.

Our cold water diving is also bad vis diving ie: 5 metres, so the hunting technique is different than nice clear-water diving. We dive and then search for fish, which usually means get down to your deepest point, move horizontally then work your way back up a hill or a wall. Most of our fish are sitting on a bench or hiding under or around thick kelp, so best to approach from the bottom. Rockfish and greenlings will come to see you if you wait a bit.... sometimes, so aspetto works too.

 

[Erik]

I should add, for Pete's sake (lol) since he's asking, that if I dive when I think I should without using a surface timer, my dives are shorter because I didn't breathe up long enough. If I force myself to wait 3 minutes (or longer sometimes) by using a timer no matter how I feel, my dives are always easier and longer.

 

[Gaz D]

Which would leave precisely ZERO seconds to spear any fish rofl

Are you on every single thread in this forum?!!!


.

 

[Broseidon]

Are you on every single thread in this forum?!!!


.

Slow day in the office!

 

[Gaz D]

Slow day in the office!

Good man!











.

 

[mishu1984]

What i do is triple my breath up from my last bottom time. Meaning if u juat did a dive for 1 minute, i will do a breath up of 3, but ive been known to do a 1:1 if the action lively and in 5m or less of water
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[azapa]

I like Josh's comment about listening to your body. It may take time
(a few years?) to hear it straight. My breathe ups are so shallow and non-existent these days I find myself hungry for air during them and need to speed them up a little. If you 'listen' hard enough, your body will say when you are ready to dive.

 

[cdavis]

The trick is knowing what to listen for.

I do the minimal ventilation thing too, works great. As I am getting into preping for the next dive, breathing gets very shallow and slows down, I keep it just above the urge to breathe. At some point, usually about 3 minutes, I start to feel that I am nowhere near any urge to breathe, very relaxed, breathing is getting even more shallow and slower, heart rate is dropping and I feel "zoned out." That combination is when I know I'm ready and the next dive will be very long. Follow with 3 full breaths using only the diaphragm(about 65 percent of a truly full breath) and I'm gone.

That's in pool practice which I do a lot and which has very consistent conditions. When I finally get to the ocean with its great variability in conditions, things are different. It is harder to know what to listen for and much harder to get to that "zoned out" feeling.

Connor

 

[blaiz]

I like Josh's train of thought as well. Though I havn't taken any of the PFI courses a lot of my techniques I have learned are from those who have and due to this my style is similar to what is taught. I have noticed that my dive times stay pretty consistant when using these techniques but it does seem that I have hit a wall as far as my progression.

I do the minimal ventilation for 8 - 10 breaths depending on my recovery rate or depth. I then do a series of purge breaths (4-6) followed with 2 slow half breaths with a final full breath (diaphragm, chest, and throat stretch). I also do a minimal of 1:2 (dive time to surface interval) ratio, so if a 2 min breath hold a 4 minute surface interval, if diving over 80ft than my ratio is probably closer to 1:4.

My typical diving depths are between 50 and 90 ft with, on a good day, dive times between 2:00 and 2:30 seconds. We have been forced to get better bottom times here as most of our dives are done aspetto (lying on the bottom attracting fish to you) and our water is generally clear with a murky day having visibility of over 40 ft and many of our fish take there marry time to come in, though on a side note a lot of the bigger fish I have shot have been on bottom times less than 1:45... go figure.

I think my biggest problem is that I dont condition myself thoroughly enough. I do minimal if any warm ups, I have just started doing diaphragm stretching but I dont do them religiously.

I think the best thing is just to listen to your body, know your limits, and always dive with an able partner so that you can SAFELY push your limits.

 

[blueface]

Hi Pete!
Great post with a lot of good information hear. Tingling is probably a bad thing. It might even be a clue that you were over-breathing. Before I dive I do nothing more than rest. No fancy breathe up technique or anything. I just relax enough to slightly lower my heart rate (not too low) and exhale (not vigorously), take a deep breath and go. I learned tons from the guys who post here and they all stress the importance of maintaining the right level of CO2 by NOT hyperventilating. There is a whole grand canyon of evidence that suggests Hyperventilating=bad. I also read that if your heart rate is too low at the start, it might cause vasoconstriction and lower the PaO2 giving you less O2 before you dive.

My resting HR at the surface is probably 50 or 60 bpm. I do a duck dive and it goes up to maybe 80 or 100 bpm until I reach about 12 m or so and then it drops to its lowest during the static phase.

If I made a mistake I hope one of the more experienced guys will jump in and correct me. I have been diving this way for a few years and I have not blacked out yet.

Rest 2 or 3 times as long as the apnea and 8 min or more if past 80 ft.

Hope it helps.

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