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Al Gore wins Nobel Peace prize

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Isn't bottled water such a wonderful concept. In my view it epitomises our consumer attitudes. I sell 750ml bottles for $2.80 in my shop and it sells as well, if not better than coke or any of those other popular soft drinks. What is funny is that there is a river flowing behind the shop which is perfectly healthy to drink from. People are buying the idea of 'clean'.
The best water I have ever tasted has been in the mountains. You take some snow melted by the sun. Give it a couple of thousand feet to drop where along the way it can gather all sorts of minerals and tannins from the forest and you end up with something that tastes sweeter than anything else on earth. Water flavoured by nature itself! MMMMMMMMM:inlove

By the way if you are passing by and need your water bottle filled I will happily do so from the tap free of charge.


mm arent you the lucky one. Our tap water comes out in various shades of brown some days, as I live in quite an old area. I often brush my teeth with bottled water as I hate to think why the water changes colour :yack

Our water is mostly desalinated and if you drink lots of it over the years they reckon it can make you mad rofl (guess that explains it then)
 
Yesterday's 60 Minutes had a piece on the increasing size and ferocity of forest fires in the Western United States.

In the last 10 years, we are getting bigger and hotter fires than any time in recorded history. They are burning higher on mountains than they ever have before, destroying forests that were thought to be immune because of altitude. The fire season is now 2 months longer than it used to be. They are burning down through soil to rock so that forests may never again regenerate in those areas, or at least for many hundreds of years.

When asked if he believed in global warming, a fire fighter chief replied that you wouldn't be able to find anyone on the front lines of fire fighting who didn't believe in it.

Admittedly, he wasn't asked whether the change was due to human activity, so he didn't comment on that.

But it seems that the scientific community has made a good enough case that we should consider whether its true. It would be hell to be wrong.

There are other reasons, proven reasons, for the changes in fire behavior. Consider that the Sierra used to burn frequently, with a particular spot burning at least every ten years, and some as frequently as three to five years. These numbers have come from the study of tree rings, which show scorching from years in which a fire burned. Thus, we know that the ecosystem burned regularly. Enter people of European descent. We have suppressed fire in the forests for about 100 years. Fire is essential to the ecosystem because it recycles nutrients from downed material, such as twigs, leaves, shrubs, and other low-lying vegetation. It provides nutrients for the remaining plants. Consider that some trees need heat in order to open their cones, and once the cones open, seeds fall and plop into the ash at a perfect depth for germination. Wildlife recognizes fire as essential. Deer roll in the ash to knock off parasites and clean their coats. Birds practically infest a lightly-burned area because the insects are plentiful. These frequent fires were low in intensity because there wasn't that much fuel, and they were a natural part of the ecosystem for many years.

Today, we see fires that burn trees all the way to the top, which are crown fires. Those are the fires that kill entire trees and superheat soils. A fire cannot get to the top of a tree without fuels leading up to the crown of the tree. Historically, our forests had between 60-75% pine, which has many fire-resistant qualities, including somewhat fire-resistant bark and self-pruning, in which low limbs die and drop off and make it much more difficult for a fire to reach the crown. Other trees, such as the white fir and incense cedar, do not drop their lower limbs as readily, and additionally have a more fire-prone bark. You can see that the historical forest had lower-intensity fires for several reasons, but they were very good reasons. The forest was set up so that it would not burn intensely. Note that I am talking about the Sierra Nevada. Some areas, such as Yellowstone, regularly had large fires that wiped out entire stands of trees. However, even these were subject to frequent low-intensity fire.

If you look at our forest today, a vast majority of the trees are white fir and incense cedar. Therefore, a forest of that composition is more prone to fire simply by the virtue of those species. They are meant to burn readily. They also reproduce like mad. Natural low-burning fires would burn up excess small white fir and cedar, but since we have not permitted fires to burn, we have very thick areas of highly flammable trees. These conditions exist all over the mountains. When such thickets go up, unnaturally high flame temperatures occur. Also, such thickets require a great deal of water. Lots of trees in a small area are struggling and competing for resources, and they use an incredible amount of water. That helps to dry an area out, which is another factor in fire behavior.

Therefore, we are faced with a forest that is choked with trees. Where 50 per acre once thrived, now we have 500 per acre that struggle for survivial. Wildlife populations are on the decline in spite of habitat protections. Forests that were pine-dominated and fire-resistant are now fire-prone and full of incense cedar and white fir. It is altogether unhealthy. These factors have nothing to do with global warming. It is all the result of human activity, both in fire suppression and in logging the pine forest without restoring the pine trees.

Want to know the solution? It's controversial. In order to restore the forest into some semblance of its former self, we must change the balance of tree species by removing the undesirable trees. In other words, we have to log them. Current laws force forest managers to log wisely, and with habitat and soils in mind. All we have to do is let them do their jobs.

That, my friends, is how we can reduce the fire intensity and fire danger in California and in the United States. Forest management will save our towns from burning and our firefighters from danger. 60 Minutes seems to have put a spin on the issue and blamed it on the theory of global warming. The things I've told you are facts. That fire chief may not have personally known anyone who didn't believe in global warming, but I know many wildland firefighters that don't believe it. They have received an education in ecology and know what the forest should really look like. Please question the things you hear on the news. They have an agenda in what they present to you. If you do not believe me, read about Lake Arrowhead. Read that forest management was prohibited there for many years. Read about how the bark beetles came and killed 95% of the pine population. Then, see how Arrowhead burned, and is burning again! Salvage logging could have saved the homes in Arrowhead after the beetles came through, but it was blocked, and many lost their homes. It makes me angry and sad to see that this tragedy could have been prevented. The same goes for Tahoe (the Angora fire), and too many others to mention. Tahoe could have 100% been safe! Hundreds of homes and buildings didn't have to burn! Please, please, question what you hear.
 
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Having seen most of our food and drink being made, I can say that’s it very very safe. The cost of getting someone sick, both in terms of real money for medical expenses and the cost of a recall and all the bad publicity, is the ultimate incentive for a food manufacture to very very very clean and safe. He wants to make money not go out of business.
What drives everyone nuts is the food fads that the consumer embraces. I am amazed how, to be polite, ignorant people are about what they eat, drink and take to be "healthy". Every couple of years it changes. Kosher was huge...had to pay a Rabbi to bless our production line so we could put that little symbol on our label, then fat free, which is healthy, the full fat carb free, which will kill you. Organics is a huge scam, everyone thinks that organics is pesticide free. They nuke the organics with organic pesticides, some of which is more toxic then the synthetic ones. The herbal (supplement) industry is a huge scam and a running joke in the food business. It more lucrative to make and sell supplements then to sell cocaine. And none of that stuff works. The food industry has been trying to get the supplement industry regulated but the liberals in Congress won’t do it. The supplement uses as their defense against regulation is the fact that none of the stuff does anything. This is a scary industry its completely unregulated, chemists, which a close friend is one of them, just mix up something in the lab try it on themselves and if it has no effect then its put in pill form and sold as a supplement. Anything can be put in a supplement pill, there is 0 oversight.
The energy drinks are one of the latest fads, huge amounts of caffeine and sugar in a pretty bottle or can and sold to kids, who then walk around wired all day. Who know what the next marketer will bring out and people will go nuts over..dog sh..as the next health food.
 
That's something to think about. I have personally begun to eat a lot of organic food, and there are some positive things that I have noticed. First and foremost, the food tastes better. It has a lot more flavor. It is more filling and satisfying, gives me more energy, and doesn't make me tired after a meal. Since it is more satisfying, I do not have to buy as much food, and there is some monetary saving. Also, this diet change has resulted in significant weight loss in the proper areas, both for myself and for my family and friends that have made similar diet changes. I don't think the food is perfect, but consuming it has proven to have some benefits. I don't have to starve myself or feel deprived. There is also very little to no aftertaste after eating this food.

That's been my experience as a consumer :)
 
It’s not the organics that is giving you that energy it’s that you are eating healthier. Adn the food tastes better because its less processed. Our fast paced life has made the average person forget what good and fresh food tastes like. So that is what is sold lousy tasting processed food that you pop in your microwave.
We eat about 50% veges and deep greens salad greens like spinach and green leaf lettuce with fat free salad dressing. We add nothing that has fat to our salads, except for canned beans. 20% fresh fruit...we have fruit trees about 20% whole grains like brown rice and whole wheat breads. the rest is fat free protein like fish that is baked and our meat is venison or wild pig, which has fat only around the outside to the meat and can be trimmed away.
It’s the high fat diet, especially high meat fat diet, and white flour and rice that drains your energy and ages you. We eat no feedlot fattened meat, which will kill you.
The results are that I am 50; I am more fit then 90% of the men from the ages of 18 to 80. When I dive I swim and hunt fish without a tube or floatation device for 2 to 3 hours before I get tired. I average around 30 dives from the surface to 20 to 30 feet shooting around 20 fish, using a pole spear for the challenge, and then taking my 3 abalone and 3 or 4 crabs on the way in. Everything I need is attached to a utility belt.
One of the benefits of my diet and fitness is that everyone thinks is am 35 and I get lots of attention from the ladies. My wife is just as fit but she hates the cold water. lol
Other women ask her what she does to look so good and when she tells them her diet they just cringe and give her the look like she is nuts and now way is it worth it. she hits the gym most nights for her exercise and just loves the attention she get from the men, many 20 years younger then her.

 
Ocean_314
Once again you are making some rather expansive generalizations - though I agree with you about diet etc.. Many supplements do in fact pass the test of scientific rigor - so the statement 'none of that stuff works' is patently untrue. For some others the effects are too subtle for the current state of western science to quantify. For example - if you look at traditional chinese medicine you'll find quite a few very subtle remedies which have been developed over thousands of years. These are largely preventative in nature and designed to correct imbalances long before they manifest in a form recognizable by Western Medicine. It is a gross error in logic to dismiss an entire universe of remedies based on the fact that some of them are not legit.
The responsibility is and should be on the consumer to educate him/her self .
 
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Thus, we know that the ecosystem burned regularly. Enter people of European descent. We have suppressed fire in the forests for about 100 years. Fire is essential to the ecosystem because it recycles nutrients from downed material, such as twigs, leaves, shrubs, and other low-lying vegetation. It provides nutrients for the remaining plants. Consider that some trees need heat in order to open their cones, and once the cones open, seeds fall and plop into the ash at a perfect depth for germination. Wildlife recognizes fire as essential. Deer roll in the ash to knock off parasites and clean their coats. Birds practically infest a lightly-burned area because the insects are plentiful. These frequent fires were low in intensity because there wasn't that much fuel, and they were a natural part of the ecosystem for many years. -- etc.

Want to know the solution? It's controversial. In order to restore the forest into some semblance of its former self, we must change the balance of tree species by removing the undesirable trees. In other words, we have to log them. Current laws force forest managers to log wisely, and with habitat and soils in mind. All we have to do is let them do their jobs.

Its interesting that you say that the problem is that we suppress fires, but that the solution is logging.

In articles in the LA Times in the last week, many scientists were quoted as agreeing with you that our policy of 100% fire suppression is the problem. Where they didn't agree with you was on the solution. They said that we have to go back to letting most fires burn so as to reduce available fuel. Loggng won't clear chaparral.

Here is one article.

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Well, remember that BatRay is up in Humboldt County where there isn't any chaparral and the studies she's quoting are about the High Sierra. So logging is an excellent tool for some areas and prescribed burns are an excellent tool for others. What isn't an excellent tool is mindless running around in circles screaming "Don't touch, don't touch! Wilderness is sacred, people are evil!" Expanding suburbs up fire-prone hillsides doesn't help and when the winds turn against you, nothing works!
 
Oldsarge what suplements pass scientific rigor? If they do they would fall under the heading of a drug and would have to pass the rigors of the FDA.
And i agreee with you some of the eastern medicene works wonders. Accupture is excellent for a bad back, nothing in western medience can even come close.
 
Re the logging - I specified that my focus was on the Sierras, and specifically I meant the coniferous forest. Logging would be a solution in the mixed-conifer forest, which occurs between 4500 and 6500 feet. That is where the white fir and incense cedar are too numerous and causing forest composition problems. I wrote in response to the article about fires burning in higher elevations, which would be pine or red fir forests, than they did historically. I am actually in Fresno County, but the problem of managing forests in a way that is incompatible with science and history is rampant throughout the West.

The chaparral is another example of mismanagement, but as Bill McIntyre so sapiently remarked, it cannot be managed through logging. The prevalence of homes and bulidings among the chaparral prevents us from allowing the fires to burn naturally, so we are in a difficult position. See, that region was never meant to support a large, sedentary population. It does not have enough water. The problem with allowing natural fires to burn in the chaparral is that they had a return interval of about 15 years. Those fires are very intense. The frequent burning that we have seen in recent years is unnatural fire behavior for that reason. Rather, the solution to that situation is to allow firebreaks to be constructed, and to have the brush masticated to change fire behavior. Some controlled burning may be allowed after that has occurred, as long as conditions are ideal.

Re the organic food - The only change that I have made is in switching to organics vs. regular food, and that is the only difference. I eat a lot of cookies, chips, pretzels, eggs, cheese, pasta, and other such things. Most people would not call this a healthier diet. I could eat a large green salad made of un-organic lettuce and feel tired, but the same salad of organic materials would give me energy. Even the ice cream and chips give me energy without a 'crash' later, and without a lingering after-taste. I hesitated to start eating this food, but I do not regret making that change for a minute. I ate 'healthy' for over a year without results, but began dropping unwanted weight and feeling good within weeks of going organic.

Re supplements - The FDA says that only a drug can cure disease, and since manufacturers of supplements do not assert that their products 'cure' disease, they do not fall under the category of drugs. Also, because they are derived from natural sources, many of them would be difficult to patent. I can personally say that I have benefitted from supplments such as vitamin E and whole food supplements.
 
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Glucosomine is the only supplement that I've seen pass muster. Being a creaky, aging sort myself, I take it. However, you might want to take in the lastest Scientific American article on vitamin D. It seems that the USDA recommended dosage needs to be tripled. More bikini time in the sunshine, ladies! :D
 
Yes, but then you have people telling you that sunlight is bad and you should wear sunscreen. That's interesting, because I stopped wearing sunscreen this summer, and my skin has never looked better.
 
Yes, but then you have people telling you that sunlight is bad and you should wear sunscreen. That's interesting, because I stopped wearing sunscreen this summer, and my skin has never looked better.

OK, but how old are you?

My wife and I always loved looking tan and healthy for so many years, but at 68 and 65, we could do without all the liver spots, keratoses, and the occasional basel cell carcinoma.
 
Bat Ray you are eating a high fat very unhealthy diet. At 40 to 50 you will be another statistic using blood pressure meds and all that fun stuff to stay alive. Try getting rid of all the fat in your diet and switch to veges and fruit some fish and whole grains. You will be amazed on how healthy you will become and how much energy you will have. Add regular excersize, at least an hour a day, and you will be turning heads within a year. All the women will ask how did you do it....
 
And i am so glad my wife was too busy studying to be a physican, instead of laying in the sun. At 50 her skin is smooth and beautiful, she look so good she even turns the heads of men in their 20's...which she loves.
 
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ocean,
For your information our Sexy Bat Ray is already turning heads :inlove

PS- ok Bush and Bushists are right: there is no such thing called global warming. There are just many cases of local warming in some hundreds of places on earth, but all unrelated one another. Makes sense, doesn't it? :duh
 
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I turn heads many times a day. It should be an exercise program :D

When I mentioned some of the things I eat, I did not mention all of the things. It seems that you and I are at cross-purposes, because we both wish to eat well and be healthy, and I applaud and appreciate your efforts and success. My switch to organic has actually caused an increase in the amount of fruits and vegetables that I eat. I delight in a good serving of organic squash seasoned with garlic, and the potatoes are so good that I wish birthday cakes tasted thus. There is very little refined flour in my diet anymore, and when it is there, it's because I am being social and eating with friends or family. I like to eat at least one green salad a day that consists of spring mix and ranch or raspberry walnut dressing, with fresh raspberries or sunflower seeds. I have never enjoyed apples so much as I do now. I have thought of trying other organic fruit, but the apples are so good that I don't feel like it yet. For my part, I have tried to go on low-fat diets, and they have only left me feeling empty and desperate. There was no positive effect on my energy or weight, but somehow, this latest eating style has had excellent benefits on both of those. It seems unfair to me that I should deprive myself of delicious pasta and other such foods when people in other countries are thriving on it and not having weight problems. Most amazing of all, I enjoy my food thoroughly, and I know that it will always be good, if not astonishgly so. Will it cause high blood pressure? I'm not sure. High blood pressure comes from clogged arteries, and I plan to have periodic tests to make sure my arteries are clear. Besides, I have good genetics on that count.

When I say that I do not wear sunscreen, I did not mention that I wear hats, long sleeves, and sometimes even gloves to protect myself from excessive exposure to the sun. Much of my education and work experience is outside, in the forest, and that means I have to be creative about not using sunblock. Notably, since I stopped using sunblock, some of the spots that I was beginning to get have faded and in some cases disappeared, and many of the wrinkles have smoothed out. I can't remember the last time my skin looked so good. Your wife is an intelligent lady to have avoided nuking her skin in the past. I tried to tan once, and it was a terrible experience.

I'm willing to accept that there are times when there is more than one way to achieve success, and this sure seems like one of them:)
 
BatRay the reason people in Europe can eat high fat pasta and other such food and stay healthy is that they eat little tiny portions of food. And they drink tons and tons of wine that we would classify as alcoholics. The Alcohol has the effect of stripping off the stickiness of the cholesterol in your blood stream allowing it to digest and pass through your body.
My sister in law is a French national, its amazing to watch her family eat when they come over for a visit, they drink more wine then eat food at every meal
 
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