How to start Freediving

[chlorineguy]

<Answer: There are often no indications and you are already playing dangerously with hypoxia or hypercapnia>

Wow. This was a question that nagged me while I was doing this stuff. If there's no way to tell when you would drop to a dangerous level of hypoxia, then why do it? I absolutely never want to black out doing this. It's not worth it, for me at least.

That being said, it seems like people who get up to 4, 5, and 6 minutes of held breath must be using oxygen more efficiently with training.

Is there a scientifically established "average" time of breath hold for, let's say, adult males after which hypoxia becomes dangerous? Is it simply the time after the 1st contractions?

Also I'd assume that the time before the 1st contractions is perfectly safe?

Either way, I'll try to find another trainee like me who can supervise me and vice versa.

<i am getting off my soapbox now so hope you will yake on board whats been said.>

Well, if you're preaching facts from a soapbox you can stay on it as long as you like. I appreciate it.

 

[chlorineguy]

<So, as to your training system, I'd really repeat what fcallagy wrote - find a club with serious security in place, or at least a buddy with whom you try to maximize the security in the way I described above.>

Thanks trux. I'm going to try to find a buddy here in Chicago who also does wet apnea training so that we can mutually supervise each other. I'll probably get a CPR course in too for good measure.

<When training for CO2 tolerance, it is usually safer doing shorter breath-holds or distances and progressively reducing the rest times. In this way you assure rising CO2, but still avoid hypoxia. Still, doing it alone is to be avoided.>

Here's a question. The crux of safety is primarily avoiding hypoxia induced black out right? I read another post of yours, which I totally agree with, discouraging hyperventilation which strips C02, without which you have no indicator for hypoxia.

So, my question is, do the contractions induced by C02 during breath hold actually indicate hypoxia or do they just indicate the need to release C02 via exhale? (Maybe a combination of both?)

It seems like people on this site are saying you have more O2 than you think, despite those 1st contractions, and that it's OK to push yourself beyond those contractions for a few seconds. I gather that this is how people incrementally increase their breath hold times.

That said, will you more likely avoid blackout if you do these 2 things:

1. Not hyperventilate
2. Go just beyond those 1st contractions for a few seconds; ie 10-15 sec.

<This is exactly why we always train wet statics in a shallow pool, with contact supervision (clicking by hands each other) - in this way, if someone blacks out, the reaction is practically immediate, or within a few seconds in worst.>

Good to know. I hope I can find another wet apnea trainee here in Chi-town.
The best case scenario will be if we can supervise each other.

 

[trux]

That being said, it seems like people who get up to 4, 5, and 6 minutes of held breath must be using oxygen more efficiently with training.

Yes, indeed. The clue is a strong diving reflex (bradycardia, vasoconstriction, blood shift, ... ), and maximal possible relaxation. There may be even some other physiological changes in trained organism - higher level of hematocrit / hemoglobin, and their quicker release from spleen, higher lung capacity due to more flexible ribcage and diaphragm, etc., but the above mentioned effects are crucial.

Is there a scientifically established "average" time of breath hold for, let's say, adult males after which hypoxia becomes dangerous?

It is the hypoxemia in brain that is dangerous, most of the rest of the body can work in anaerobic mode producing acid lactic for certain time, but the brain fails within seconds when without oxygen. Eric Fattah wrote about the physiological processes in brain more often here on DB, so try looking up his posts. However, you cannot scientifically predict the time needed for that level of hypoxemia in brain, because it is depending on far too many factors (see also above).

Also I'd assume that the time before the 1st contractions is perfectly safe?

Not at all. Some people do not get contractions. You may blackout without contractions or any urge to breath if you hyperventilate, or have highly alkaline blood (because of the mentioned hyperventilation, because of medicaments, because of diet, or naturally).

 

[smeyer]

Thanks to all who have contributed to this thread on begining to free dive.I live in a land-locked area and have little chance to talk to people who have any knowledge of freediving
Stephen P. Meyer
Charleston W.Va. USA

 

[ADELENELYNCH]

Hi all,

I've been out of action for a few months due to an injury but glad to be back in action now and on the board again. Nice to see a few new members too.

I finally found a buddy to train with in Singapore! I'm thinking to start my training regime again which consists of swmming underwater laps at 50m. But I don't time myself for how long a break I should have in between. Not sure if that's the right way to go, or should I train to with fixed time breaks in between?

Can anyone help us by suggesting how we may start to develop a training regime that suits us pls? We are thinking to train dynamic and static apnea in the pool.

On a sidenote, I was in philippines last week diving with whalesharks. Those moments where you dive down and swim alongside those gentle giants, make all the apnea training all worthwhile. Swooon....I'm so happy I discovered freediving as a sport.

 

[Sergiu]

Hi all,

On a sidenote, I was in philippines last week diving with whalesharks. Those moments where you dive down and swim alongside those gentle giants, make all the apnea training all worthwhile. Swooon....I'm so happy I discovered freediving as a sport.

Welcome back Adelene! Where did you swim with the big ones in Philippines? You are a lucky one, i've always dreamt of swimming along a whaleshark...

serge

 

[ADELENELYNCH]

Hi Sergiu,

I was in Donsol, in Bicol region of Philippines. Visibility wasn't great because water is full of plankton but on both days I went snorkelling there, I had lots of chances to swim alongside those beautiful creatures. They outswim me of course and most of the time, I'd give up and wait for the next one to appear.

 

[ADELENELYNCH]

Can someone help with some tips on a training program pls? I just found a training buddy so we've starting discussing training and spotting for each other. One idea we have is
1) to start with static apnea training first, doing breathhold of gradual increase to our max times.
2) Then do a few warm up laps (maybe 6 x 50m)
3) Rest 5-10mins
4) 10 x 50m apnea laps with 2 min break, departing every 2 or 3 min. 2 is a bit tough at the moment, 3 seems ok. But once we're comfortable with that, we can decrease gradually to 230, and 2' etc.

Does this sound like an ok training program? We want to gradually increase our dynamic apnea distance, which at the moment is about 50m with fins.

Thanks anyone who has tips to help. Much appreciated!

 

[popeal]

Thanks for all compliments and suggestions!!


@Lungfish:
The vacuum effect as you call it (never heard of that term) is described in the shallow water black-out section.

Thanks Akoni!
Maybe it was redundant, but i found the vacuum effect explanation a good elaboration.
Thanks for this thread it is excellent.

 

[vicens66]

Great Post!!! I see that you have Omer Millenium and Omer Bat fins as good equipment to start with. I have the Millenium Black and they appear to be really stiff is this going to be a problem????

 

[vali]

when i read this post my first thaught is to hate my country....
we are twice land than hungary and about 20.000.000 people and yet we don't have any diving pool in romania
i guess the deepest one is about 7 meters
what ashame!!!!
we don't built proffesional pools, in stead wee built football stadions....what kind of country we are?
what kind of people?
forgive my frusstration....

 

[SanderP]

Vali, take it as a good reason for traveling.

And give them a good reason to spend millions for only a handful of deep water enthusiasts. Sadly, I live in such a country myself. We don't have any pools with noticeable depth either, but luckily we have two of the most successful fin production companies in the world, hehe. (almost all of the products are exported though)

Too bad, diving without scuba gear isn't really that popular. I've seen many shocked faces when they hear that some people dive with a speargun to catch fish or others dive 100 meters with just one breath.

 

[joe123321]

I wish I had a diving pool near me I would go everyday!

 

[smaxel]

i think is wrong to spearfish while diving its almost cheating

 

[servantes22]

hi all! first post new member, and new to the sport. i always enjoy seeing how far i can swim underwater in a pool:friday . any how about a two weeks ago i could only manage about a minute, the other night i was able to do 2.02. how fast should i be expecting my times to improve with doing the o2 and co2 table? also went from 25 to about 65m in that time without fins. is this also normal gains? yes i do use a spotter(emt buddie). thanks for any info

 

[RIbum]

This is really excellent information. I have read the entire thread (I think) and I still have one question. The tables start with a ventilation period (2:30 or 2:00 depending), is this period really necessary? Technically I am going to relax and prepare to hold, but do I need to do so for 2:30, or just however long/short I need… What I mean to say is that prior to starting and going into ventilation, I have not held my breath for hours, or even days… I can understand the next ventilation period (2:15 or again 2:00), but the first??

 

[SanderP]

Imho the 2:30 intro isn't really important. Just relax and breath-up as long as you feel like and then start the hold.

 

[Akoni]

I used an intro to show that a period of relaxation is needed, this period may be different for different persons. Even for different sessions, it's all about how you feel beforehand.

 

[roof]

Hey guys,

Have read almost every post and appreciate all the great tips in here - just starting with the training tables!

I have a question about 'relaxing' while breath holding.
Since I push out with my belly when breathing deeply, my diaphragm is working hard somewhat - I find when I relax, my diaphragm joins in the party and relaxes too, pushing air up into the top part of my chest. I am under the impression it is better to keep your lungs inflated from the bottom up, so should I be letting my gut relax as well??

Cheers!

Roof

 

[Dennis77]

Hi.

I´ve just came back from the english course with Umberto Pelizzari in Sharm el Sheikh. It was absolutely amazing.

roof, you say, you push your belly out. Do you push it out with your muscles? Or, to say it in another way, can you push it out in the same kind without inhaling? Because that´s not a proper way to breathe.
Because; if you push out your belly, your organs below the diaphragm has place to expand, to move. So the pressure won´t be able to squeeze them. And it´s not true, that you can inhale more air while using this technique.

You can check it while you lay on the ground. Lay on the ground, breathe slowly through your nose. One hand lays on your chest, the other one on your belly, below the belly button. If you´re breathing the right way, your breast and your belly are not moving.

The last breath before diving; inhale in this way first, filling up the lower part of your lungs. Don´t inhale too fast. If it´s too fast, the air comes in building turbulences. You feel you´re full of air, but you aren´t. So; inhale slow, first fill up the lower parts. Then, at the end, you can fill up your upper lungs. While this the chest will move out. That´s ok. The last 20% of your inhalation you can form your lips like youre saying A and at the end O. Wait for 2-3 seconds, and you can inhale another time a bit of air. Then dive.