Looking at getting a first spear gun

[holdenv8ute1]

Hi
I have a hand spear and I am looking at upgrading to a spear gun. I am 14 and was wondering what size I should get? I'm 165cm tall. I don't want a little 40cm one, my friend said get one at least 1m.
Here are some I was looking at
http://www.spearfishing.com.au/gear/product/JBL_Super_Carbine_Speargun
http://www.spearfishing.com.au/gear/product/Beuchat_Marlin_Rail_Spear_Gun_Spearfishing
http://www.spearfishing.com.au/gear/product/Beuchat_Mundial_Competition_Speargun__100cm

 

[Diving Gecko]

Hi Holden and welcome,
I am sure others will tell you the same, but I might as well start the game.
It's not really about your own size. You should be able to loader longer guns. The loading is all about technique and you can always go with less powerful bands instead of choosing a shorter gun.
Rather, it's about what type of hunting you'll be doing and especially your visibility. The guys in eg. England and Scandinavia tend to use shorter guns, perhaps 75-90cm where as people with good viz often think 1.10 is kinda a minimum length gun. Shorter guns will maneuver faster and are good on the reef, where fish are more skittish and generally smaller. Bigger guns are good for blue water pelagics that are bigger and need more power and sometimes range.
Check what the guys in your area of spearing are using and then get something like that. And you'll get used to your gun really fast so don't think that you have to start on a small one and then move up. Not unless, you know that you can find use for that smaller gun in other ways (eg. if you have a season with bad visibility).

All best,
David

 

[holdenv8ute1]

Ok thanks for that, I will ask my mates what guns they have or what size more importantly.
Would double 16mm bands be easier to pull back than a 20mm band?
I saw they mako speargun they look awesome and so cheap but they don't ship to my country.
Thanks

 

[Diving Gecko]

Actually, I shoot pneumatic guns myself, so this is not first hand experience, but someone is going to set me straight if need be
Yes, two 16mm bands will be less hard to load than one 20mm band. It will take a little longer but no biggie. Also, it gives you the option to use the same gun just loaded with one band if, let's say, at the end of the day you are hunting on shallow reefs with a lot of rocks. This way, you can protect your spear a bit more from impact.
But not all guns can take double 16mm bands - some guns have muzzles which can only take one band. And some guns don't take well to either a single 20mm band or double 16mm bands as they will flex the gun or bend the spear upon shooting and lead to inaccurate shooting. I guess a lot of guys would say that to have an accurate gun with that much power in the bands, you need a rail gun. Non-rail guns have space under the spear (between the spear and the barrel) and strong bands can bend the spear towards the barrel when firing and the spear will whip about a bit in its path. In rail guns the spear will lie flat on the rail and can take more force and also, the rail itself, if it is integrated, will add strength to the barrel. Makos and Rob Allens are often mentioned as good rail guns, I am sure there are more.
But yeah, ask around a bit more and maybe look for something proven second hand in your area. You'll ding and beat up your gun anyways and the fish don't care if it is new or old

 

[holdenv8ute1]

Hi again have been looking out for spearguns, mate has a palaj venom railgun he got for $50 from a pawn shop.
Found this gun, I would happily pay this much for a rail gun
Phantom Rail Spearguns I Speargun
It has a 16mm band but I'm not sure if I would be able to load it. It can fit another band as well.
Thanks

 

[Diving Gecko]

Yeah, the Pelajs have an interesting story. I think the company is dead now. Supposedly, someone was buying it to relaunch it but I am not sure it ever happened. They had trouble with the trigger mech on some early models and people complained that the handle had an angle which put strain on the wrist, but that was sorted in later models and they offered free replacement handles for a while. The rest of the gun looks as OK as any other railgun and personally, I actually looked into getting a second hand one myself but wasn't sure what trigger mech was in it or whether I could still get the replacement. If you can get the replacement for free still and you found a cheap ass gun, that could be a good option. They are supposedly sturdy and powerful. I have even come across one online that had a Cressi handle installed instead.

Dunno the Phantoms at all. Maybe others do. I notice that you are looking at $ 220 for a 120cm gun. There must be spearos in your area you can ask. Maybe say that you have app. $ 200 to spare. If you are lucky, someone will have a gun they don't use and would like to set you up properly.

D.

 

[holdenv8ute1]

Ok I'm 14 so I don't know any adults who have lots of guns just friends from school have have 1 each. One of my friends dad got a rob Allen 120 with double 16mm bands and he said (the kid) that he can just put them back. The phantom looks like a great gun to me. I might need smaller bands though that's the only thing. It comes with 1 16mm band but maybe I could have 2 14mm or even 1 of each 14mm and 16mm?
Thanks

 

[Diving Gecko]

You don't have Craigslist or something similar - or a spearo club in your area? I have found spearos to be a helpful bunch despite age differences and what not.
Otherwise, another way of adjusting how much force is needed to load is to make the bands a little longer. But maybe it wouldn't be smart to have to start out with buying new bands.
Give it a few more days to see if people chip in on the Phantom gun. Also, ask around to figure out what length you need for your area.
Btw, if you can load one 16mm, you can load two of them, so even though you can mix different thicknesses, I don't think it makes sense in this case.

D.

 

[holdenv8ute1]

Ok thanks for that, I don't think there is any clubs or anything but I'll have a look. If I go to a shop and try pulling back the band that is 16mm on say a 110cm gun will it be similar to the one I'm buying?
How do you make them longer?
Thanks

 

[Mr. X]

...
Would double 16mm bands be easier to pull back than a 20mm band?
I saw they mako speargun they look awesome and so cheap but they don't ship to my country.
Thanks

Yes and a single 16mm would be simpler to deal with, especially when just starting out. Folk usually over-estimate the importance of power and under-estimate most other factors.

You mention being 165cm, which is about 5' 5" - probably normal size for your age rather than unusually large. I think a big, long, heavy railgun might be a bit much for you - my son is 16 probably about your size, slender but strong and I wouldn't dream of giving him my old RA90 to use (with single 16mm or 20mm rubber), too big/bulky/heavy/powerful/hard to load - it might put him off unnecessarily. On the other hand, I expect it can be done, small adults (male & female) are somehow able to load even the longest railguns (140cm-160cm, gulp). And you'll be able to "grow into it". Ironically, like axes, it is generally held that longer models are safer to use (I guess it would be hard to shoot yourself with 160cm railgun).

Unlike you, I spear murky, low-viz UK seas. I started off with a 90cm railgun but have since down-sized to a much smaller, lighter 75cm gun and much prefer it, for almost all condition (never expected that). It makes walk-ins easier and more discreet, it is easier to handle in the water especially in strong currents. The big railgun dominated everything but I hardly notice the slender Omer XXV, it's more like an extension of me or just another piece of the system.

The main thing is to match the barrel/spear length to the visibility. Sumora offer a chart which seems a reasonable guide to me: sumora, official distributors of Rabitech and Rob Allen. I would "guesstimate" 110-120cm for New South Wales reefs, which I assume has beautiful gin clear waters.

Also, remember that you can always sell a decent speargun if you find you'd prefer something different later. Also, if you start with a shorter speargun and find you prefer something longer later - you might well decide to keep the smaller gun for: poor viz conditions, reefs/wrecks, guests, spares/back-up...or kill shots for those really big fish .

Hey...
[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jmg86CRBBtw]Hill Street Blues - 'Let's be careful out there' - YouTube[/ame]

 

[holdenv8ute1]

Just measured my dad's gun the Barral length was 58cm only just realised how big a 110cm would be.
It has one 20mm band on it I can't pull all the way back

 

[hteas]

Among other possibilities, you can start with bands longer than normally used for a gun. That will help with the loading. They can be shortened or replaced as necessary.
Also, 14 mm bands are easier than 16 mm bands.I have an RA 110 with 2 x 14 mm bands that works really well in Hawaii. More power than a 20 mm band, and I can use 1 band for small fish on reefs, where a shot going all the way through a fish (or a miss) may hit a reef with substantial force (bad for the tip)

 

[holdenv8ute1]

Yeah I think I'd get twin 14mm bands. I did not realise how big a 1200 gun was until I went in the shop yesterday and saw one. Maybe I should only get 1000 that's still big.
Thanks

 

[holdenv8ute1]

I really like this speargun
Phantom Rail Spearguns I Speargun
It's a rail gun and it is very cheap, I found a 100cm model on sale for $150 down from $220.
100cm is the whole gun I found out, it has a 70cm Barral which is probably a good size for Me.
Thanks

 

[LondonPoleSpear]

Im 14 and 5'' 10' and my friend recently picked up a Riffe Padauk which comes with twin 14mm bands (I think). He has the 33inch version which seems a great length for our crap UK vis but having never tried to pull back any form of band before they were way harder than I expected. Judging by that if you have good technique then 16mm wouldnt be too hard.

 

[Mr. X]

2x14mm is quite a interesting idea. Actually 1x14mm might be enough to start with. I expect you could load a 1x16mm - you don't have to be able to hold the band in the load position for long, it can be a momentary thing (like focusing in martial arts, gradually tense everything up then focus fully everything into full effort for the moment of loading) but it should be done under control.

Bands & configurations can vary greatly. Length, type, age are all factors. My current 75cm speargun is very easy to load, it still has the original 18mm Omer screw-in bands that are several years old now. My RA90 with 20mm bands wasn't too bad after the bands had aged 2 or 3 years. However it was hard to load with new bulk rubber band, even with a new 16mm band and it was downright painful with a brand new 20mm bulk rubber band (SpearItCo.com sell very fresh rubber ).

Yes, spearguns can be much bigger than you expect. I was shocked when I first saw how big my RA90 was - it is much longer than 90cm because you need to add the length of the handle/trigger mech, muzzle and spear overhang (40cm).

 

[holdenv8ute1]

Pretty sure I'm going to get one of these guns
Phantom Rail Spearguns I Speargun
Are they any good? It's a rail gun, I'll probably end up with 2x16mm rubbers.
Thanks

 

[OTGav]

Hey mate,

Before you buy - join a club. There are a bunch in NSW and they will def help you out with all kinds of good local knowledge.

A good place to start is by contacting these guys :- USFA Inc. | Underwater Skindivers & Fishermen's Association Inc. or Spearfishing

1st one is a bit more NSW focused. They will help you find a local club.

Would be good to read their safe spearfishing stuff while you are there.

As for gun - take the people in the club's advice and see what they & other juniors are using for the areas you are diving. My guess is you'll end up being advised to get a 90 to1.2cm single rubber ally pipe gun - RA or Edge are very popular options, can adjust rubber to suit your arms.

More importantly, before you get your gun - get your float and float line sorted.

Much more important than brand or size of gun is being seen in the water and learning safe dive practices (buddy, always buddy) - club will fix you up on how and why for all this stuff.

If you are looking to browse lots of Aus guns then google Adreno, they have a big range - but there will be local option for buying face to face - and much better chance of getting honest 2nd hand deals from a club.

Hope that this gets to you in time - even if you have already bought a gun, get in touch with a local club.

 

[*yadunnoeaeron*]

Wagwam,
Im the guy who Just bought the Riffe padauk 33".
I was looking at an RA for my 1st gun but....I read some reviews about misfires ect. And decided to go with a cheap (Riffe Cheap, so quite expensive for what it was) Riffe 33" which appeared perfect. I am upgrading to twin RA's 16mm, just to get about 3m range. Its a nice wood but sadly it sinks so float line will be required to ensure I dont loose it. I got it from america for about £170, I WOULD NOT RECOMMEND IT THOUGH. American Shafts are a pain in the A** to find, And end up costing a fortune to ship. Currently I am saving up for an Uusub 150 mid handle for all my tropical endeavors. Youre first gun you will probably always keep with you to help you when hole hunting in tropical waters on holiday SO DONT TRASH IT!!

 

[Salt&Pepper]

Hey guys im new here and im looking for a speargun.Im 14 and im looking around 40-50 cm what would be better?